Why wont Hp send me a service manual in PDF form

[Damo]

My HP 3822 printer has broke.

Instead of getting HP man to come look at it (which will probably cost more
than the printer) I have emailed them and asked them for a service manual in
PDF form.

There reply is " hi i understand you would like a service manual for youre
printer. I regret to inform you that the problem with youre printer is a
harware issue and needs to be serviced!!!!! (idiots). To isolate the issue i
suggest you find a Hp authorised service centre to service the printer.

Jokers all the way they are!!!!!!!!

 

[zakezuke]

My HP 3822 printer has broke.

I have emailed them and asked them for a service manual in
PDF form.

There reply is " hi i understand you would like a service manual
for youre printer. I regret to inform you that the problem with >youre printer is a harware issue and needs to be serviced!!!!!
(idiots)

I assume your talking a deskjet and not a designjet. I think the uk
model 3822 is the same as 3820 but i'm not well versed in HPs.

But needless to say this is a perfectly normal responce. Service
manuals are generally used by those who service printers professional
and as they result in income they cost money. If they were to give out
a service manual to everyone who asked for it, you'll have an army of
people who are not really qualified to service printers following
directions they don't understand and if by some strange chance they
happen to break their printer they would be obligated to fix it. There
is a good reason why these are not given freely. Not that I disagree
with you, I like knowing how to service my equipment... you just have
to realise that support won't help you do it. Also what you are asking
is the equilivent of going into a petrol station and asking to
photocopy one of their maps for free. They "might" let you do it, they
might be really cool and make their own maps they own the copyright to
and can be distributed freely. But it would be wrong to be critical of
any petrol station that won't help you violate a copyright. Service
manuals are generally copyrighted and generally are sold for a pretty
penny. It's the same with cars, which is rather why companies like
Hayes make enough money to justify buying a car, tearing it down, and
making a service guide, because do it your self joe couldn't afford the
factory service manual.

The best sources I know of to find service manuals online is
http://www.eserviceinfo.com/
http://www.fixyourownprinter.com/

But I must admit I didn't see an entry for 3822... perhaps someone
wiser would know a printer with a similar build that might help you
out, or better yet know your printer personaly and help you
troubleshoot the problem.

 

[Impmon]

Jokers all the way they are!!!!!!!!

HP (and other companies) won't hand out the manual to any people
because they want to make money on repairs. Just head to a forum like
the one at www.fixyourownprinter.com/ and see if someone there can
help you. Failing that sell the broken printer on eBay and buy a new
one.

 

[Dewaine Chan]

HP or other printer manufacturers only will give the Authorized Service
Center (Involving taking expensive training courses and have Techs be
certified by the manufactureres). Other independent center will have to buy
the service manual. It is not any different from the Car Dealerships getting
service manuals from the Automakers and independent repair shops will have
to buy the service manual of sort from somewhere.

Do you get Service Manual for your car from the Car maker for free? What
about your TV and Digital Camera, etc?? So why should HP give out Service
Manual for free? I'm just saying teh obvious. I'm not associated with HP in
any way other than I have my own little business fixing printers and
computers so don't shoot the messenger.

Dewaine

 

[Alan]

I assume your talking a deskjet and not a designjet. I think the uk
model 3822 is the same as 3820 but i'm not well versed in HPs.

But needless to say this is a perfectly normal responce. Service
manuals are generally used by those who service printers professional
and as they result in income they cost money. If they were to give out
a service manual to everyone who asked for it, you'll have an army of
people who are not really qualified to service printers following
directions they don't understand and if by some strange chance they
happen to break their printer they would be obligated to fix it.

This part I don't believe. Regardless of where you got the
instructions from, if you start messing around inside your hardware,
you are on your own. Warranty voided, etc. A simple disclaimer to that
effect would make it clear.

Service manuals are generally copyrighted and generally
are sold for a pretty penny.

They're copyright by HP; so they can give them away if they want to.
The only thing preventing them is greed.

 

[zakezuke]

This part I don't believe. Regardless of where you got the

instructions from, if you start messing around inside your hardware,
you are on your own. Warranty voided, etc. A simple disclaimer to that
effect would make it clear.

