Always a fly in the ointment ... RATS!


S

singha_lvr

It takes me weeks to pick out the perfect video card. Twice now I've
gotten burned.

First: I buy a Connect3d Radeon 9600. This was the first video card
I've had in some time without a fan. Needless to say it overheats and
causes artifacts (and crashes). (No overclocking!) Ok ... that's a
goner.

Now: I finally decide to replace it with an All-In-Wonder (AIW) 9600
Pro.

I go to the store (I'll even pay retail -- go figure) and I find out
that this is The FIRST high-end card I've seen that does not have a
DVI output!! RATS!! (It has Dual VGA ... does anyone actually use
that?)

MY QUESTIONS: (Yes, I have a point)

1. Is the DVI *that* important? I have a Digital Flat Panel Monitor
with DVI Input. (NEC/Mitsubishi 18.1" if you must know).

2. Am I better off with a plain ol' ATI 9600 Pro (With DVI) and
buying the multi-media tuner later? This doesn't quite seem like as
good of a value?

3. Should I perhaps consider the AIW 8500? (This also has DVI)

Any responses would be appreciated.
 
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R

RM

I go to the store (I'll even pay retail -- go figure) and I find out
that this is The FIRST high-end card I've seen that does not have a
DVI output!! RATS!! (It has Dual VGA ... does anyone actually use
that?)
Yes I use dual 21" Sonys on my main gaming machine (9800 Pro) and dual 21"
sonys on my editing/dvd making machine (Radeon 8500). I got the monitors
from Enron's auction for $99 apiece so I cant justify LCD yet.
1. Is the DVI *that* important? I have a Digital Flat Panel Monitor
with DVI Input. (NEC/Mitsubishi 18.1" if you must know).

It is if you have it or need it. I would use it if I had a flat panel. YMMV.
2. Am I better off with a plain ol' ATI 9600 Pro (With DVI) and
buying the multi-media tuner later? This doesn't quite seem like as
good of a value?

Personally I would prefer it as a 1 card solution.
3. Should I perhaps consider the AIW 8500? (This also has DVI)

I also have a AIW 8500 DVI and would recommend it. UI dont think it does
dual monitor though. I wish I had known when I bought it. I (ass)umed all
radeons had that.
 
J

J.Clarke

It takes me weeks to pick out the perfect video card. Twice now I've
gotten burned.

First: I buy a Connect3d Radeon 9600. This was the first video card
I've had in some time without a fan. Needless to say it overheats and
causes artifacts (and crashes). (No overclocking!) Ok ... that's a
goner.

Now: I finally decide to replace it with an All-In-Wonder (AIW) 9600
Pro.

I go to the store (I'll even pay retail -- go figure) and I find out
that this is The FIRST high-end card I've seen that does not have a
DVI output!! RATS!! (It has Dual VGA ... does anyone actually use
that?)

MY QUESTIONS: (Yes, I have a point)

1. Is the DVI *that* important? I have a Digital Flat Panel Monitor
with DVI Input. (NEC/Mitsubishi 18.1" if you must know).

Depends--with some monitors you can't tell the difference unless you're
super-picky, with others it's intuitively obvious to the most casual
observer. Personally I'm of the opinion that neglecting to put a DVI on
a board that is aimed at the home theater market was a major blunder--my
HD projector works much better with DVI than with any of the other
inputs. I was all set to get a 9600AIW when I found out that there was
no DVI--finally ended up with a 9800 Pro and a Dvico Fusion instead.
2. Am I better off with a plain ol' ATI 9600 Pro (With DVI) and
buying the multi-media tuner later? This doesn't quite seem like as
good of a value?

Might not be as good value but is a more flexible solution in many
ways--the Rage Theater chips are not widely supported, while the BT8x8
and the newer Phillips and Conexant chips used on the tuner boards
(including the ATI TV-Wonders) have lots of third-party support.
3. Should I perhaps consider the AIW 8500? (This also has DVI)

If you mean the 8500DV, avoid it like the plague--the tuner is crap, the
firewire is hit-or-miss, and the connector for the TV in/out dongle is
one of the most fragile I've ever seen.
 
P

PB

singha_lvr said:
It takes me weeks to pick out the perfect video card. Twice now I've
gotten burned.

First: I buy a Connect3d Radeon 9600. This was the first video card
I've had in some time without a fan. Needless to say it overheats and
causes artifacts (and crashes). (No overclocking!) Ok ... that's a
goner.

Now: I finally decide to replace it with an All-In-Wonder (AIW) 9600
Pro.

I go to the store (I'll even pay retail -- go figure) and I find out
that this is The FIRST high-end card I've seen that does not have a
DVI output!! RATS!! (It has Dual VGA ... does anyone actually use
that?)

I'll trade you my Sapphire Radeon 9600 Pro Atlantis (atlantis = quiet fan
model) with DVI output for your dual 15-pin output, I hate LCD panels and
would love to be able to run both my monitors.
1. Is the DVI *that* important? I have a Digital Flat Panel Monitor
with DVI Input. (NEC/Mitsubishi 18.1" if you must know).

2. Am I better off with a plain ol' ATI 9600 Pro (With DVI) and
buying the multi-media tuner later? This doesn't quite seem like as
good of a value?

Do you need a tuner? When I want to watch tv, I have 5 in the house.

DD
 
S

singha_lvr

I also have a AIW 8500 DVI and would recommend it. UI dont think it does
dual monitor though. I wish I had known when I bought it. I (ass)umed all
radeons had that.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR REPLY!
(Good deal on your CRTs BTW).

