This PC any good for...

[CWatters]

Question for those in the UK really...

A relative has been offered a new PC by a local store. She's keen to
purchase from them as they provide good local support. She doesn't play
computer games so would this be a reasonable machine for surfing and word
processing these days? What about the chances of it running Vista in the
future?

AMD Semperon 3500 128k cache
1GByte DDR2 PC2-5300
80GByte ATA
19" Samtron Analog LCD 1280 x 1024
Integrated graphics with PCIe support
Microsoft Cordless wheel mouse
Wired keyboard
DVD drive (not a writer)

Windows XP home (OEM CD supplied)
Microsoft Works Suite 2006 (to get MS Word 2002)

3 year onsite warranty

They want £794 inc vat.

I had a quick look on the web and the parts cost to build the myself is
around £600-650

 

[Todd H.]

Question for those in the UK really...

A relative has been offered a new PC by a local store. She's keen to
purchase from them as they provide good local support. She doesn't play
computer games so would this be a reasonable machine for surfing and word
processing these days? What about the chances of it running Vista in the
future?

AMD Semperon 3500 128k cache
1GByte DDR2 PC2-5300

It's plenty for that workload.

I suspect that it'll run Vista just fine. At most it won't run the
spiffy Aero interface.

But I'd leave Vista out of the equation. the upgrade will be quite
expensive anyway, it has no real killer features except some promising
security architecture improvements.

 

[Arno Wagner]

Question for those in the UK really...

A relative has been offered a new PC by a local store. She's keen to
purchase from them as they provide good local support. She doesn't play
computer games so would this be a reasonable machine for surfing and word
processing these days? What about the chances of it running Vista in the
future?

AMD Semperon 3500 128k cache
1GByte DDR2 PC2-5300
80GByte ATA
19" Samtron Analog LCD 1280 x 1024
Integrated graphics with PCIe support
Microsoft Cordless wheel mouse
Wired keyboard
DVD drive (not a writer)

Windows XP home (OEM CD supplied)
Microsoft Works Suite 2006 (to get MS Word 2002)

3 year onsite warranty

They want £794 inc vat.

Looks reasonable. Persnally I would go with a wored mouse, since the
wireless ones are heavier and may cause writs problems in a few years.

As for Vista, the only reasonable course of action now is to either do
without or wait two months and buy a computer with Vista. But Vista
may still have its infancy problems, so I am not sure how wise it
is using it before SP1...

Arno

 

[Rod Speed]

Question for those in the UK really...

A relative has been offered a new PC by a local store. She's
keen to purchase from them as they provide good local support.
She doesn't play computer games so would this be a reasonable
machine for surfing and word processing these days?

Anything new does that stuff fine.

What about the chances of it running Vista in the future?

Reasonable. Better to get one with a Vista ready guarantee tho.

AMD Semperon 3500 128k cache
1GByte DDR2 PC2-5300
80GByte ATA
19" Samtron Analog LCD 1280 x 1024
Integrated graphics with PCIe support
Microsoft Cordless wheel mouse
Wired keyboard
DVD drive (not a writer)

Thats not great, DVD writers cost so little nowdays it
makes no sense. You need something for decent backup.

Windows XP home (OEM CD supplied)
Microsoft Works Suite 2006 (to get MS Word 2002)

3 year onsite warranty

They want £794 inc vat.

The price isnt anything special.

I had a quick look on the web and the parts
cost to build the myself is around £600-650

Yeah, but then you have to do the support etc.

Corse you may have to do that anyway even if she buys if from the store too.

 

[Fred]

Looks reasonable. Persnally I would go with a wored mouse,

I wouldnt.

since the wireless ones are heavier

So what ?

and may cause writs problems in a few years.

I've had a lot more wired mouse failures than
cordless mouse failures, all failures of the cord itself.

 

[CWatters]

Thanks for the reply..

Thats not great, DVD writers cost so little nowdays it
makes no sense. You need something for decent backup.

Yeah I suggested a writer but they made it an option for some reason.

The price isnt anything special.


Yeah, but then you have to do the support etc.

yeah I figured if it wasn't a really outstanding deal but not that
unreasonable either. They have provided good support in the past.

