Windows Vista or XP on my pc?

[Jerry Manner]

Hi

I am having a dilemma. I am up to a point in buying a new pc. Nowadays
new pc's all have standard Windows Vista installed. But when I read
several reviews and comments of users, it is recommended to NOT use
Windows Vista yet because of all the problems with this new operating
system. What is wise? Is it better if I buy a pc that has XP on it
rather then Vista or doens't it matter at all?

Regards

 

[antioch]

Hi

I am having a dilemma. I am up to a point in buying a new pc. Nowadays
new pc's all have standard Windows Vista installed. But when I read
several reviews and comments of users, it is recommended to NOT use
Windows Vista yet because of all the problems with this new operating
system. What is wise? Is it better if I buy a pc that has XP on it
rather then Vista or doens't it matter at all?

Regards

I would say, go with your gut feeling. Some say that Vista has more probs
than XP had when first released - some say otherwise.
I waited over a year before going from WN2000 to XP - been very happy with
it.
Got it on a new rig when SP2 came out.
Also read what is discussed in the Vista groups - I take reviews with a
pinch of salt.
But you do not mention what XP you have and which Vista you want.
I have read that upgrading say fro XP PRO to Vista Homes is no upgrade.
Updates etc are causing a lot of headaches but.............you could wait
for the finished version of SP1 - I believe it is betaware at the moment -
then you should not have to go through all the Black Tuesday updates for
Vista.
They should be consolidated on one disc - which should be free, but there
are rumours it will cost.
Oh and you can still get XP with some OEM makers - Dell in partic, but costs
extra.
If I was thinking of getting Vista, I would wait - till next Xmas - SP1
would be included with the build - save a lot of trouble.

Good luck - whichever way you swing.

Antioch

 

[Bill in Co.]

You can still get WinXP installed on a new computer from Dell. It's one
of their options (at least for awhile longer). (Whether you want XP or
Vista depends on whether or not you really want the (so alleged) extra bells
and whistles of Vista).

 

[Jerry Manner]

I would say, go with your gut feeling.  Some say that Vista has more probs
than XP had when first released - some say otherwise.
I waited over a year before going from WN2000 to XP - been very happy with
it.
Got it on a new rig when SP2 came out.
Also read what is discussed in the Vista groups - I take reviews with a
pinch of salt.
But you do not mention what XP you have and which Vista you want.
I have read that upgrading say fro  XP PRO to Vista Homes is no upgrade.
Updates etc are causing a lot of headaches but.............you could wait
for the finished version of SP1 - I believe it is betaware at the moment -
then you should not have to go through all the Black Tuesday updates for
Vista.
They should be consolidated on one disc - which should be free, but there
are rumours it will cost.
Oh and you can still get XP with some OEM makers - Dell in partic, but costs
extra.
If I was thinking of getting Vista, I would wait - till next Xmas - SP1
would be included with the build - save a lot of trouble.

Good luck - whichever way you swing.

Antioch

Hi

I don't have WXP, I still have W98SE. Thats why I want to uy a new
pc . I don't know yet which Vista I want. You say that Vista with SP1
is available xmas this year? Thats a long time to wait. Dell has pc's
with xp but they cost more then the Vista systems.

 

[Bill in Co.]

I would say, go with your gut feeling. Some say that Vista has more probs
than XP had when first released - some say otherwise.
I waited over a year before going from WN2000 to XP - been very happy with
it.
Got it on a new rig when SP2 came out.
Also read what is discussed in the Vista groups - I take reviews with a
pinch of salt.
But you do not mention what XP you have and which Vista you want.
I have read that upgrading say fro XP PRO to Vista Homes is no upgrade.
Updates etc are causing a lot of headaches but.............you could wait
for the finished version of SP1 - I believe it is betaware at the moment -
then you should not have to go through all the Black Tuesday updates for Vista.
They should be consolidated on one disc - which should be free, but there
are rumours it will cost.
Oh and you can still get XP with some OEM makers - Dell in partic, but costs
extra.

