48-bit LBA Support - HDs Over 137GB - Advice?

R

Rob Jones

Hi I'm planning to upgrade to a 160GB HD however, I have read some info
about recognition issues with MBs and XP. It appears that older MBs pre Jan
1st 2003 do not have support for 48-bit LBA. XP will only read 137GB, no
more.

To be honest I cant remember when I bought mine but according to a list of
Bios support for my MB (Asus A7N8X Deluxe) the Bios needed for the 48-bit
LBA Support is 1001.C. Sandra Pro 2003 stated my Bios as:

Asus A7N8X2.0 Deluxe ACPI Rev 1002 Beta 012
Plug and Play version 1.00
SMbios/DMI Version 2.20

So am I in need of an update? To be honest, I would rather avoid updating
the bios as I have never updated them and cant afford to replace the MB
right now if it all goes pear shaped.

Alternatively, I have been reading the Microsoft knowledge base about SP-1
and changing the registry which I would prefer as I can always re-install
Xp if it goes wrong. Would the reg fix work without a bios update?

I understand that I cant have just the one partition on the HD as I wont be
able to have a partition larger than 137GB but I partition my HDs any way
so that will suit me well.

Any advice would be most appreciated.
 
B

Ben Pope

Rob said:
Hi I'm planning to upgrade to a 160GB HD however, I have read some info
about recognition issues with MBs and XP. It appears that older MBs pre
Jan 1st 2003 do not have support for 48-bit LBA. XP will only read
137GB, no more.

I think thats on a per-partition basis, so you could create a partition
thats <128GiB, and then another for the rest of the drive (or whatever)
To be honest I cant remember when I bought mine but according to a list of
Bios support for my MB (Asus A7N8X Deluxe) the Bios needed for the 48-bit
LBA Support is 1001.C. Sandra Pro 2003 stated my Bios as:

Asus A7N8X2.0 Deluxe ACPI Rev 1002 Beta 012
Plug and Play version 1.00
SMbios/DMI Version 2.20

So am I in need of an update? To be honest, I would rather avoid updating
the bios as I have never updated them and cant afford to replace the MB
right now if it all goes pear shaped.

Thats a pretty old BIOS, I would recommend updating, but it should be new
enough according to your info.
Alternatively, I have been reading the Microsoft knowledge base about SP-1
and changing the registry which I would prefer as I can always re-install
Xp if it goes wrong. Would the reg fix work without a bios update?

Both BIOS and XP need to support 48bit addressing in order for it to work.
I understand that I cant have just the one partition on the HD as I wont
be able to have a partition larger than 137GB but I partition my HDs any
way so that will suit me well.

Fine.

Ben
 
R

Rob Jones

I think thats on a per-partition basis, so you could create a partition
thats <128GiB, and then another for the rest of the drive (or whatever)


Hi Ben, thanks for the input, I use partition Magic 8, so I can install XP
on say a 128 Gig Partition, then create more partitions using PM8 after I
have installed XP?

Thats a pretty old BIOS, I would recommend updating, but it should be new
enough according to your info.

I would love to update but I have read so many horror stories of failed
Bios updates I'm unsure about chancing it. I did read of a device call
Bios savoir a while back that claimed it could back up your bios in case of
it going wrong. Any thoughts? Is updating bios these days any safer?
 
S

Shep©

Hi I'm planning to upgrade to a 160GB HD however, I have read some info
about recognition issues with MBs and XP. It appears that older MBs pre Jan
1st 2003 do not have support for 48-bit LBA. XP will only read 137GB, no
more.

To be honest I cant remember when I bought mine but according to a list of
Bios support for my MB (Asus A7N8X Deluxe) the Bios needed for the 48-bit
LBA Support is 1001.C. Sandra Pro 2003 stated my Bios as:

Asus A7N8X2.0 Deluxe ACPI Rev 1002 Beta 012
Plug and Play version 1.00
SMbios/DMI Version 2.20

So am I in need of an update? To be honest, I would rather avoid updating
the bios as I have never updated them and cant afford to replace the MB
right now if it all goes pear shaped.

