XP memory leaks

[sysdrk]

I'm having memory leak problems with XP SP2. I'm using XP for
predominantly Internet access (firefox) and email (outlook 2003). Both
firefox and outlook are reputed to have memory leak problems and I'm
trying to understand how XP manages memory so I can deal better with
these problems. I use the task manager to keep tabs on my available
physical memory and the use of memory by my processes.

In particular, I understand an application uses virtual memory and XP
maps virtual into physical. I understand how an application can waste
memory but if XP manages physical memory I would expect that when I
kill an application XP would recover all physical memory that the
application was using. However, that doesn't appear to be the case.
Eventually I lose enough memory (I have 512M) that I have to reboot,
even if I have killed both firefox and outlook.

So I'm wondering if my understanding of XP's management of physical
memory is correct, which would tell me I should recover physical memory
when I kill firefox and outlook. Of course, an alternative explanation
is that I could be suffering a memory leak elsewhere other than these 2
applications.

Denis

 

[Carey Frisch [MVP]]

I'm not aware of any "memory leak" issues with Outlook 2003.
And no one has mentioned any similar issue with Firefox.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User
Microsoft Newsgroups

Be Smart! Protect Your PC!
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/protect/default.mspx

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Denis wrote:

| I'm having memory leak problems with XP SP2. I'm using XP for
| predominantly Internet access (firefox) and email (outlook 2003). Both
| firefox and outlook are reputed to have memory leak problems and I'm
| trying to understand how XP manages memory so I can deal better with
| these problems. I use the task manager to keep tabs on my available
| physical memory and the use of memory by my processes.
|
| In particular, I understand an application uses virtual memory and XP
| maps virtual into physical. I understand how an application can waste
| memory but if XP manages physical memory I would expect that when I
| kill an application XP would recover all physical memory that the
| application was using. However, that doesn't appear to be the case.
| Eventually I lose enough memory (I have 512M) that I have to reboot,
| even if I have killed both firefox and outlook.
|
| So I'm wondering if my understanding of XP's management of physical
| memory is correct, which would tell me I should recover physical memory
| when I kill firefox and outlook. Of course, an alternative explanation
| is that I could be suffering a memory leak elsewhere other than these 2
| applications.
|
| Denis

 

[Michael W. Ryder]

I'm not aware of any "memory leak" issues with Outlook 2003.
And no one has mentioned any similar issue with Firefox.

The memory usage with Firefox, etc. will rise if you use various add-on
programs such as Acrobat Reader. I don't think this is an actual memory
leak as the memory is reclaimed if the program is fully shut down.
Programs like Firefox have an option to stay in memory for faster start up.

 

[Guest]

What youre looking for isnt an easy topic to list here,however for more
info on it,go to:http://www.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;
555223&SD=tech

 

[Walter Clayton]

I'm having memory leak problems with XP SP2. I'm using XP for
predominantly Internet access (firefox) and email (outlook 2003). Both
firefox and outlook are reputed to have memory leak problems and I'm
trying to understand how XP manages memory so I can deal better with
these problems. I use the task manager to keep tabs on my available
physical memory and the use of memory by my processes.

Not a wise idea. The amount of physical memory in use should optimally
*always* be 100%. Free real is wasted oppurtunity.

In particular, I understand an application uses virtual memory and XP
maps virtual into physical. I understand how an application can waste
memory but if XP manages physical memory I would expect that when I
kill an application XP would recover all physical memory that the
application was using. However, that doesn't appear to be the case.
Eventually I lose enough memory (I have 512M) that I have to reboot,
even if I have killed both firefox and outlook.

And why do feel the need to reboot?

So I'm wondering if my understanding of XP's management of physical
memory is correct, which would tell me I should recover physical memory
when I kill firefox and outlook.

Yes it does. What makes you think the memory hasn't been freed?

Of course, an alternative explanation
is that I could be suffering a memory leak elsewhere other than these 2
applications.

More like a misunderstanding of what's happening. A true memory leak causes
application faults and can cause system degradation over time and in some
instances can cause a system fault.

Are you experiencing either real application or system faults? If so, what
are they?

 

[sysdrk]

Not a wise idea. The amount of physical memory in use should optimally
*always* be 100%. Free real is wasted oppurtunity.

That makes sense but my task manager always shows about 200M available
physical memory after I boot up. Then the available drops down as I
start a new application like firefox. This availability drop matches
the memory that task manager says the process is using.

And why do feel the need to reboot?

When the available physical memory drops down below about 70M I start
having problems where I can't start another application or shut one
down. It eventually gets to the point where I can't even do a soft
shutdown. I have to do a hard shutdown so I can reboot and get working
again. So once the available physical memory drops below 100M I start
looking for a good time to reboot so I can avoid the hard shutdown.

Yes it does. What makes you think the memory hasn't been freed?

I stated this based on the available physical memory listed in task
manager, which I had expected to increase by the amount of the memory
that task manager said a process was using when I terminated it.

More like a misunderstanding of what's happening. A true memory leak causes
application faults and can cause system degradation over time and in some
instances can cause a system fault.

Are you experiencing either real application or system faults? If so, what
are they?

As I stated earlier, I eventually get to the point where I can't start
up or shut down applications (or open another link in firefox) and
eventually I can't do a soft reboot. This degradation correlates with
the available physical memory listed in task manager.

