P
Paul
rogergonnet said:
Virustotal says the page takes you here.
http://www.sudouest.fr/2014/03/30/l...tor=EPR-260-[Newsletter]-20140330-[zone_info]
This is a screenshot of the page in question. en francais.
http://i58.tinypic.com/30bpmi8.gif
Paul
T
Todd
My credit union says their ATM have to be fixed nearly every day.
Windows would explain a lot of things.
They should switch to Fedora Core Linux (which is
security hardened) and kiss these problems good by.
M
Mayayana
| My credit union says their ATM have to be fixed nearly every day.
| Windows would explain a lot of things.
|
| They should switch to Fedora Core Linux (which is
| security hardened) and kiss these problems good by.
|
I posted a link about that very issue last week:
https://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9247096/ATM_operators_eye_Linux_as_alternative_to_Windows_XP
Some operators of ATMs are thinking of switching
to Linux in the face of Microsoft's aggressive stance.
| Windows would explain a lot of things.
|
| They should switch to Fedora Core Linux (which is
| security hardened) and kiss these problems good by.
|
I posted a link about that very issue last week:
https://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9247096/ATM_operators_eye_Linux_as_alternative_to_Windows_XP
Some operators of ATMs are thinking of switching
to Linux in the face of Microsoft's aggressive stance.
C
casey.o
I didn't understand a word of it. IT'S IN FRENCH !!!!!!
Either way, all this hysteria over support for XP is just that.....
HYSTERIA.
It's NOT the end of the world. I still use Win98 and it still works
fine. The only disadvantage with XP, is that XP requires ACTIVATION
(Win98 didn't). But if MS shut down the activation, I'm 100% sure some
"hackers" will find a method to bypass the activation, and publish it
online. (Actually there are some methods already published about
bypassing the Activation, but I've never tried them, so I dont know if
they work or not. Either way, XP will carry on after april 8.... If
not, 350 or 400 million users will have to switch to Linux, because not
everyone wants Windows 7 or 8. I surely dont!
Personally, I dont understand why MS dont just keep supporting XP, and
for that matter, Win98. Not everyone wants all the extra bloat they add
to their newer OSs, and not everyone can afford to keep buying newer
computers to use their latest OSs. Computer users are like people
choosing food. While some prefer the best steak or lobster, or other
expensive foods, others simply prefer a hamburger diet, not to mention
the vegetarians. MS dont seem to understand we all have DIFFERENT
TASTES. They seem to think they will make more money by FORCING their
latest OS on the public, but maybe they would make more money if they
had a product to fit ALL tastes. For example, right now, I'd pay MS for
a web browser that would run under Win98, but support the latest trends
on the web (like HTML 5).
Either way, all this hysteria over support for XP is just that.....
HYSTERIA.
It's NOT the end of the world. I still use Win98 and it still works
fine. The only disadvantage with XP, is that XP requires ACTIVATION
(Win98 didn't). But if MS shut down the activation, I'm 100% sure some
"hackers" will find a method to bypass the activation, and publish it
online. (Actually there are some methods already published about
bypassing the Activation, but I've never tried them, so I dont know if
they work or not. Either way, XP will carry on after april 8.... If
not, 350 or 400 million users will have to switch to Linux, because not
everyone wants Windows 7 or 8. I surely dont!
Personally, I dont understand why MS dont just keep supporting XP, and
for that matter, Win98. Not everyone wants all the extra bloat they add
to their newer OSs, and not everyone can afford to keep buying newer
computers to use their latest OSs. Computer users are like people
choosing food. While some prefer the best steak or lobster, or other
expensive foods, others simply prefer a hamburger diet, not to mention
the vegetarians. MS dont seem to understand we all have DIFFERENT
TASTES. They seem to think they will make more money by FORCING their
latest OS on the public, but maybe they would make more money if they
had a product to fit ALL tastes. For example, right now, I'd pay MS for
a web browser that would run under Win98, but support the latest trends
on the web (like HTML 5).
G
Good Guy
There is nothing to understand here. Microsoft is running a business
not some charity to support hobbyists and enthusiasts like Linux
developers are.
C
casey.o
True, but if a business does not satisfy consumer wants and needs, they
will fail. Even the huge MS monopoly could fail if they stop tending to
the needs of their customers. Of all the people I know who use
computers, only 1 in 10 have gone beyond XP. Most of them say they dont
want a newer OS and are happy with what they have.
Some people think soy burgers are healthier than meat. If McDonalds
started selling soy burgers, they would likely make sales. But if they
switched to ALL soy burgers, they would likely go out of business in a
year.
A business can only make money, if they satisfy the wants and needs of
the consumers. In this case, it's not just a matter of tastes, but it's
also costly to have to buy a new computer every 3 years. Personally, I
have no intention to do that. I have a computer that works, I'd rather
spend the money on other wants and needs.