Costs extra?? Since when?? I don't recall that (and I just did it).

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Vista SP1 will be available in about four weeks. For reasons not pertinent
to this thread, SP1 for Vista must be online on or about the time of Windows
Server 2008 launch in late February. That date in graven in stone. Vista
SP1 is presently in Release Candidate, second refresh status. That is the
very last stage prior to release.

For a home user the recommended edition of Vista is Vista Home Premium. VHP
is comparable to XP Media Center Edition and you get the broadest range of
features that home users typically have been wanting.

I don't know who told you that SP1 would not be out until XMas but if they
meant Xmas 2008 they are going to miss it by ten months. Vista SP1 has been
scheduled for release during first quarter 2008 along with Windows Server
2008 for two years now. There is no reason for anyone to have been guessing
about this.

I would say, go with your gut feeling. Some say that Vista has more probs
than XP had when first released - some say otherwise.
I waited over a year before going from WN2000 to XP - been very happy with
it.
Got it on a new rig when SP2 came out.
Also read what is discussed in the Vista groups - I take reviews with a
pinch of salt.
But you do not mention what XP you have and which Vista you want.
I have read that upgrading say fro XP PRO to Vista Homes is no upgrade.
Updates etc are causing a lot of headaches but.............you could wait
for the finished version of SP1 - I believe it is betaware at the moment -
then you should not have to go through all the Black Tuesday updates for
Vista.
They should be consolidated on one disc - which should be free, but there
are rumours it will cost.
Oh and you can still get XP with some OEM makers - Dell in partic, but
costs
extra.
If I was thinking of getting Vista, I would wait - till next Xmas - SP1
would be included with the build - save a lot of trouble.

Good luck - whichever way you swing.

Antioch

Hi

I don't have WXP, I still have W98SE. Thats why I want to uy a new
pc . I don't know yet which Vista I want. You say that Vista with SP1
is available xmas this year? Thats a long time to wait. Dell has pc's
with xp but they cost more then the Vista systems.

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

I am having a dilemma. I am up to a point in buying a new pc. Nowadays
new pc's all have standard Windows Vista installed. But when I read
several reviews and comments of users, it is recommended to NOT use
Windows Vista yet because of all the problems with this new operating
system. What is wise? Is it better if I buy a pc that has XP on it
rather then Vista or doens't it matter at all?

Several points:

1. People with problems look for help with their problems and post
comments in newsgroups complaining about anything new. Those who don't
have problems don't ask questions, so they are greatly
underrepresented in the comments you see.

2. Most people with problems are those who are running Vista on old
inadequate hardware, and are often also running older software on it.

3. I've been running Vista Ultimate here since RTM about 14 months
ago, with *no* problems at all.

4. If you were asking about upgrading an XP computer to Vista, I'd
advise caution, and suggest that it might be better not to rush into
it if there's no compelling reason to do so. But if you're buying a
new computer, to me it makes no sense not to get Vista, and take a
backward step.

5. If you do get Vista, realize that it needs more hardware than XP.
For example, most people should have at least 1GB of RAM, and for
many, 2GB is substantially better.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

I agree with you on point #2 all the way. During beta testing I ran many
tests involving upgrades versus custom installs of Vista with lots of XP
software installed. I finally came to the conclusion that when upgrading to
Vista from XP take an axe to most of the software and stick with the basics.
The worst offenders at killing off performance were all these third party
"performance" utilities. Carrying them over to Vista just killed
performance.

 

[John Waller]

Oh and you can still get XP with some OEM makers - Dell in partic, but

costs extra.

There's no extra cost involved.

It's just personal preference if you prefer to have XP or Vista
pre-installed and the offer (XP or Vista) is not available on all models.

 

[antioch]

Costs extra?? Since when?? I don't recall that (and I just did it).

