Anybody use Linux? For old hardware, which distro?

U

unruh

But that's the problem--I asked whether the Acer $300 machine loaded
with Linpus Linux would work, and got conflicting answers, including
one that said it might work for 5 years at most.

I think most would say that any linux will only work for 5 years at
most, as will most other OS. Not that it will not run after 5 years(
assuming the hardware still works) but that so many security issues will
have cropped up that it is dangerous to use it. Of course many still run
Windows 95. And many also are infected by viruses, trojans and other
nasties, and are a danger on the web. But they run.
 
M

Mike Easter

unruh said:
I think most would say that any linux will only work for 5 years at
most, as will most other OS. Not that it will not run after 5 years(
assuming the hardware still works) but that so many security issues will
have cropped up that it is dangerous to use it.

Give some examples of serious or problematic linux security issues that
would cause it to be 'dangerous' to run some 5 year old linux distro today.

That would be - name some mid-2005 linux distro security risks.
 
T

The Natural Philosopher

unruh said:
I think most would say that any linux will only work for 5 years at
most, as will most other OS. Not that it will not run after 5 years(
assuming the hardware still works) but that so many security issues will
have cropped up that it is dangerous to use it. Of course many still run
Windows 95. And many also are infected by viruses, trojans and other
nasties, and are a danger on the web. But they run.

Linux wise, thats relative bollocks.

Linux will run forever, as will any system that's not mucked around with
too much.

The issue is the hard drive or motherboard dies, and the new one wont
run the old code, because the board didn't exist when the software was
written..

I know plenty of 20 year old machines running 20 year old code..a friend
collects eem. SUNOS 3, original Vaxen and PDP's..os/9 maccs. RISC-OS,
OS/2 - he's got em all.

the oldest machine I ever saw in regular service was an IBM 360. Covered
in glue, in the corner of a bookbinding factory. 21 years old, and they
were STARTING to put the old code on a new AIX machine. which based on a
a PC was more powerful than the old 360, the size of a chest freezer.

The reason you upgrade is not because the SOFTWARE stops working. Its
because the hardware does, or something you want to do is no longer
possible on the old software.
 
R

RayLopez99

I think most would say that any linux will only work for 5 years at
most, as will most other OS. Not that it will not run after 5 years(
assuming the hardware still works) but that so many security issues will
have cropped up that it is dangerous to use it. Of course many still run
Windows 95. And many also are infected by viruses, trojans and other
nasties, and are a danger on the web. But they run.

Thanks. So you claim (and it may be true, though it seems to
contradict the Linux propaganda) even Linux runs security risks after
five years, unless you upgrade the kernel? Interesting....

RL
 
R

RayLopez99

Give some examples of serious or problematic linux security issues that
would cause it to be 'dangerous' to run some 5 year old linux distro today.

That would be - name some mid-2005 linux distro security risks.

No I think he's saying a kernel not updated from mid-2005 would run
risks TODAY. That must be true, since the Linux.org whatever comes
out with 'critical' security patches every so often--one last December
and one recently as I recall. Whether or not such security risks in
Linux are "serious" for the "average" user is another question (I
suspect they are not serious risks for most Linux users, since frankly
no hacker worth their salt wastes time writing viruses for Linux, with
its 1% market share).

RL

PS--Took your advice and am downloading Puppy Linux to install on an
old Pentium I/II...see my other thread.
 
T

The Natural Philosopher

RayLopez99 said:
Thanks. So you claim (and it may be true, though it seems to
contradict the Linux propaganda) even Linux runs security risks after
five years, unless you upgrade the kernel? Interesting....

RL
No, boring really.

since no one is going to leave a 7 year old system live on an
unprotected and firewalled internet.
 
M

Mike Easter

RayLopez99 said:
Mike Easter
PS--Took your advice and am downloading Puppy Linux to install on an
old Pentium I/II...see my other thread.

I have a system here with a modem card. XP calls it PCTel HSP56 MR
Data/Fax/Voice/SpeakerPhone. I don't think I have used it for XP
faxing, but maybe I have.

I booted the Puppy 4.2.1 which I've had for some time to see what it
would think about that modem (even tho' that box has an integrated
ethernet as well as a wireless card).

Puppy's 'top' dial tool is PupDial. It immediately recognized the modem
and queried it and determined an initialization string.

Then it provided me with some fields to populate for an internet connxn.
It so happens that I have access to a dialup account, so I provided
that and pupdialer dialed up, fed the user/pass while giving me a
printout of the log of the transactions.

I connected and browsed at dialup speeds. That was all fine -- dialup
isn't fast.
 
