What fan should I use and where to put it in my comp?

[Wilson]

I just put in an ATI video card that has a heat sink and fan. However, my
comp also has 3 opticals and 2 hard drives. I think I better put in another
fan. I was thinking about a slot fan, but I do not know what I need to do. I
can't tell if my the fan on my front panel is sucking or blowing, and I
don't want to suck any air off my graphics card by putting in a slot fan.
Can you tell me what I should do?

Here is the fan I was thinking about getting:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811999485


Below are some pics of my comp. There are two links for the same pic, so you
probably need to click on just one link.

There are 6 small holes on the plastic cover of the front. But I think these
are mostly for look though.
http://tinypic.com/idyqsg.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyqsg



This is my fan on the inside of the front panel of the computer. I cannot
tell if it sucks or blows.
http://tinypic.com/idyqz5.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyqz5



This is the front panel on the outside. The fan is right on the other side
of these holes.
http://tinypic.com/idyrfd.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrfd



This is the back panel of my comp. You can see vent holes from top to
bottom.
http://tinypic.com/idyr2w.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyr2w



This is what the vent holes on the back of the comp look like from the
inside of the comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrye.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrye



This is another shot of the back panel close up.
http://tinypic.com/idyr91.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyr91



Inside shot of my whole comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrle.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrle


Another inside shot of my comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrso.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrso

 

[Bill]

I just put in an ATI video card that has a heat sink and fan. However, my
comp also has 3 opticals and 2 hard drives. I think I better put in another
fan. I was thinking about a slot fan, but I do not know what I need to do. I
can't tell if my the fan on my front panel is sucking or blowing, and I
don't want to suck any air off my graphics card by putting in a slot fan.
Can you tell me what I should do?

Here is the fan I was thinking about getting:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811999485


Below are some pics of my comp. There are two links for the same pic, so you
probably need to click on just one link.

There are 6 small holes on the plastic cover of the front. But I think these
are mostly for look though.
http://tinypic.com/idyqsg.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyqsg
Oy!




This is my fan on the inside of the front panel of the computer. I cannot
tell if it sucks or blows.
http://tinypic.com/idyqz5.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyqz5

It's, at least trying to, suck air from the outside.

This is the front panel on the outside. The fan is right on the other side
of these holes.
http://tinypic.com/idyrfd.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrfd



This is the back panel of my comp. You can see vent holes from top to
bottom.
http://tinypic.com/idyr2w.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyr2w



This is what the vent holes on the back of the comp look like from the
inside of the comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrye.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrye



This is another shot of the back panel close up.
http://tinypic.com/idyr91.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyr91



Inside shot of my whole comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrle.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrle


Another inside shot of my comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrso.jpg
http://tinypic.com/view/?pic=idyrso

Looks like a typical ATX low end case.

First thing I'd do is get those cables out of the way of any air
moving around in there.

If you don't mind the noise, your cheapest way out is to leave the
side cover off and place a desk fan so that it blows into the case.

If you go with the slot fan, put it between the video card and the ide
adapter card.

That said, I'd get a better case.

Such as:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811129152

Notice it comes with an 120mm fan in the back, a place where you can
put another 120mm fan in front, an air filter in the front, and an air
channel on the side cover to direct cool outside air to the cpu fan.

A case along these lines would help your cooling immensely.

Bill

 

[Bill]

<snip>

Oh yes, I forgot. Thank you for posting the pics of your case.
It's extemely helpful to see exactly what the problem is.

Bill

 

[Paul]

I just put in an ATI video card that has a heat sink and fan. However, my
comp also has 3 opticals and 2 hard drives. I think I better put in another
fan. I was thinking about a slot fan, but I do not know what I need to do. I
can't tell if my the fan on my front panel is sucking or blowing, and I
don't want to suck any air off my graphics card by putting in a slot fan.
Can you tell me what I should do?

Here is the fan I was thinking about getting:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811999485

Below are some pics of my comp. There are two links for the same pic, so you
probably need to click on just one link.

There are 6 small holes on the plastic cover of the front. But I think these
are mostly for look though.
http://tinypic.com/idyqsg.jpg

This is my fan on the inside of the front panel of the computer. I cannot
tell if it sucks or blows.
http://tinypic.com/idyqz5.jpg

This is the front panel on the outside. The fan is right on the other side
of these holes.
http://tinypic.com/idyrfd.jpg

This is the back panel of my comp. You can see vent holes from top to
bottom.
http://tinypic.com/idyr2w.jpg

This is what the vent holes on the back of the comp look like from the
inside of the comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrye.jpg

This is another shot of the back panel close up.
http://tinypic.com/idyr91.jpg

Inside shot of my whole comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrle.jpg

Another inside shot of my comp.
http://tinypic.com/idyrso.jpg

The problem with your case, is the amount of cutting it would
take to improve it. Depending on your budget, and how much time
you have to spend on this, another case, one with provision for
a good rear fan, and some way to get decent vents on the front
of the case, might be an option.