I remember way back when I had a modem.. it was either pre-flash rom or
that particular edition didn't have a flash-rom. But anyways for free
they sent me a nice new rom, a branded screw driver, and some
instructions on how to replace the rom. Simple enough. Wasn't the
issue, the issue was the voltage regulators getting so hot the speaker
became unglued and caused something to short, so I returned it and
they tried to charge my credit card. They tried to claim I voided the
warranty because I opened the modem, so I just sent Visa the
instructions along with the branded screw driver and said simply "they
told me to do it". While this wasn't a court of law, this argument was
good enough for the credit card company. I can only imagine the number
of people who fried their modem trying to replace the rom.

If I opened my hood on my car, I wouldnt' void it's warranty, in fact
it's in the owners manual. I can change my own oil without voiding the
warranty, get non-oem tires, bigger battery, a good number of things.
I can even change my spark plugs.

They're copyright by HP; so they can give them away if they want to.
The only thing preventing them is greed.

What's wrong with that? People who repair printers make money off
those manuals, good money, it's rather why manufacturers sell them.
That and the fact writing a manual isn't free.... you gotta dig through
lots of propriority information and translate engineer speak to human
speak. Not to speak of exploeaded diagrams. Takes me a couple of
hours just to do a simple layout moasic not to scale. Why shouldn't HP
get a piece of the pie esp for something they spent their time
resources and money on creating? They are under no moral or ethical
obligation to give you jack. They are under a legal and ethical
obligation to the shareholders.

This isn't to say I didn't like the good old says where every piece of
electronic equipment came with a full schematic, full documentation,
and a level of information now only found in developers kits, but most
desktop printers are not even designed to be serviced, they are
designed to be thrown away. Now if you bought something designed to be
maintained... that'll cost more and chances are you'll get something
resembling a service manual with it. But a deskjet... right or wrong
not going to happen. In fact, I can't think of any company who makes
consumer inkjets who gives away service manuals.

 

[ato_zee]

In fact, I can't think of any company who makes
consumer inkjets who gives away service manuals.

Not much good if they did, you are not likely to
get spare parts. Printer belts, stepper motor, feed
rollers, perish the thought. Printers are primarily
made for landfill and you buy another. The term
consumable applies to the printer, not just the
cartridges.

 

[Alan]

If I opened my hood on my car, I wouldnt' void it's warranty, in fact
it's in the owners manual. I can change my own oil without voiding the
warranty, get non-oem tires, bigger battery, a good number of things.
I can even change my spark plugs.

That's the distinction between a "user's manual" (how to change the
toner cartridge", and a "service manual" (how to tweak the high
voltage output). Where the line is drawn may be somewhat arbitrary,
but it's legitimate for them to say that some things are done at your
own risk.

Apple for instance have been complete jerks about their service
manuals. For a long time they were available on their FTP site,
theoretically for technicians only, and they would threaten anyone who
mirrored them, or even gave the URLs. But if you wanted to, say,
change the CMOS battery, the official advice was "take it to a service
centre". It's a simple procedure, though not obvious without a
diagram. Even opening the case on many models needs some hints on
where the catches are, otherwise you'll break it.

What's wrong with that? People who repair printers make money off
those manuals, good money, it's rather why manufacturers sell them.
That and the fact writing a manual isn't free.... you gotta dig through
lots of propriority information and translate engineer speak to human
speak. Not to speak of exploeaded diagrams. Takes me a couple of
hours just to do a simple layout moasic not to scale. Why shouldn't HP
get a piece of the pie esp for something they spent their time
resources and money on creating? They are under no moral or ethical
obligation to give you jack. They are under a legal and ethical
obligation to the shareholders.

I didn't say it was illegal. Forcing you to go to an official service
centre for a trivial fix is greedy. The manual has to be written
regardless, I'm not asking them to create them, just to upload them.
(This is academic for me, I've got all the manuals for my laser
elsewhere.) Twenty years ago when there was only paper manuals, it was
expensive. Now it's all DTP and it's trivial to print to PDF and make
an online version in literally minutes.

 

[zakezuke]

That's the distinction between a "user's manual" (how to change the

toner cartridge", and a "service manual" (how to tweak the high
voltage output). Where the line is drawn may be somewhat arbitrary,
but it's legitimate for them to say that some things are done at your
own risk

There was a time when owners manuals included service specfications,
break down schematics and what not... but those days are gone since we
now have the sub $400 PC and the sub $100 printer.

Apple for instance have been complete jerks about their service
manuals. For a long time they were available on their FTP site,
theoretically for technicians only, and they would threaten anyone who
mirrored them, or even gave the URLs.