Alternatively, I have been reading the Microsoft knowledge base about SP-1
and changing the registry which I would prefer as I can always re-install
Xp if it goes wrong. Would the reg fix work without a bios update?

I understand that I cant have just the one partition on the HD as I wont be
able to have a partition larger than 137GB but I partition my HDs any way
so that will suit me well.

Any advice would be most appreciated.

Partition sizes are a limitation of the O/S.Drive sizes are a
limitation of the hardware.If the full size of the drive is not seen
by the BIOS then partitioning the drive will make no difference.There
is an update for WinXP to be able to see and partition above 137 gig
but this will not defeat a hardware limitation.Hardware limitations
can be defeated in some cases by a BIOS update but if not then a
Controller card and as a last resort as DDO(Dynamic Disk Overlay)
program usually freely available from the drive maker's site if not
already supplied with the drive.
More info here,
http://www.geocities.com/sheppola/hard.html

If there is a BIOS update and you wish to flash the BIOS then find the
correct flash program and BIOS .rom file and I'll make you a bootable
CDR/W .ISO image which is a more secure way of flashing the BIOS than
the older and less robust floppy disks.This presumes you have a CDR/W
drive.




--
Free Windows/PC help,
http://www.geocities.com/sheppola/trouble.html
email shepATpartyheld.de
Free songs download,
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/8/nomessiahsmusic.htm
 
B

Ben Pope

Rob said:
Hi Ben, thanks for the input, I use partition Magic 8, so I can install XP
on say a 128 Gig Partition, then create more partitions using PM8 after I
have installed XP?

I don;t see why not, but I think Win2K likes to format every partition, so
don;t make the other partitions until you;ve installed XP, or it might want
to format them.
I would love to update but I have read so many horror stories of failed
Bios updates I'm unsure about chancing it. I did read of a device call
Bios savoir a while back that claimed it could back up your bios in case
of it going wrong. Any thoughts? Is updating bios these days any safer?

It's not too bad, usully there is a bootloader section that is not usually
flashed, allows you to flash a new BIOS even if part of it is corrupted.

It's still easy to FUBAR the motherboard - pulling power mid flash is the
most likely route to failure, or flashing in Windows, we all know it's prone
to crashing at the least opportune moment.

I've flashed the BIOS on my A7N8X Deluxe Rev2.0 several times and not had a
problem, I usually either use the built in awdflash or awdflash on a floppy.

http://www.ben.pope.name/a7n8x_faq.html#BIOS_Flash

I think for many of those that have had problems when flashing, they found
that clearing cmos worked. If you happily change settings in the BIOS and
the machine restarts/powers on properly every time you should be ok.

BIOS saviour is basically two flash chips that you can swap between, it's
quite a good idea.

Ben
 
E

Egil Solberg

Rob Jones said:
Hi I'm planning to upgrade to a 160GB HD however, I have read some info
about recognition issues with MBs and XP. It appears that older MBs pre Jan
1st 2003 do not have support for 48-bit LBA. XP will only read 137GB, no
more.

Your mobo supports >137GB drives with any BIOS. You need to install WinXP
SP1 for XP to find the drive right. Enough said.
..
 
R

Rob Jones

Partition sizes are a limitation of the O/S.Drive sizes are a
limitation of the hardware.If the full size of the drive is not seen
by the BIOS then partitioning the drive will make no difference.There
is an update for WinXP to be able to see and partition above 137 gig
but this will not defeat a hardware limitation.Hardware limitations
can be defeated in some cases by a BIOS update but if not then a
Controller card

Hi Shep, thanks for the info, by controller card, do you mean this:

http://tinyurl.com/wziy

I was thinking about buying one (I have plenty of PCI slots free) and at
this price I can afford it. If it is the right hardware, how will it work
with my existing MB IDE channels. Does it take over as the default IDE
controller away from the Mb or is it supplementary?

Also, what about booting off the card? Can you install XP on a partition
and boot from the card? What about Bios impact, are the bios changed by
the card, do you have to install some sort of program to change the bios?