The first problem is, the area on the back, where you could put
fans(s), would only allow small fans to be used. The noise from
those kind of fans is unacceptable (they need high RPMs to move
enough air to justify their existence).

Your photos don't show enough of the front panel area, to tell
what options are available there. I'm hoping you can get some
vent space open in front, such as removing the covers over the
two hard drives. If you open any vent space, you want your
case to have negative pressure (so the cool room air will come
in the front of the case, over the hard drives - they need the
cooling the most, if the case air temp is going to be too hot).
Considering the case, that is the best I can think of. Improving
or modifying the existing front fan, will only tend to leave the
air around the hard drives, stagnant.

What you could do, is buy a 120x120x25 and bolt it to the
removable side panel of your case. Place the fan, such that part
of the fan extends over top of the video card, and part of
the fan will also be exhausting the area near the CPU. By moving
the fan up or down, relatively speaking, you can pull more air
from the video card area, or more air from the CPU area, according
to what has the worst thermal problem. In the picture below, I'm
assuming you can open some covers over the hard drives, and the
majority of the intake air will be coming through that opening.
(You'll need to restrain the IDE cables, so they don't clip the
fan blades.)

-------
| CPU |
| |
-------
_______
/ \ <--- 120mm exhaust fan, bolted to side panel
| |
--------------------- <--- Video card underneath fan
| |
\_______/ <-------- (Intake vent
<-------- by the hard
Fan positioned here <-------- drives. Air
so 50% air from CPU flows across.)
and 50% air from front
side of video card.

This will require cutting a large hole in the side panel. You can
do this, by drilling holes large enough to slide a hack saw blade
through (or some other sawing type device). You want the hole to
match the active area of the fan, as that reduces turbulence
next to the fan blades.

The fan on the front of your case is virtually useless. Now,
compared to the 120x120x25 you will be adding, that fan won't
upset any air flow, as it has relatively low CFMs. When the
120mm fan is installed, you can probably disconnect that
front fan. For that fan to be effective, you'd need to take a
hack saw, and cut the grill out. And then, make some arrangement
with the plastic bezel, to pass air as well (maybe there is a
channel there already ?). I still think, if any vent space is
going to be added to the front of the computer case, it should
allow cool air over the hard drives.

Of course, you should really do the "science" first, and measure
room temp, case air temp, CPU temp, video card temp, when the
computer is under load. Stop the test, if the temperatures are
headed into the stratosphere. The reason for the science, is
to see how bad things are now. Once your mod is complete, then
you'll know for future reference, exactly how much good all that
sawing can do.

A Zalman Fanmate or Fanmate II can be used to control the speed
of the fan. There is a limit on one of those, to perhaps 1/2
amp of current (good idea to look up the limit). That will give
you the option of turning down the fan, if the one you purchase
is a bit too noisy.

I think your board is a microATX, and you don't have a lot of
slots to play with. You might consider moving the disk controller
card down, and leaving a blank slot next to the video card. That
should allow better airflow, as the 120mm fan pulls the hot air
away from the video card area. Whether you can do that, all
depends on whether there is enough slack left in the cables.

If that sounds like too much work, try out your PCI slot fan.
You could still open up some vent area on the front of the
case, especially if all it takes is removing a snap-out cover.

HTH,
Paul

 

[\Outback\ Jon]

Judging from the dust, that fan in the front bottom of you case is
indeed trying to blow air in. It may be that the fan sucks air in
through the bottom of the front panel. I have 3 computers that use a
slot in the bottom of the front panel as an air intake. They constantly
get clogged with dust. If there isn't one, you may want to try cutting
an opening in the bottom (where it can't be seen) to allow better air flow.

And, as a previous poster said, do something about those cables. At
least for the ones going up to your optical drives. Rounded cables are
your friends.

Looks like your power supply has a HUGE fan for venting the case. You
might try taking the covers off the three bottom PCI slots (that aren't
used anyway) and see if air is going in or out there. That would tell
you if you have positive or negative pressure in the case with the fans
you already have. Knowing that would be a good start before deciding
what fan to add next.

--
"Outback" Jon - KC2BNE
(e-mail address removed)
AMD XP 2400+ @ 2.18 GHz and 3.5GHz of other AMD power...
http://folding.stanford.edu - got folding? Team 33432
http://www.teammft.com - got a clan? Misfit Toys

1980 CB750F SuperSport "CoolerKing" (until it tells me it's name)

 

[Phil DeBecker]

I just put in an ATI video card that has a heat sink and fan. However, my
comp also has 3 opticals and 2 hard drives. I think I better put in another
fan. I was thinking about a slot fan, but I do not know what I need to do. I
can't tell if my the fan on my front panel is sucking or blowing, and I
don't want to suck any air off my graphics card by putting in a slot fan.
Can you tell me what I should do?