Perhaps things are different down-under to here in the UK where ALL MS stuff
is 30% more expensive than the USA - even B.G on his last visit to the UK -
he said it was the exchange rates???????? 1GBP = $2
My daughter bought(with Xmas money from relatives) a Dell in March 2007 -
she wanted XP - after a lot of hassle they agreed to it but wanted £50 over
and above Vista Home Prem being included in the basic price.
She had stretched her budget already with GPU upgrade and memory so had to
settle for Vista - and has regretted it since.
Then at the end of April 2007, Dell announced that they were reintroducing
XP on selected models but only to small and medium business.
I believe now that the offer of XP has been extended to personal use.
In August 2007, a neighbour wanted a new computer(another Dell). He is a
retired accountant, so needed an OS that supported his software as he still
acted for some of his old clients. He paid £80 extra to have XP PRO
installed rather than Home Prem.
One or two 'bespoke' computer builders in the UK still offer XP, and will do
until they are forced to take Vista from MS and put them in new builds.
In Dec 2007, the computer Mag I get did a what to buy for Xmas.
With Dell, if I remember correctly, only 1 model 530 offered XP Home and Pro
at £39 & £50. The 530s had the same offers.
The rest of the Desktops I think only had XP PRO at £50-£80 extra on
selected models.
Notebooks had similar offers over their range - but nearly every model there
was an extra cost for an XP OS.
Perhaps I should have said in my post 'may cost you more'
I wonder if it is costing Dell more to get XP from MS now than it used to
and Dell are passing on that cost?
Rgds
Antioch

 

[antioch]

There's no extra cost involved.

It's just personal preference if you prefer to have XP or Vista
pre-installed and the offer (XP or Vista) is not available on all models.

Yes, but 12 months ago, on Dell models, the XP OS was included in the price.
Now, on those same/similar models, it is extra to the Vista included in the
price.
Antioch

 

[Tony Meloche]

Yes, but 12 months ago, on Dell models, the XP OS was included in the price.

On all Dell models, yes - that was true.

Now, on those same/similar models, it is extra to the Vista included in the
price.

Well, yes - IF it's a computer they normally build with Vista. But Dell
is still offering a handful of computers with XP installed at no extra
price. I speak from experience, that's what my wife wanted for
Christmas, and I bought one. I just checked their website: Four
desktops, and a few notebooks still available with XP standard.

Tony

 

[antioch]

On all Dell models, yes - that was true.


Well, yes - IF it's a computer they normally build with Vista. But Dell
is still offering a handful of computers with XP installed at no extra
price. I speak from experience, that's what my wife wanted for Christmas,
and I bought one. I just checked their website: Four desktops, and a
few notebooks still available with XP standard.

Tony

Tony
Thanks for the update - Dell seem to have bettered there offer of XP at the
Xmas run-up.

Antioch

 

[John John]

If you have special software or special hardware and that you know that
it will not run too well on Vista then get the older XP. Otherwise I
would say that you should get Vista. Like it or not that is where
things are going on the Windows side of computers and in the not too
distant future some of the newer hardware and software will need it to
run. I wouldn't necessarily advise upgrading older computers to Vista
but brand new computers have plenty of guts and they are designed to
work with Vista, so you may as well move on with the times.

On the other hand if you have expensive software or hardware and if you
rely on this for your livelihood or business then you may want to ask
the software or hardware vendors if their products will work properly
with Vista and if they will support it, a perfectly good $10,000 plotter
that doesn't have proper drivers to work with a newer operating system
is an expensive relic!

John

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

That was an offer just prior to Vista's release and it was intended to
encourage folks not to wait to buy a new computer until after Vista came
out. It was a special upgrade and not a standard OEM disk.

 

[John H Meyers]

That was an offer just prior to Vista's release and it was intended to
encourage folks not to wait to buy a new computer until after Vista came
out. It was a special upgrade and not a standard OEM disk.

Isn't there a "Downgrade rights" policy from MS for "Pro" versions,
which remains in effect thru the first half of 2008,
whether or not the manufacturer makes it easier by supplying a disk?