M
Metspitzer
Plus every computer that switches have a learning curve. Something
simple like moving "show desktop" from one side of the taskbar to the
other and then camouflaging it is one of hundreds of frustrations each
user will have to go through.
Maybe they should add a "dislike" button just to see what the total
would be.
C
casey.o
Tell me about it. I've used Win98 for so long, that I find XP to be a
real challenge. Just simple shit will confuse me, for example, to find
files in 98, open START and click "FIND" In XP it's called SEARCH. I
know that, but I'm so used to using Find, it takes me twice as long to
think about what to do. I'll get used to XP, but I sure dont want to
upgrade again. This is also the reason I dont see myself switching to
Linux. Not only is the OS totally foreign to me, but I'd have to
relearn every program. About the only programs thast Linux has, that
are about the same are browsers like Firefox and Seamonkey. I would not
have Agent for newsgroups, Paint Shop Pro, and many other programs I use
all the time. Even Agent changed too much since I first used it, which
is why I stick with ver 2.x. I always say, "If it aint broke. dont fix
it". I've been happy running Win98 and my old programs all along, but
W98 has become "broken" due to a lack of any browser that works properly
since they went to Html 5. So, it's time to at least get XP working for
websites. I can still use W98 for everyting else.
M
Mayayana
| I've been happy running Win98 and my old programs all along, but
| W98 has become "broken" due to a lack of any browser that works properly
| since they went to Html 5. So, it's time to at least get XP working for
| websites. I can still use W98 for everyting else.
|
I can sympathize. I kept Win98 going for a long
time myself. But XP does have it's good points.
On the one hand it's a bit bloated and overproduced.
It's about 50% bigger than Win98. But those things
can be improved, somewhat. And it's not nearly
as bad as Vista/7. XP is also more stable and faster
than Win98 on the same hardware, as long as there's
adequate RAM.
I think the Find -> Search change was just part
of the effort to make it "webby". MS wants to present
Windows Find as integral with Web search. Personally
I find XP Find inferior to Win98 Find. It can't even look
inside a CAB file. As soon as I started using XP I
found Agent Ransack. I haven't opened the XP Find
applet ever since.
| W98 has become "broken" due to a lack of any browser that works properly
| since they went to Html 5. So, it's time to at least get XP working for
| websites. I can still use W98 for everyting else.
|
I can sympathize. I kept Win98 going for a long
time myself. But XP does have it's good points.
On the one hand it's a bit bloated and overproduced.
It's about 50% bigger than Win98. But those things
can be improved, somewhat. And it's not nearly
as bad as Vista/7. XP is also more stable and faster
than Win98 on the same hardware, as long as there's
adequate RAM.
I think the Find -> Search change was just part
of the effort to make it "webby". MS wants to present
Windows Find as integral with Web search. Personally
I find XP Find inferior to Win98 Find. It can't even look
inside a CAB file. As soon as I started using XP I
found Agent Ransack. I haven't opened the XP Find
applet ever since.
T
Todd
Hi Mayayana,
I have no idea why they used Windows for such devises to
start with. Great link.
-T
P
(PeteCresswell)
Per Todd:
Is there something in Linux's architecture? If not, I'd think that once
the number of Linux installs reached a certain number, hacker man-hours
would start being devoted to it.
Is there something in Linux's architecture? If not, I'd think that once
the number of Linux installs reached a certain number, hacker man-hours
would start being devoted to it.
P
(PeteCresswell)
Per Metspitzer:
I call it "moving the furniture around".
And still have not heard a plausible business reason why Microsoft does
this. On the contrary, I would expect a "furniture" committee within
MS to which each change has to be justified on functional grounds.
I don't doubt there is a reason.... just haven't heard it yet.
I call it "moving the furniture around".
And still have not heard a plausible business reason why Microsoft does
this. On the contrary, I would expect a "furniture" committee within
MS to which each change has to be justified on functional grounds.
I don't doubt there is a reason.... just haven't heard it yet.
T
Todd
Yes there is. Fedora Linux is security hardened and
is supported by Red Hat: no M$ B*** S***. Red Hat
is a imperiously professional company.
It is also open source, meaning you have access to the
source code. (And, if you do something stupid, you get
made fun of all over the web.) If you find a bug
and/or security error, it is taken very seriously
and address in a matter of days, instead of years.
(Remember the Blaster Virus that M$ only address ONLY
after someone looked it up on a list of known exploits
that M$ did not address and wrote a virus for it?)
Plus it runs 40% faster on the same hardware than XP, so
no need upgrade your hardware that already runs fast enough
on XP.
Here is part of the security built into Fedora:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selinux
"NSA Security-enhanced Linux is a set of patches to
the Linux kernel and some utilities to incorporate a
strong, flexible mandatory access control (MAC)
architecture into the major subsystems of the kernel.