The first thing I would do is determine whether you do need any
additional fans. Your power supply looks like it has a pretty large
fan, and between that and the fan pulling air into the front of the
case you may be getting enough air flow as it is. Run Asus Probe or
Sandra or some other sensor monitor and see what temperatures you are
getting. You can even download utilities to monitor the temperatures
of your hard disks, assuming the drives support that.

That said, if your machine is running too hot, you would be better off
getting another case. The one Bill suggested is excellent; I have
that same case, with a single 120mm fan in back and an Antec TruPower
2.0 550W which also has a single 120mm fan, and my Athlon64 3800+ with
the stock AMD heatsink on A8N-SLI Premium runs at 32C with a system
temp of 30C.

Don't bother with a slot fan; those really don't do anything more than
make noise.

Phil

 

[Leythos]

That said, if your machine is running too hot, you would be better off
getting another case.

If the machine is running hot, the first thing to do is determine WHAT
is running hot:

1) Drives?
2) CPU?
3) Video Card?
4) PSU
5) Overall Case Temp?

If it's the CPU and nothing else, then it could easily be a problem with
the Heat-Sink, HS Paste being improperly applied, the Fan on the HS.....

 

[Wilson]

First, thanks Bill, OUtback John, Paul, Phil, and Leythos for replying. I
took out the floppy drive and left off one of the 3.5" covers on the front
panel. My baterry has a 120mm ball fan with 3 adjustable speeds (Cool Max
model #cx450B). I just set it to H, which I assume is high.

I have the Asus Probe, but it tells me nothing about the chasis fan. It has
the cpu temp as 30/90, whatever that means. When I boot up and go into bios,
I see 30/85, but I don't know what that temp is for. It does not say if it
is cpu or what.

 

[Leythos]

I have the Asus Probe, but it tells me nothing about the chasis fan. It has
the cpu temp as 30/90, whatever that means. When I boot up and go into bios,
I see 30/85, but I don't know what that temp is for. It does not say if it
is cpu or what.

I have a nice case with 4 fans in it

Fan 1: PSU (actually two fans in the PSU)
Fan 2: Side of case, IN, hits the CPU area
Fan 3: Top of case, IN, hits the CPU/Video card area
Fan 4: Front of case, IN, hits the drives (4 x SATA)

The ASUS Probe shows:

CPU Temp (P4/3.2ghz/Ht) 39c/104F
MB Temp 30/86
CPU Fan 2500~3000
Power Fan 2500~3000

When I play Far Cry or Counter Strike, the case temp hits 109F, never
paid attention to the rest. Once I stop, in about 20 seconds, it's back
to the normal values shown above.

The two temps, when side by side, are Celsius and Fahrenheit.

 

[Wilson]

I most not have something connected correctly then, because all Asus Probe
is showing for me is the CPU temp. Everything else is greyed out, except the
chasis fan which say Not Applicable.

 

[Leythos]

I most not have something connected correctly then, because all Asus Probe
is showing for me is the CPU temp. Everything else is greyed out, except the
chasis fan which say Not Applicable.

I've not followed your posts long enough to know what motherboard you
have, but it could be that your motherboard doesn't have a temp probe
for the board, only for the CPU.

As for the FANS, if they are not the three wire type you won't get a Fan
Speed value.

 

[Wilson]

Just to update you guys. I separated the hard drives, I moved the pci card
over one slot, I opened one of the 3.5" bays on my front panel, and I put in
those fancy rounded cables in place of the ribbon cables, and the computer
is about 3 inches off the carpet.

I now have a gaping 3.5" hole on the front panel though where the floppy
used to be. Wonder if that is even necessary? Also, it seems like this would
work against the fan on the PSU. I would think the front panel fan is to
bring in new air, push it to the back, and along with the PSU fan both
should try to push the air out the back of the comp, where I have alot of
little vents.

 

[Bill]

Just to update you guys. I separated the hard drives, I moved the pci card
over one slot, I opened one of the 3.5" bays on my front panel, and I put in
those fancy rounded cables in place of the ribbon cables, and the computer
is about 3 inches off the carpet.

I now have a gaping 3.5" hole on the front panel though where the floppy
used to be. Wonder if that is even necessary?

Which, the hole or the floppy?

Also, it seems like this would
work against the fan on the PSU.
Why?

I would think the front panel fan is to
bring in new air,
Yes.

push it to the back,
Yes.

and along with the PSU fan both
should try to push the air out the back of the comp, where I have alot of
little vents.

No, the PSU should be sucking the warm air from in the case and
pushing it out the back of the PSU. If it isn't, it's wrong.

Bill