R

RayLopez99

I have a system here with a modem card.  XP calls it PCTel HSP56 MR
Data/Fax/Voice/SpeakerPhone.  I don't think I have used it for XP
faxing, but maybe I have.

I booted the Puppy 4.2.1 which I've had for some time to see what it
would think about that modem (even tho' that box has an integrated
ethernet as well as a wireless card).

Puppy's 'top' dial tool is PupDial.  It immediately recognized the modem
and queried it and determined an initialization string.

Then it provided me with some fields to populate for an internet connxn.
  It so happens that I have access to a dialup account, so I provided
that and pupdialer dialed up, fed the user/pass while giving me a
printout of the log of the transactions.

I connected and browsed at dialup speeds.  That was all fine -- dialup
isn't fast.

Thanks I bookmarked this for future reference....right now, as I point
out in another thread:http://groups.google.com/group/
comp.os.linux.setup/browse_thread/thread/a120b43acb958956?hl=en#

I'm having problems getting my mouse recognized by Puppy Linux...I'll
get a USB mouse tomm. and try some more

RL
 
S

Sjouke Burry

RayLopez99 said:
Thanks I bookmarked this for future reference....right now, as I point
out in another thread:http://groups.google.com/group/
comp.os.linux.setup/browse_thread/thread/a120b43acb958956?hl=en#

I'm having problems getting my mouse recognized by Puppy Linux...I'll
get a USB mouse tomm. and try some more

RL
Downloaded puppy, Had some trouble to to tell it the ethernet
configuration, after that , it worked...... Sort of.
It takes 3-4 minutes to start, an appears to hang in some places,
but that is just to fool you.
Besides the speed, I dont like the amount of questions to answer
at each boot.
 
R

RayLopez99

Downloaded puppy, Had some trouble to to tell it the ethernet
configuration, after that , it worked...... Sort of.
It takes 3-4 minutes to start, an appears to hang in some places,
but that is just to fool you.
Besides the speed, I dont like the amount of questions to answer
at each boot.

Sounds reasonable. Linux is hobbyware after all. But even if I can
get Linux to work as badly as you say it is, it will be worth if for
this machine, which is old and only a non-power user who only checks
email once a day will use. Perfect for her.

RL
 
M

Mike Easter

Sjouke said:
Besides the speed, I dont like the amount of questions to answer
at each boot.

When/If you boot puppy from the live CD, when you prepare to shutdown,
you are provided with options to save your personal settings and files
to hdd, zip, usb, floppy. The hdd can be any partition, any kind of
format including NTFS.

The saved file, pup_save.2fs has a ext2 filesystem inside of it.

Naturally if you choose to shutdown without saving anything, then puppy
has to start from scratch (so to speak :) when it is booted again.

If you install puppy on something, then it will be more pre-rigged than
a live CD.
 
R

RayLopez99

When/If you boot puppy from the live CD, when you prepare to shutdown,
you are provided with options to save your personal settings and files
to hdd, zip, usb, floppy.  The hdd can be any partition, any kind of
format including NTFS.

The saved file, pup_save.2fs has a ext2 filesystem inside of it.

Naturally if you choose to shutdown without saving anything, then puppy
has to start from scratch (so to speak :) when it is booted again.

If you install puppy on something, then it will be more pre-rigged than
a live CD.

Mike: for now I'm sticking with DSL...but I'll keep you posted if it
doesn't work. Tx for your help so far.

Ray

Just an update: I don't badmouth things unless they are usually
really bad, unless I'm just trolling, in which case anybody with half
a brain can figure out when that is. Obviously this is not one of
those times.

Just finally *did* get the damn mouse recognized by DSL--when I bought
a USB mouse. Amazing. Now I'm in the GUI, and they even have a
dialup modem 'wizard' of sorts, though it does not use mouse commands,
you have to tab and use the space key to switch between options shown
in the window, but I can live with that if it works. I'm not
optimistic I can surf the net through DSL, but we'll see. Firebox
also 'works' (loads).

To be continued...
RL
 
M

Mike Easter

RayLopez99 wrote:
User-Agent: G2/1.0
Mike Easter

When you post with GG, you have to do things like sig trimming manually.
That is, while you are trimming, which you should do instead of bottom
posting untrimmed, you should also trim the sig.
Mike: for now I'm sticking with DSL...but I'll keep you posted if it
doesn't work. Tx for your help so far.

DSL is fine. IMO it is a very different distro from Puppy. The two are
only similar in that they are light distros. Puppy's developer has a
different idea of where he is going than DSL's does.
Just an update: I don't badmouth things unless they are usually
really bad, unless I'm just trolling, in which case anybody with half
a brain can figure out when that is. Obviously this is not one of
those times.