Colin

 

[CJT]

I wouldnt.




So what ?




I've had a lot more wired mouse failures than
cordless mouse failures, all failures of the cord itself.

What are you doing with them? I have _never_ seen a mouse wire fail,
and I haven't pampered them.

 

[Fred]

What are you doing with them? I have _never_ seen a mouse wire fail,

Plenty of others have, its by far the most common failure mode with wired mice.

 

[Arno Wagner]

I wouldnt.

So what ?

I've had a lot more wired mouse failures than
cordless mouse failures, all failures of the cord itself.

You can only have one complete wrist failure. Then the
hand is useless...

Arno

 

[Arno Wagner]

news:[email protected]...

Thanks for the reply..

Yeah I suggested a writer but they made it an option for some reason.

I think DVD writers are just a nuisance. Look at all the
recomendations for choosing media that actually work.
Even the best ones seem to give you only about 95%
success rate or so. I would say that writabke DVD never
reached maturity because of fundamental design flaws.
The only exception is DVD-RAM....

yeah I figured if it wasn't a really outstanding deal but not that
unreasonable either. They have provided good support in the past.

Then go with it. Good support is worth a lot!

Arno

 

[David A. Flory]

I think DVD writers are just a nuisance. Look at all the
recomendations for choosing media that actually work.
Even the best ones seem to give you only about 95%
success rate or so. I would say that writabke DVD never
reached maturity because of fundamental design flaws.
The only exception is DVD-RAM....

There is a lot of really bad media (and writers) out there. It's still
decent technology, and DVD+R theoretically has fixed a lot of the design
flaws in DVD-R.

I've burned more Verbatim DVD+-R's that I can easily count with my
Plextor drive, and the only coasters I've had were my fault (buffer
underrun from excessive multitasking ).

D.

 

[Paul Rubin]

I think DVD writers are just a nuisance. Look at all the
recomendations for choosing media that actually work.
Even the best ones seem to give you only about 95%
success rate or so. I would say that writabke DVD never
reached maturity because of fundamental design flaws.
The only exception is DVD-RAM....

Do you mean to say DVD-RAM works better than DVD +/- R? Hmm.

 

[Arno Wagner]

There is a lot of really bad media (and writers) out there. It's still
decent technology, and DVD+R theoretically has fixed a lot of the design
flaws in DVD-R.

I've burned more Verbatim DVD+-R's that I can easily count with my
Plextor drive, and the only coasters I've had were my fault (buffer
underrun from excessive multitasking ).

Oh, I agree that _instances_ of this technology can be sound. But
the technology itself is fundamentally flawed, because it was never
specified in a way that you can just get any writer and any media
and have decent quality equipment with that. It can be done right,
as for example MOD and DVD-RAM shows.

A technology for the mass-market is not mature, if it needs expert
knowledge to make it work right....

Arno

 

[Arno Wagner]

Do you mean to say DVD-RAM works better than DVD +/- R? Hmm.

DVD-RAM media are ISO standardized. Anyone works in any DVD-RAM drive.
They were intended for video and normal archiving, as a cheaper
alternative to MOD.

They do not the incredibly stupid method for the other writable DVDs,
were the writer has to have a table, find a medum in this table and
then hopefully knows how to burn it. Instead the medium has to have
specific properties and can tell the writer in a standardized way
how to burn it right. And it is sectored (i.e. HDD like) from the
start.

The trouble with DVD-RAM is, that only very few people seem to be
willing to spand a bit more to keep their data safe. Or maybe that
many people do not understand that DVD-<writeble whatever except RAM>
is unreliable. Because if this, there are very few RVR-RAM drives out
there, and most only take the less rliable non-cartridge disks.

Arno

 

[David A. Flory]

Oh, I agree that _instances_ of this technology can be sound. But
the technology itself is fundamentally flawed, because it was never
specified in a way that you can just get any writer and any media
and have decent quality equipment with that. It can be done right,
as for example MOD and DVD-RAM shows.

A technology for the mass-market is not mature, if it needs expert
knowledge to make it work right....

Arno

Agreed. A big part of the problem is that the mass-market just doesn't
seem to care, or else has really low expectations.

