Table of contents and marking part of a paragraph

[Gnibtay]

I am having tremendous problems with Tables of Contents in Word 2003. I want
to mark only part of the Paragraph to include in the table of Contents, and
want to use it in connection with automated outline numbering. A very simple
request that has been incredibly easy to do in WordPerfect for well over a
decade. Suzanne I've read your post about using Style Separator, and it
tracks what my book says (Word 2002 for Law Firms). However, When I try to
use Style Separator to mark part of a paragraph (let's say it is automated
level Paragraph "a"), it actually causes the paragraph to DISAPPEAR from the
Table of Contents. Secondly, it removes the automated number of the
FOLLOWING paragraph (formerly known as "b"), and causes it to join the text
of "a". The next following paragraph (still labeled "c") then comes
immediately after "a". if I click Style Separator again, "c" joins the text
of "a" and all of it disappears from the TOC, and the next paragraph becomes
"d". I could wipe out my whole outline by proceeding in this manner.
Furthermore, it then seems to DISABLE MY ENTER KEY. It seems to convert the
Enter key into a Hidden Paragraph key and there is no way out. The Enter key
no longer works, unless I repeatedly hit Ctrl-z to undo all the prior
invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts. This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you help me?

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

It sounds as if you aren't using the style separator correctly. As I
understand it, you insert the style separator, then apply the heading style
to the part you want included in the TOC and the body text style to the
rest. There is a KB article you may find helpful: "How to use outline levels
to create a table of contents (TOC) in Word 2003 and in Word 2002" at
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/285050/

 

[Gnibtay]

Thank you Suzanne & God bless you for providing this help! I don't have time
to try this today, having lost a day and a half to fiddling with the
formatting in Word. I'll try this out and let you know how it works. I've
seen the articles on Heading Styles, and something tells me I have to get
those properly formatted first.

 

[Gnibtay]

OK now that too is really helpful, to know how this feature is "thinking".
Or more like it, how MS SW engineers think that writers think. and so it
increments the outline level if you format the following text with the same
level. Therefore what I see that you're saying I need a normal paragraph
with the same formatting as the outline level but minus the outline level
numbers, for the text that follows the hidden Paragraph.

I am committed to making a working template for myself, no matter how
difficult Word makes it. So, following the advice of the MVP articles I have
just very tediously created 9 levels of outline level "styles" that number
the way I want them to. I endured many many instances of Word resetting
everything after I had it all set (I had to reset formatting of one complete
set of "Outlne & numbering" levels, even though we were advised to avoid this
menu if at all possible, because this seemed to be what was resetting the
Styles.. Then trying to save to template was a major headache, with it
refusing to save despite saving over and over again, and then finally it did
with no apparent explanation). So now I seem to have a tenuous set of styles
with a fragile stability for outline levels. Now I see that I need a version
of "Normal" text without the numbering, for each level (because I want the
indenting to match the settings for the level) to get around the incrementing
problem. If I get that to work, then I'll move on to creating heading styles.

I marvel at just how obstinately difficult Word makes this..Have they ever
considered scrapping their automated numbering system and learning something
from the beautifully simple model implemented by WordPerfect? I can always
dream.

Thank you both for your replies they were both so extremely helpful. I'll
keep you posted of how I'm doing on my quest to design a basic template..

When you use the style separator, it _hides_ the next paragraph mark it
encounters. So you need to create the paragraph styles separately, for
example,

Numbered HEADING 4[paragraph mark]
Unnumbered body text[paragraph mark]

Then place your cursor anywhere in the heading paragraph and apply the style
separator. If you have formatting marks showing, you'll see (in W2003) red
dashed lines around the heading paragraph mark, but the text won't have moved.
Once you hide the formatting marks the body text paragraph will flow into
the same line as the heading.

Be aware that the space before and after settings from the heading style is
applied to the merged paragraph. For example, if the space after the
heading is 14 pts and that after the body text is less, W2003 will place 14
pts after the merged paragraph. (Unfortunately, W2007 places that space after
the first line of the merged paragraph.) If you don't want that, just be
sure to make the spacing compatible.