It provides an enhanced mechanism to enforce the
separation of information based on confidentiality
and integrity requirements, which allows threats of
tampering and bypassing of application security mechanisms
to be addressed and enables the confinement of damage
that can be caused by malicious or flawed applications.
It includes a set of sample security policy configuration
files designed to meet common, general-purpose security
goals."
And upgrading versions of Fedora is not a problem either. You
run four or so lines of code and just wait 30 to 90 minutes
depending on your Internet connection speed and reboot once.
That is it. Your main concern is falling asleep in front of
the customer. No wipe and reinstall, like XP to Vista/W7/W8.
And Linux doesn't crash like Windows. It also journels
out bad sports on your hard drive and masks out bad
spots in your memory. Ideal for an ATM machines at
remote locations you don't want to constantly fuss with.
The only way to crash Linux is to kick it over, pour
coffee down it, or a huge power spike. Windows, on the
other hand, needs to be rebooted once a day to stay
somewhat reliable. Not fun on a remote location. There
is a reason why the International Space Station dumped
Windows for Linux.
The only draw back to Linux is that there are not a lot
of "off the shelf" applications out there for it. In
the case of ATM machines, it is custom software, so
not a draw back at all.
Technically speaking, Linux wipes Windows face in the
dirt it is so much better. Where Windows wipes Linux's
face in the direct is the "off the shelf" applications.
In this instance, not a problem.
High security, high performance, high reliability,
open source: perfect for an ATM.
If you can get away from the "off the shelf" software
problem -- few can't -- then better for you too.
And you are correct about the "hacker man-hours". The
reason why M$ has such a problem is that they are
SLOPPY when it comes to security. They really don't
care, as demonstrated by the Blaster virus. Hackers
are looking for "Low Hanging Fruit". On Fedora,
with an Selinux enabled system, GOOD LUCK WITH THAT.
Never say never, but really, really difficult. There
will be too many Windows machines out there that
are far too easy to hack for the bad guys to waste
their time on fruit at the top of the tree.
I will shut up now.
-T
P
Paul
(PeteCresswell) said:
We wouldn't know until the problems start showing up.
Paul
T
Todd
Hi Paul,
It is about low hanging fruit. M$ is SLOPPY
security wise. Linux is not. The bad guys
will go after what is easiest first. They
will stay away from the fruit at the top of
the tree. But, never say never.
There are so many IDIOTS out there with Windows
based Point Of Sale systems that the bad guys
won't even give Linux a second look, especially
ones with Selinux compliant applications.
-T
P
(PeteCresswell)
Per Todd:
Before MS got in to home LANs, I ran something from Novell.
The words of wisdom that I heard were to the effect of: "If Novell goes
down, just start looking for the hardware failure.... period."
Before MS got in to home LANs, I ran something from Novell.
The words of wisdom that I heard were to the effect of: "If Novell goes
down, just start looking for the hardware failure.... period."
T
Todd
Hi Pete,
I use to work on them things too. Very, very
stable.
NT killed the ass with their easy to use GUI.
Netware never did get that their stuff was
unnecessarily difficult to use. NT was
not technically superior. Just easier to
configure.
Use to work on OS/2 also. I liked that one.
Ran Windows programs much faster and more stable
than Windows. IBM were such idiots that they
killed it off. Sad to see it go.
-T
P
(PeteCresswell)
Per Todd:
Last place where I had a "real" job they pushed OS/2 and token-ring
hard.
Everybody really technical that I knew loved it for what was under the
hood.
Personally, I did not like it at all because the UI was, IMHO, poorly
done and I never went deep enough to appreciate the underlying quality.
Stuff like the same action having different consequences depending on
context. At one of the IBM presentations, somebody said that the OS/2
UI was written in something under a week by one of their resident
geniuses. Remarkable feat... but it showed in the quality.
Last place where I had a "real" job they pushed OS/2 and token-ring
hard.
Everybody really technical that I knew loved it for what was under the
hood.
Personally, I did not like it at all because the UI was, IMHO, poorly
done and I never went deep enough to appreciate the underlying quality.
Stuff like the same action having different consequences depending on
context. At one of the IBM presentations, somebody said that the OS/2
UI was written in something under a week by one of their resident
geniuses. Remarkable feat... but it showed in the quality.
J
J. P. Gilliver (John)
In message <[email protected]>,
That's the key word - "customers". In any normal business, that means
people who buy things. Not people who bought something 13 years ago; not
people who bought something two to five years ago second-hand, which
benefits the original seller not one jot; ...
Oh, they do - and are showing no signs of failing.
So not customers.
[]
The _paying_ consumers.
That's the key word - "customers". In any normal business, that means
people who buy things. Not people who bought something 13 years ago; not
people who bought something two to five years ago second-hand, which
benefits the original seller not one jot; ...
Oh, they do - and are showing no signs of failing.
So not customers.
[]
The _paying_ consumers.