How is the AIW 8500 at gaming?

I can't for the life of me understand how ATI came to the decision to
leave DVI off of the AIW 9600.
 
C

casino_boy

J.Clarke said:
Depends--with some monitors you can't tell the difference unless you're
super-picky, with others it's intuitively obvious to the most casual
observer. Personally I'm of the opinion that neglecting to put a DVI on
a board that is aimed at the home theater market was a major blunder--my
HD projector works much better with DVI than with any of the other
inputs. I was all set to get a 9600AIW when I found out that there was
no DVI--finally ended up with a 9800 Pro and a Dvico Fusion instead.


Might not be as good value but is a more flexible solution in many
ways--the Rage Theater chips are not widely supported, while the BT8x8
and the newer Phillips and Conexant chips used on the tuner boards
(including the ATI TV-Wonders) have lots of third-party support.

If you mean the 8500DV, avoid it like the plague--the tuner is crap, the
firewire is hit-or-miss, and the connector for the TV in/out dongle is
one of the most fragile I've ever seen.

--

I am one of those still deciding on the AIW 9600. My 18.1" LCD monitor
has analog and DVI. If i upgrade to an AIW 9800 i will also have to
upgrade my PSU. Basically, it will cost $200 more for the 9800. My
question is..is $200 more worth it just for the DVI?
 
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S

singha_lvr

I am one of those still deciding on the AIW 9600. My 18.1" LCD monitor
has analog and DVI. If i upgrade to an AIW 9800 i will also have to
upgrade my PSU. Basically, it will cost $200 more for the 9800. My
question is..is $200 more worth it just for the DVI?

I won't pay the extra for the 9800 AIW. If I decide not to get the
9600 AIW (due to lack of DVI) then I'll either go with an ATI non-AIW
card w/ separate board, or an nVidia/Separate board solution.
(Although I'm leaning away from nVidia)

I'm not opposed to going for the 9800 class of cards, but I'm not sure
they justify the extra cost over the 9600 (Pro/XT) line. The 9800 AIW
is way beyond what I want to spend.
 
D

Darthy

It takes me weeks to pick out the perfect video card. Twice now I've
gotten burned.

First: I buy a Connect3d Radeon 9600. This was the first video card
I've had in some time without a fan. Needless to say it overheats and
causes artifacts (and crashes). (No overclocking!) Ok ... that's a
goner.

It needs a fan.
Now: I finally decide to replace it with an All-In-Wonder (AIW) 9600
Pro.

I go to the store (I'll even pay retail -- go figure) and I find out
that this is The FIRST high-end card I've seen that does not have a
DVI output!! RATS!! (It has Dual VGA ... does anyone actually use
that?)

MY QUESTIONS: (Yes, I have a point)

1. Is the DVI *that* important? I have a Digital Flat Panel Monitor
with DVI Input. (NEC/Mitsubishi 18.1" if you must know).

uh yea! DVI on a monitor that size should look sharper! And faster
on the refresh.
2. Am I better off with a plain ol' ATI 9600 Pro (With DVI) and
buying the multi-media tuner later? This doesn't quite seem like as
good of a value?

Yes... a TV Tunner card is about $60. If you want VIVO, there's
firewire or other devices.

3. Should I perhaps consider the AIW 8500? (This also has DVI)

If you're not planning on playing modern games, then perhaps.
 
D

Darthy

I won't pay the extra for the 9800 AIW. If I decide not to get the
9600 AIW (due to lack of DVI) then I'll either go with an ATI non-AIW
card w/ separate board, or an nVidia/Separate board solution.
(Although I'm leaning away from nVidia)

I'm not opposed to going for the 9800 class of cards, but I'm not sure
they justify the extra cost over the 9600 (Pro/XT) line. The 9800 AIW
is way beyond what I want to spend.

Both of you should read this article on AIW...

ATI TVWonder card works okay... no remote thou... but I think they
have a higher end model with one.

The review below is Nvidia vs ATI media type cards.

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=1938
 
J

Julian Richards

It needs a fan.


uh yea! DVI on a monitor that size should look sharper! And faster
on the refresh.


Yes... a TV Tunner card is about $60. If you want VIVO, there's
firewire or other devices.



If you're not planning on playing modern games, then perhaps.

My thoughts are that the original poster should buy a separate capture
card. If one breaks, you don't replace everything. Likewise, you can
update the graphics card later should you wish.



--

Julian Richards
julian-richards "at" ntlworld.com

Usenet is how from the comfort of your own living room, you can converse
with people that you would never want in your house.
 
S

singha_lvr

My thoughts are that the original poster should buy a separate capture
card. If one breaks, you don't replace everything. Likewise, you can
update the graphics card later should you wish.

Thanks. That's what I ended up doing. I purchased a Radeon 9600XT.
(I considered nVidia, but I was informed that their DX9 support is
spotty)

Now I just have to pick out a capture board.
 
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D

Darthy

Thanks. That's what I ended up doing. I purchased a Radeon 9600XT.
(I considered nVidia, but I was informed that their DX9 support is
spotty)

Good.... get best of both worlds... its not that much of a savings...
And if you don't like one product... you have the flexiblity to sell
it.
 
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S

singha_lvr

Good.... get best of both worlds... its not that much of a savings...
And if you don't like one product... you have the flexiblity to sell
it.

Thanks!

I have a 9600 Non-Pro for sale now. (Well, as soon as I get a chance
to post it on e-bay) <GRIN>
 

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