I don't understand how Sony and Memorex (to name two big offenders) even
stay in the optical media market, but that's all you can buy in most
stores. A lot of people seem not to care if their disks go bad in a
week, if they even burn at all. You can pay about the same for azo-dye
media from Tayo-Uden or Verbatim that will last for years.

DVD-RAM is finally catching up, fortunately. It used to be hard to even
find a burner, and the disks are getting faster, although they're still
hard to find. I'll be glad to switch to it entirely once the disks get
cheap enough.

I'm sure it would be possible to make bad DVD-RAM media, and there
probably would be a lot of it if it were a mass-market product.

One advantage to using "expert" technology like DVD-RAM or SCSI is that
the hardware companies know they have to deliver a decent product, since
their customers will know the difference. Of course, the downside is
the premium price...

Dave

 

[Paul Rubin]

DVD-RAM media are ISO standardized. Anyone works in any DVD-RAM drive.
They were intended for video and normal archiving, as a cheaper
alternative to MOD.

I've just always figured that any erasable medium was going to be less
stable than write-once media. I certainly had lousy results with
CD-RW the couple of times I tried it, vs. generally satisfactory
experience with CD-R.

They do not the incredibly stupid method for the other writable DVDs,
were the writer has to have a table, find a medum in this table and
then hopefully knows how to burn it.

That sounds nuts! I can't believe it's as bad as that. New brands of
media come out all the time and burners don't need to be updated.

The trouble with DVD-RAM is, that only very few people seem to be
willing to spand a bit more to keep their data safe. Or maybe that
many people do not understand that DVD-<writeble whatever except RAM>
is unreliable. Because if this, there are very few RVR-RAM drives out
there, and most only take the less rliable non-cartridge disks.

It does look like the media are somewhat more expensive than DVD +/- R:

http://meritline.com/dvd-ram-blank-media-panasonic-optodisc-mini.html

there are both cartridge and non-cartridge type media but yes, most
drives don't take cartridge. Here's some that apparently do:

http://meritline.com/panasonic-sw-9574-c-16x-super-multi-dvd-drive.html

Maybe I'll buy one. They cost a lot more relatively speaking, but
they're affordable in absolute terms. I've figured though that sooner
or later I'll have to bite the bullet and buy a tape drive. Right now
I do my archiving on ATA hard disks, which just seems like asking for it.

 

[Fred]

You can only have one complete wrist failure. Then the hand is useless...

Nope, then you get a wrist replacement, silly.

 

[Fred]

I think DVD writers are just a nuisance. Look at all the
recomendations for choosing media that actually work.
Even the best ones seem to give you only about 95%
success rate or so. I would say that writabke DVD never
reached maturity because of fundamental design flaws.

Some made the same claim about CDs too.

The only exception is DVD-RAM....

Nope, a decent burner will burn all but the worst crap.

 

[Arno Wagner]

I've just always figured that any erasable medium was going to be less
stable than write-once media. I certainly had lousy results with
CD-RW the couple of times I tried it, vs. generally satisfactory
experience with CD-R.

That sounds nuts! I can't believe it's as bad as that. New brands of
media come out all the time and burners don't need to be updated.

Well, if they are not updated, they fall back to some heuristics and
your chances of a successful burn drop. So, yes, it is as bad
as this.

It does look like the media are somewhat more expensive than DVD +/- R:

there are both cartridge and non-cartridge type media but yes, most
drives don't take cartridge. Here's some that apparently do:

Maybe I'll buy one. They cost a lot more relatively speaking, but
they're affordable in absolute terms. I've figured though that sooner
or later I'll have to bite the bullet and buy a tape drive. Right now
I do my archiving on ATA hard disks, which just seems like asking for it.

For the really critical stuff, I still use a 3.5" MOD. Now 8 years old
and still ultra-reliable.

Arno

 

[Arno Wagner]

Some made the same claim about CDs too.

Nope, a decent burner will burn all but the worst crap.

What, please, is a ''decent burner''? Any DVD-RAM burner
will give good results with any DVD-RAM. No finding of a
''decent'' one required.

Arno