However; you are very prone to be using old and b0rken/erratic hardware
which doesn't run anything worth a sh*t *INCLUDING* any kind of windows.
Then, when you are struggling with the hardware, you tend to blame -
badmouth - whichever linux you are messing with and linux in general.

I have old/bad hardware like that, so I know. Typically I run linux and
win 98 on ancient hardware; linux and WinXP on less ancient.

If you are genuinely interested in using linux, you should rig up some
dual boots where you are using linux and windows on similar hardware, as
I described above, not just old b0rken stuff. New hardware with
Vista/Win7 and a linux or two. Older/ Less new/ hardware with XP and a
linux or two. Really old hardware with W98 and a linux like DSL or
Puppy or Vector or other light distros.

You are creating ugly adverse hardware situations and then badmouthing
linux when/because you don't have any linux skills like how to get out
of situations with the commandline. That creates a very
adverse/difficult environment and it is going to get in the way of your
learning some linux things which would be valuable.

There are a lot of linux helpers who are maestros with the commandline
for fixing things. There are other helpers who are less skilled with
commandline solutions but are linux-skilled with graphical solutions.

It is especially nice when someone is helping you who is familiar with
both and can give you a quick answer in the form of a commandline or an
awkward long answer in the form of a graphical tool solution.

However, your approach to this linux issue alienates a lot of linux
helpers who surely consider you to be a total troll which is what a
great deal of your posting history consists of.
you have to tab and use the space key to switch between options shown
in the window,

You act like that tabbing requirement is important - a handicap - or
something.
but I can live with that if it works. I'm not
optimistic I can surf the net through DSL, but we'll see.

It sounds like you are confusing/saying DSL broadband with/ instead of/
dialup not broadband.
 
R

RayLopez99

When/If you boot puppy from the live CD, when you prepare to shutdown,
you are provided with options to save your personal settings and files
to hdd, zip, usb, floppy.  The hdd can be any partition, any kind of
format including NTFS.

The saved file, pup_save.2fs has a ext2 filesystem inside of it.

Naturally if you choose to shutdown without saving anything, then puppy
has to start from scratch (so to speak :) when it is booted again.

If you install puppy on something, then it will be more pre-rigged than
a live CD.

Thanks for that. Now, if and when I get DSL Linux to work with my
dialup modem (I found a 'pay by the minute'--9 cents USD a minute--
site here in Athens, GR to test it on), the real question will be: DSL
or Puppy Linux for this old system? I hate to get rid of DSL-which
has some variant of Firefox on it--if it works..."if it ain't broke
don't fix it". But let's see if it works first...

RL
 
M

Mike Easter

RayLopez99 said:
But if it works, I'll be "pleasantly surprised" in the same
way you're "pleasantly surprised" if you don't get food poisoning
after eating at a run-down greasy spoon interstate diner.

TrollTrashTalk
 
M

Mike Easter


You are still bottom posting untrimmed.
DSL
or Puppy Linux for this old system? I hate to get rid of DSL-which
has some variant of Firefox on it--if it works..."if it ain't broke
don't fix it". But let's see if it works first...

The newest puppy I have is 4.3.1 which was released 2009 Oct and default
installed browser was SeaMonkey 1.1.18 which is a Moz Gecko 2009 Sep
engine. The current puppy is 5.0.1 which gives a choice of 4 browsers,
Firefox, SeaMonkey, Chromium, and Opera - one click install.

If you want to/ don't/ know the relationship between SeaMonkey and
Firefox you can look it up.

DSL last release was 2008 Nov and it carried Firefox 2.0 -- which Fx is
now at 3.6.3

It is not at all difficult to add applications to either DSL or Puppy.
 
M

Mike Easter

Mike said:
The newest puppy I have is 4.3.1
The current puppy is 5.0.1

I just burned and booted Puppy 5.0.1 - lucid puppy - and it is the best
so far. Lots of information; lot of connection options ease. Lots of
browsers. And staying with Barry's philosophy.

Click on the browser icon and it gives you a choice of 5; firefox,
seamonkey, chromium, and puppy's - and/but it advises you to get online
first.

Click the connect icon and it reports the current status, recognizing on
my hardware a dialup modem, an available ethernet, and options for
connecting by wired or wireless which advances you to a choice of a
network wizard or a simple Barry network tool.

Bravo puppy. I was afraid that engaging Ub would be 'disruptive' to the
previous goals, but it wasn't/didn't.
 

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