Classic case of the right hand didn't know what the left hand was
doing. Round and abouts of system 7 or so the shareholders got it in
their heads that since microsoft was charging money for their operating
system that apple should do the same. Pretty much the same deal with
the service manuals as well. So yea, there was a time period where the
lawers would send threating letters if you to mirror anything on their
FTP site the share holders felt they should be charging money for.

Apple is a great example... for years they got away with their system
checking to see if your parts had "apple" tagged on the rom... and if
not many of their utilities to setup hard discs and even CDroms just
wouldn't work... even if it was the same bloody thing.

Forcing you to go to an official service centre for a trivial fix is greedy.

They are not forcing you to go anywhere. You can go anywhere you like
esp since your stuff is out of warranty. There is nothing stopping the
end user from buying a service manual and fixing it them selves, or do
what most people do and just buy a new disposable piece of equipment as
it's generally cheaper than service.

Besides, you think first level support actually has any idea what is
wrong? If they don't have a clue, which chances are they don't... I
mean this to be fair rather than being cruel unless they happen to have
been exposed to the same piece of hardware you have which chances are
they have not... the advice of taking it to an offical service center
is GOOD. For all they know your an idiot, and the last thing they want
is to tell an idiot to pop open their equipment and poke around with a
screw driver. Their advice on how to make something work is basicly
go to the people they know for a fact can fix it for a fee.

Just like if your auto breaks down... you could go to the offical
service center, pick one of your own, or heck visit the friendly
neighborhood tree shade mechanic.

 

[Alan]

They are not forcing you to go anywhere.

Many problems can be diagnosed and fixed with a little bit of
knowledge.

For instance, several years ago our office had a huge, expensive fax
machine. Black lines started to appear in the faxes we sent,
eventually we called for a service, about $80. I watched the
technician open the machine and clean a mirror. He resented me
watching him and learning his trade secret, but from then on it was
something I could fix myself. Getting a technician to fix something
dangerous, like a car, or that requires skill or special instruments
is reasonable, when it's something I could refer to a simple diagram
and fix in 5 minutes with a screwdriver, I feel ripped off.

Besides, you think first level support actually has any idea what is
wrong?

Who's talking about support? I just want to download the manual and
work it out myself.

the advice of taking it to an offical service center
is GOOD. For all they know your an idiot, and the last thing they want
is to tell an idiot to pop open their equipment and poke around with a
screw driver. Their advice on how to make something work is basicly
go to the people they know for a fact can fix it for a fee.

I'm an adult, I can take responsibility for myself. And again, I'm not
talking to "support", my printer is long out of warranty.
Anyway, the "fee" to take a printer to be serviced is generally more
than the replacement cost, so as long as I don't kill myself, there is
no downside to trying to fix it; the alternative is to trash it. Which
is what the printer company wants me to do, and then buy a new one.

 

[zakezuke]

Many problems can be diagnosed and fixed with a little bit of

knowledge.

Very true... personaly I agree with you.

I watched the technician open the machine and clean a mirror.
He resented me watching him and learning his trade secret,
but from then on it was something I could fix myself.

I wish the last person I took my printer too was so wise. I don't know
for a fact but I believe that's what was wrong with one of my
printers.. a reflector got ink spashed.

Who's talking about support? I just want to download the manual and
work it out myself.

As do I. Hince why I tend to visit sites that carry them.

I'm an adult, I can take responsibility for myself

Your an adult, but is everyone? What company wants to be held
accountable for instructing people on servicing their sub $100
printers? Get one person who's not an adult who blames poor advice on
the tech-support and they get a free printer.

Anyway, the "fee" to take a printer to be serviced is generally more
than the replacement cost, so as long as I don't kill myself, there is
no downside to trying to fix it;

Sure there is a downside, you do run the risk of killing a piece of
hardware that has a certain replacement value. Your an adult, you can
accept accountability for your own actions. Most people are not.

Which is what the printer company wants me to do, and then buy a new one.

See, they are not forsing you to do anything. They give you the option
service, buying a new one, or you can take it upon your self without
their help to fix it your self. This way they can say in all honesty
they didn't reccomend you try to fix your own printer and if you screw
up your left with two options.... get it serviced for a fee or buy a
new one.

But yes... service costs more than replacement in most cases.... sad
but true. It's nice in the fact that we can upgrade so cheaply but
bad for the enviroment.