Sorry for all the questions but any help would be appreciated as if
installing this card solves the problem, I'll willingly buy it to save time
effort.



and as a last resort as DDO(Dynamic Disk Overlay)
program usually freely available from the drive maker's site if not
already supplied with the drive.
More info here,
http://www.geocities.com/sheppola/hard.html

Thanks I'll take a look
If there is a BIOS update and you wish to flash the BIOS then find the
correct flash program and BIOS .rom file and I'll make you a bootable
CDR/W .ISO image which is a more secure way of flashing the BIOS than
the older and less robust floppy disks.This presumes you have a CDR/W
drive.

Thanks for the offer but I know so little about bios updating atm that I
think I'm going to have to read more first!
 
E

Egil Solberg

I was thinking about buying one (I have plenty of PCI slots free) and at
this price I can afford it.

You don't need one. You have a serialATA controller and onboard
PATA-controller. That should be enough for most persons.
 
R

Rob Jones

It's not too bad, usully there is a bootloader section that is not usually
flashed, allows you to flash a new BIOS even if part of it is corrupted.

It's still easy to FUBAR the motherboard - pulling power mid flash is the
most likely route to failure, or flashing in Windows, we all know it's prone
to crashing at the least opportune moment.

I've flashed the BIOS on my A7N8X Deluxe Rev2.0 several times and not had a
problem, I usually either use the built in awdflash or awdflash on a floppy.

http://www.ben.pope.name/a7n8x_faq.html#BIOS_Flash

I think for many of those that have had problems when flashing, they found
that clearing cmos worked. If you happily change settings in the BIOS and
the machine restarts/powers on properly every time you should be ok.

BIOS saviour is basically two flash chips that you can swap between, it's
quite a good idea.

Ben

Thanks Ben, I take a look at your page and have a good read.
 
R

Rob Jones

You don't need one. You have a serialATA controller and onboard
PATA-controller. That should be enough for most persons.

Hi again Egil, I'm going for the 160GB drive anyway so will install Xp and
SP-1 and go from there before considering about hardware add on's.
 
S

Shep©

Hi Shep, thanks for the info, by controller card, do you mean this:

http://tinyurl.com/wziy

I was thinking about buying one (I have plenty of PCI slots free) and at
this price I can afford it. If it is the right hardware, how will it work
with my existing MB IDE channels. Does it take over as the default IDE
controller away from the Mb or is it supplementary?

Also, what about booting off the card? Can you install XP on a partition
and boot from the card? What about Bios impact, are the bios changed by
the card, do you have to install some sort of program to change the bios?

Sorry for all the questions but any help would be appreciated as if
installing this card solves the problem, I'll willingly buy it to save time
effort.

As per other posts.You are good to go with what you have except to
install the XP update.
One advantage of a controller card though is that you can have more
devices on separate IDE chains but with your system being so modern
you most likely don't need one even for this :)


and as a last resort as DDO(Dynamic Disk Overlay)

Thanks I'll take a look


Thanks for the offer but I know so little about bios updating atm that I
think I'm going to have to read more first!



--
Free Windows/PC help,
http://www.geocities.com/sheppola/trouble.html
email shepATpartyheld.de
Free songs download,
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/8/nomessiahsmusic.htm
 
R

Rob Jones

As per other posts.You are good to go with what you have except to
install the XP update.
One advantage of a controller card though is that you can have more
devices on separate IDE chains but with your system being so modern
you most likely don't need one even for this :)

Thanks Shep, I have plenty to keep me busy now :)
 
G

Gus

Look here..its rather lengthy..

How to Enable 48-bit Logical Block Addressing Support for ATAPI Disk Drives
in Windows XP
The information in this article applies to:
a.. Microsoft Windows XP Professional
b.. Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition
This article was previously published under Q303013
IMPORTANT: This article contains information about modifying the registry.
Before you modify the registry, make sure to back it up and make sure that
you understand how to restore the registry if a problem occurs. For
information about how to back up, restore, and edit the registry, click the
following article number to view the article in the Microsoft Knowledge
Base:
256986 Description of the Microsoft Windows Registry

SUMMARY
This article describes the Windows XP 48-bit Logical Block Addressing (LBA)
support for ATA Packet Interface (ATAPI) disk drives that can enable the
capacity of your hard disk to exceed the current 137 gigabyte (GB) limit.