Denis

 

[sysdrk]

I'm not aware of any "memory leak" issues with Outlook 2003.
And no one has mentioned any similar issue with Firefox.

Here's one reference to a memory leak in firefox:

http://users-guide.org/index.php?c=text&id=75

although this is not a memory leak per se. It's apparently a case
where firefox keeps requesting more and more memory.

Unfortunately, I can't find the outlook 2003 reference that I found
previously. I believe it was a MS knowledge base article and said that
outlook 2003 could exhibit this problem when left active for an
extended period of time. However, in my case I only leave outlook 2003
active while I'm actively using it and then I shut it down.

Again memory leak is probably not the right description. I just notice
at times, unpredictably, that outlook 2003 just starts chewing up
memory, typically when I'm reading an email and composing a reply that
takes 10-15 minutes. The outlook memory usage listed in task manager
jumps up and the listed available physical memory drops dramatically.
This happened earlier today (which motivated this posting) and I
reached a point where I couldn't send the email reply and I couldn't
shut down outlook, nor could I shut down any other process or do a soft
reboot. I had to do a hard shutdown to recover. I've had this happen
a number of times with outlook.

Denis

 

[Walter Clayton]

OK. Now that there are specifics.

Yes, you do have something playing pacman with memory.

Reading through what you're saying, there isn't an issue with OL2K3 per se.
Between Friday around 17:00 until Monday at around 07:00 I have my desktop
and laptop up 24x7 during that period including OL2K3 and I get a *ton* of
e-mail. Now there is a possibility that an add-in or com add-in for OL is
leaking. If that's the case, you'll need to disable things until you locate
the culprit.

Try here:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=310419
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=319740

Along those lines, what you want to look for is non-page pool space being
gobbled up. You can enable watching that in taskmgr as well perfmon.

For grins and giggles, switch to using IE to see how long you can actually
stay up without issues.

 

[sysdrk]

When the available physical memory drops down below about 70M I start
having problems where I can't start another application or shut one
down. It eventually gets to the point where I can't even do a soft
shutdown. I have to do a hard shutdown so I can reboot and get working
again. So once the available physical memory drops below 100M I start
looking for a good time to reboot so I can avoid the hard shutdown.

I managed to observe a couple memory leaks over the weekend and can now
confidently say it is related to Outlook 2003 and not firefox (I was
using IE when this problem occurred).

In both cases, I monitored the available physical memory in task
manager and when the problem started the available physical memory
slowly decreased (over about 30 minutes) until I had to reboot. This
leak continued while I was doing nothing, just watching the memory
decrease in task manager. Once this memory leak started it continued
whether outlook was the active window or minimized. When I killed
outlook the leak stopped and when I started outlook again the leak
started again. I haven't been able to identify what triggers this leak
since it doesn't happen every time I activate outlook.

I have noted one other strange thing about outlook. Occasionally, the
CPU usage of outlook goes into a sinusoidal oscillation pattern around
an average of about 25% cpu usage. The usage varies +/-25% to a high
of 50% and low of 0% and then tapers off back to 25% and then the
pattern repeats. Of course, the cpu usage stops when outlook is killed
but it starts up again when outlook is re-activated.

I have not correlated this oscillating cpu usage with the memory leak
but they both share the characteristic that once they start, they stop
when outlook is killed, and they start up again when outlook is
re-activated.

One other possibility I have considered is that the system gets messed
up when it comes out of standby. I leave my Toshiba Satellite laptop
on and just let it go into standby mode when I don't use it. One thing
that doesn't work right when the laptop comes out of standby is that I
often (but not always) lose my audio. So I wonder if something else
might get messed up when my laptop comes out of standby. However, my
outlook memory leak doesn't happen immediately after standby activation
so this is probably a long shot.

Denis

 

[Walter Clayton]

Outlook does house keeping. There's also the question of the plug-ins and
what affect they're having. I've now had Outlook up on both my desktop and
laptop for over 48 hours and there are *no* issues with my configurations.
Look at what's interfacing with Outlook.

If you think it's standby related, then disable standby while on AC. I have
my Toshy configured to remain fully on, except for the display 100% of the
time on AC and only use power management when on batteries. I don't loose
any functionality coming out of standby or hibernate for that matter.

 

[sysdrk]

Outlook does house keeping. There's also the question of the plug-ins and
what affect they're having. I've now had Outlook up on both my desktop and
laptop for over 48 hours and there are *no* issues with my configurations.
Look at what's interfacing with Outlook.

So I checked out my outlook add-ins (I wasn't aware there were any) and
discovered something called 'Mail Speak (Toshiba)'. This addin tells
me how many unread messages I have and when I have new messages. I
don't know how I will live without this but when I unclicked this addin
I found that the oscillating CPU usage went away. So I'm guessing that
when I lose my audio after coming out of standby mode some interaction
with this addin goes nuts. Since I unclicked this I haven't seen any
memory leak and I've had outlook active for almost 2 days - that's a
record. So I'm pretty confident this is the culprit.

Now, if someone has suggestions on how to debug what might be causing
the loss of my audio when I come out of standby... However, this isn't
that important. I don't use the audio very often so that's a
relatively minor thing.

Anyway, thanks for the outlook addin suggestion.

Denis

 

[Walter Clayton]

Check for any updated audio drivers. If Toshiba doesn't have any, then look
at the chipset vendor's site or even Windows Update.