HTH,
PamC

I am having tremendous problems with Tables of Contents in Word 2003. I want
to mark only part of the Paragraph to include in the table of Contents, and
want to use it in connection with automated outline numbering. A very simple
request that has been incredibly easy to do in WordPerfect for well over a
decade. Suzanne I've read your post about using Style Separator, and it
tracks what my book says (Word 2002 for Law Firms). However, When I try to
use Style Separator to mark part of a paragraph (let's say it is automated
level Paragraph "a"), it actually causes the paragraph to DISAPPEAR from the
Table of Contents. Secondly, it removes the automated number of the
FOLLOWING paragraph (formerly known as "b"), and causes it to join the text
of "a". The next following paragraph (still labeled "c") then comes
immediately after "a". if I click Style Separator again, "c" joins the text
of "a" and all of it disappears from the TOC, and the next paragraph becomes
"d". I could wipe out my whole outline by proceeding in this manner.
Furthermore, it then seems to DISABLE MY ENTER KEY. It seems to convert the
Enter key into a Hidden Paragraph key and there is no way out. The Enter key
no longer works, unless I repeatedly hit Ctrl-z to undo all the prior
invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts. This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you help me?

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Note that, in addition to the List Number and List Bullet series of styles
(which can be linked to an outline-numbered list), there is a series of List
Continue styles that have matching indents but no number or bullet.
Obviously, these can be modified to match other paragraph settings of the
associated numbered or bulleted styles.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

OK now that too is really helpful, to know how this feature is "thinking".
Or more like it, how MS SW engineers think that writers think. and so it
increments the outline level if you format the following text with the
same
level. Therefore what I see that you're saying I need a normal paragraph
with the same formatting as the outline level but minus the outline level
numbers, for the text that follows the hidden Paragraph.

I am committed to making a working template for myself, no matter how
difficult Word makes it. So, following the advice of the MVP articles I
have
just very tediously created 9 levels of outline level "styles" that number
the way I want them to. I endured many many instances of Word resetting
everything after I had it all set (I had to reset formatting of one
complete
set of "Outlne & numbering" levels, even though we were advised to avoid
this
menu if at all possible, because this seemed to be what was resetting the
Styles.. Then trying to save to template was a major headache, with it
refusing to save despite saving over and over again, and then finally it
did
with no apparent explanation). So now I seem to have a tenuous set of
styles
with a fragile stability for outline levels. Now I see that I need a
version
of "Normal" text without the numbering, for each level (because I want the
indenting to match the settings for the level) to get around the
incrementing
problem. If I get that to work, then I'll move on to creating heading
styles.

I marvel at just how obstinately difficult Word makes this..Have they ever
considered scrapping their automated numbering system and learning
something
from the beautifully simple model implemented by WordPerfect? I can
always
dream.

Thank you both for your replies they were both so extremely helpful. I'll
keep you posted of how I'm doing on my quest to design a basic template..

When you use the style separator, it _hides_ the next paragraph mark it
encounters. So you need to create the paragraph styles separately, for
example,

Numbered HEADING 4[paragraph mark]
Unnumbered body text[paragraph mark]

Then place your cursor anywhere in the heading paragraph and apply the
style
separator. If you have formatting marks showing, you'll see (in W2003)
red
dashed lines around the heading paragraph mark, but the text won't have
moved.
Once you hide the formatting marks the body text paragraph will flow
into
the same line as the heading.

Be aware that the space before and after settings from the heading style
is
applied to the merged paragraph. For example, if the space after the
heading is 14 pts and that after the body text is less, W2003 will place
14
pts after the merged paragraph. (Unfortunately, W2007 places that space
after
the first line of the merged paragraph.) If you don't want that, just
be
sure to make the spacing compatible.