NOTE: 48-bit LBA support will not be enabled and therefore supported until
Service Pack 1 (SP1) for Windows XP Home Edition or Windows XP Professional
is officially released and installed. Manually enabling 48-bit LBA support
on Windows XP Without SP1 installed could lead to potential data loss.

For additional information about the latest service pack for Windows XP,
click the article number below to view the article in the Microsoft
Knowledge Base:
322389 How to Obtain the Latest Windows XP Service Pack

MORE INFORMATION
WARNING: If you use Registry Editor incorrectly, you may cause serious
problems that may require you to reinstall your operating system. Microsoft
cannot guarantee that you can solve problems that result from using Registry
Editor incorrectly. Use Registry Editor at your own risk.

Windows XP includes 48-bit LBA support for ATAPI disk drives that can enable
the capacity of your hard disk to exceed the current 137 GB limit. This type
of support is new technology and Microsoft has only tested a limited number
of these disk drives. By default, Windows XP Home Edition and Windows XP
Professional do not have 48-bit LBA support enabled.

You must meet the following requirements to use 48-bit LBA ATAPI support:
a.. You must have a 48-bit LBA compatible BIOS.
b.. You must have a hard disk that has a capacity that is greater than 137
GB.
c.. You must have Windows XP installed.
d.. For Windows XP Home Edition or Windows XP Professional, you must
enable the support in the registry by adding or changing the registry value,
EnableBigLba, to 1 in the following registry:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\Atapi\Parameters\

WARNING: By default 48-bit LBA ATAPI support on Windows XP Home Edition and
Professional is unavailable. Users must add the registry key mentioned
earlier to make this addressing available to access disk space beyond the
first 137GB. Data corruption can occur if previous versions of Windows that
do not support 48-bit LBA out of the box (for example, Windows 2000 or
earlier) are installed on a disk partition that was previously created by a
48-bit aware operating system such as Windows XP that is greater in size or
spans the current addressable limit of 137GB. NOTE: This includes Windows XP
RTM versions. By default, the behavior does not occur in Windows XP RTM.
Also note that if you manually turn on 48-bit LBA support on Windows XP
without Service Pack 1 installed, you may cause data loss.

To enable 48-bit LBA large-disk support in the registry:
1.. Start Registry Editor (Regedt32.exe).
2.. Locate and click the following key in the registry:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\Atapi\Parameters\

3.. On the Edit menu, click Add Value, and then add the following registry
value:
Value name: EnableBigLba
Data type: REG_DWORD
Value data: 0x1

4.. Quit Registry Editor.
WARNING: By default 48-bit LBA ATAPI support on Windows XP Home Edition and
Professional is unavailable. Users must add the registry key mentioned
earlier to make this addressing available to access disk space beyond the
first 137GB. Data corruption can occur if previous versions of Windows that
do not support 48-bit LBA out of the box (for example, Windows 2000 or
earlier) are installed on a disk partition that was previously created by a
48-bit aware operating system such as Windows XP that is greater in size or
spans the current addressable limit of 137GB. NOTE: This includes Windows XP
RTM versions. By default, the behavior does not occur in Windows XP RTM.
Also note that if you manually turn on 48-bit LBA support on Windows XP
without Service Pack 1 installed, you may cause data loss.

NOTE: If you attempt to enable the 48-bit LBA ATAPI support by editing the
preceding registry setting and you did not meet the minimum requirements,
you may observe the following behavior:
a.. The registry value, EnableBigLba, is disabled:

If you have a 48-bit compatible BIOS that can support a hard disk that has
a capacity that is greater than 137 GB, only the first 137 GB of the hard
disk are addressable. The remainder of the hard disk is not used.
b.. The registry value, EnableBigLba, is enabled, but you do not have a
48-bit LBA compatible BIOS and the capacity of the hard disk does not exceed
137 GB:

If you enable the 48-bit LBA ATAPI support by editing the registry
setting, but you lack both a 48-bit LBA compatible BIOS and a hard disk that
has a capacity that is greater than 137 GB, you have not changed the system.
The hard disk continues to function as a standard hard disk.
c.. The registry value, EnableBigLba, is enabled without a 48-bit LBA
compatible BIOS, but you have a hard disk with a capacity that is larger
than 137 GB:

If you enable 48-bit ATAPI support in the registry and you have a hard
disk that has a capacity that is greater than 137 GB, but you do not have a
48-bit LBA compatible BIOS, only the first 137 GB of the hard disk are
addressable. The remainder of the hard disk is not used.
To enable 48-bit LBA support by means of an unattended installation with the
Microsoft System Preparation (Sysprep) tool:
1.. Copy the following text into Microsoft Windows Notepad and save the
text as the 48bitLba.inf file:
[version]
signature="$CHICAGO$"
SetupClass=BASE


[DefaultInstall]
AddReg=48bitlba.Add.Reg

[48bitlba.Add.Reg]
HKLM,"System\CurrentControlSet\Services\Atapi\Parameters","EnableBigLba",0x1
0001,12.. Create a file named Cmdlines.txt, which includes the following
lines:

[Commands]
"rundll32 setupapi,InstallHinfSection DefaultInstall 128 .\48BITLBA.INF"
3.. Locate the Sysprep\I386 folder in the Sysprep image, and then create a
$OEM$ subfolder in this folder.
4.. Copy the 48bitlba.inf and Cmdlines.txt files into the
Sysprep\I386\$OEM$ folder.
5.. In your Sysprep.inf file, add a key named InstallFilesPath to the
[Unattended] section. This key must have the following value:
InstallFilesPath = "C:\sysprep\i386"
To add the preceding settings to the Images folder, which had been created
with the Riprep.exe program:
1.. On the remote installation server that contains the Riprep image,
create a Sysprep\I386\$OEM$ folder in the following folder:

RemoteInstall\Setup\Language\Images\Riprep_dir_name\I386\Mirror1\UserData

NOTE: The word "Language" in the preceding path reads "English" for the
English language, and "Riprep_dir_name" is the unique name that you selected
for the Riprep image.
2.. Copy the 48bitlba.inf and Cmdlines.txt files into the $OEM$ folder.
3.. Modify the Riprep.sif file in the
RemoteInstall\Setup\Language\Images\Riprep_dir_name\I386\Templates\Riprep.si
f folder (and any other template files for this Riprep image that you may
have created), and then add the OemPreinstall and InstallFilesPath values so
that they are set up as:

[Unattended]
OemPreinstall = "Yes"
InstallFilesPath = "C:\sysprep\i386"
4.. Close, and then save the file.
OEMs have the ability to turn this support on by means of the Microsoft
Windows OEM Preinstallation Kit.

For more information, refer to the OEM Preinstallation Kit or the following
Microsoft Web site:
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=http://www.microsoft.com/oem


Last Reviewed: 9/9/2002
Keywords: kbAppCompatibility kbenv kbhowto kbWinXPsp1fix KB303013
 
D

Darkfalz

I would love to update but I have read so many horror stories of failed
Bios updates I'm unsure about chancing it. I did read of a device call
Bios savoir a while back that claimed it could back up your bios in case of
it going wrong. Any thoughts? Is updating bios these days any safer?

I've been flashing BIOSes (CDRW, Video card and mainboard) since 1998 and
never had a problem once.
 
M

Milleron

Partition sizes are a limitation of the O/S.Drive sizes are a
limitation of the hardware.If the full size of the drive is not seen
by the BIOS then partitioning the drive will make no difference.There
is an update for WinXP to be able to see and partition above 137 gig
but this will not defeat a hardware limitation.Hardware limitations
can be defeated in some cases by a BIOS update but if not then a
Controller card and as a last resort as DDO(Dynamic Disk Overlay)
program usually freely available from the drive maker's site if not
already supplied with the drive.
More info here,
http://www.geocities.com/sheppola/hard.html

If there is a BIOS update and you wish to flash the BIOS then find the
correct flash program and BIOS .rom file and I'll make you a bootable
CDR/W .ISO image which is a more secure way of flashing the BIOS than
the older and less robust floppy disks.This presumes you have a CDR/W
drive.

Interesting. Can you explain why it's better to flash from a CD than
from a floppy?

Ron
 

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