Some readings:

Microsoft gives Windows XP five-month reprieve
"It will sell the old OS until June 2008,
even with Vista selling 'pretty well'"
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9039599

FAQ: Giving up on Vista? Here's how to downgrade to XP
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9040318

The XP alternative for Vista PCs - CNet
http://www.news.com/2100-1016_3-6209481.html

How to make Windows XP last for the next seven years
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9026940

Microsoft: Vista Downgrade Rights (PDF, for OEMs)
http://download.microsoft.com/downl...cbd-699b0c164182/royaltyoemreferencesheet.pdf

--

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Downgrade rights generally apply to volume license customers and Software
Assurance customers. You are correct that downgrade rights do not apply to
home editions of Windows.

VL and SA customers are enterprises who have time-delimited contracts with
MS for acquisition of new editions of software. If the customer fails to
acquire the licenses for the new editions within the contract's lifetime
(the term is usually a year), then the customer will have to either pay for
a new contract or buy the software at addtional cost in order to get the
software. Downgrade rights allow the customer to acquire the new licesenses
within the current contract's lifetime but continue to use the previous
version under the new license instead. The principle is that a customer
should not be coerced into signing a new contract just to acquire currently
offered software that he is not ready to use. You have to know the ins and
outs of these contracts to understand why enterprises need to do this.

Perhaps you are an enterprise customer and know these things better than I
do.

The new wrinkle here is that MS has granted OEM's the right to offer
downgrade rights to their customers. The OEM's seek to overcome sales
resistence in this way to Vista being preinstalled. The potential problem
with an OEM license from the end user's point of view is that if the end
user replaces Vista with XP he voids the OEM license and runs into a problem
with MS when he reinstalls Vista using the OEM copy later. In the past if
the pre-installed version of Windows was SLA (bios-locked) there was no
issue because such copies are inherently pre-activated, but I understand
that some aspects of that has changed with Vista.

I may have this one wrong, but my understanding is that the home editions
are not covered under this either.

That was an offer just prior to Vista's release and it was intended to
encourage folks not to wait to buy a new computer until after Vista came
out. It was a special upgrade and not a standard OEM disk.

Isn't there a "Downgrade rights" policy from MS for "Pro" versions,
which remains in effect thru the first half of 2008,
whether or not the manufacturer makes it easier by supplying a disk?

Some readings:

Microsoft gives Windows XP five-month reprieve
"It will sell the old OS until June 2008,
even with Vista selling 'pretty well'"
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9039599

FAQ: Giving up on Vista? Here's how to downgrade to XP
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9040318

The XP alternative for Vista PCs - CNet
http://www.news.com/2100-1016_3-6209481.html

How to make Windows XP last for the next seven years
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9026940

Microsoft: Vista Downgrade Rights (PDF, for OEMs)
http://download.microsoft.com/downl...cbd-699b0c164182/royaltyoemreferencesheet.pdf

-- =

 

[HeyBub]

Hi

I am having a dilemma. I am up to a point in buying a new pc. Nowadays
new pc's all have standard Windows Vista installed. But when I read
several reviews and comments of users, it is recommended to NOT use
Windows Vista yet because of all the problems with this new operating
system. What is wise? Is it better if I buy a pc that has XP on it
rather then Vista or doens't it matter at all?

A significant percentage (i.e., most) of complaints about Vista involve
incompatible hardware. If your new machine comes with Vista, there should be
no intrinsic problem.

 

[antioch]

That was an offer just prior to Vista's release and it was intended to
encourage folks not to wait to buy a new computer until after Vista came
out. It was a special upgrade and not a standard OEM disk.

I thought you bought Xmas 2007 - in which case we are talking about
different times.
Well they changed their tune after Xmas 2006 - the sales drive must have
worked - but then they did not have lots of Vista on their hands, which they
did in the months after Xmas 2006.
Antioch

 

[Tony Meloche]

I thought you bought Xmas 2007 - in which case we are talking about
different times.
Well they changed their tune after Xmas 2006 - the sales drive must have
worked - but then they did not have lots of Vista on their hands, which they
did in the months after Xmas 2006.
Antioch

Just to be sure thee is no confusion, Antioch - *I* was the poster who
bought at Christmastime 2007 - Not Colin.

Tony