HTH,
PamC

I am having tremendous problems with Tables of Contents in Word 2003. I
want
to mark only part of the Paragraph to include in the table of Contents,
and
want to use it in connection with automated outline numbering. A very
simple
request that has been incredibly easy to do in WordPerfect for well over
a
decade. Suzanne I've read your post about using Style Separator, and it
tracks what my book says (Word 2002 for Law Firms). However, When I try
to
use Style Separator to mark part of a paragraph (let's say it is
automated
level Paragraph "a"), it actually causes the paragraph to DISAPPEAR from
the
Table of Contents. Secondly, it removes the automated number of the
FOLLOWING paragraph (formerly known as "b"), and causes it to join the
text
of "a". The next following paragraph (still labeled "c") then comes
immediately after "a". if I click Style Separator again, "c" joins the
text
of "a" and all of it disappears from the TOC, and the next paragraph
becomes
"d". I could wipe out my whole outline by proceeding in this manner.
Furthermore, it then seems to DISABLE MY ENTER KEY. It seems to convert
the
Enter key into a Hidden Paragraph key and there is no way out. The
Enter key
no longer works, unless I repeatedly hit Ctrl-z to undo all the prior
invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts.
This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you
help me?

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Another gotcha is that if you want the paragraph to be justified, you must
make the heading style justified as well; otherwise the first line of the
paragraph won't be justified.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

OK now that too is really helpful, to know how this feature is "thinking".
Or more like it, how MS SW engineers think that writers think. and so it
increments the outline level if you format the following text with the
same
level. Therefore what I see that you're saying I need a normal paragraph
with the same formatting as the outline level but minus the outline level
numbers, for the text that follows the hidden Paragraph.

Well, yes back in my hard type days we did sometimes space before a run-in
heading (but never after the paragraph it introduced); so I'd guess that
the
programmers were trying to keep that functionality. I mentioned it
because
the behavior was an embarrassing gotcha for me the first time I used the
style separator.

Actually what I'm saying is that if you want all of your regular text
(non-
heading) paragraphs to have the same spacing, you need to adjust the
spacing
for the heading style paragraph you are running into it. Other than that,
the
separated styles don't have to be the same.

[...]

Thank you both for your replies they were both so extremely helpful. I'll
keep you posted of how I'm doing on my quest to design a basic template..

You're welcome

Good luck,
PamC

When you use the style separator, it _hides_ the next paragraph mark it
encounters. So you need to create the paragraph styles separately, for

[quoted text clipped - 38 lines]

invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts.
This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you
help me?

 

[Gnibtay]

Thank you this reply is also very helpful. Your explanation helps make sense
of what was otherwise totally incomprehensible behavior of the Style
Separator. I am making incremental progress in learning how this works.
I've taken a step backward from the TOC and tried to design Level Styles that
work for me. Then I'm putting them into a self created Template, using John
McGhie's Article on the Word MVP site as a guide. Then I will try to get the
TOC to work the way I want, with the invaluable insights I have received from
your and Suzanne's feedback. Thanks again.

OK now that too is really helpful, to know how this feature is "thinking".
Or more like it, how MS SW engineers think that writers think. and so it
increments the outline level if you format the following text with the same
level. Therefore what I see that you're saying I need a normal paragraph
with the same formatting as the outline level but minus the outline level
numbers, for the text that follows the hidden Paragraph.

Well, yes back in my hard type days we did sometimes space before a run-in
heading (but never after the paragraph it introduced); so I'd guess that the
programmers were trying to keep that functionality. I mentioned it because
the behavior was an embarrassing gotcha for me the first time I used the
style separator.

Actually what I'm saying is that if you want all of your regular text (non-
heading) paragraphs to have the same spacing, you need to adjust the spacing
for the heading style paragraph you are running into it. Other than that, the
separated styles don't have to be the same.

[...]

Thank you both for your replies they were both so extremely helpful. I'll
keep you posted of how I'm doing on my quest to design a basic template..

You're welcome

Good luck,
PamC

When you use the style separator, it _hides_ the next paragraph mark it
encounters. So you need to create the paragraph styles separately, for

[quoted text clipped - 38 lines]

invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts. This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you help me?

 

[Gnibtay]

Thank you Suzanne; this is another extremely useful comment about something I
didn't realize was an option. Can I get to these "List Continue" styles
through the "Styles & Formatting" pane?
Any other thoughts you have, please keep them coming. These are helping me
break through my inability to comprehend Word's approach to writing.

Gnibtay

Note that, in addition to the List Number and List Bullet series of styles
(which can be linked to an outline-numbered list), there is a series of List
Continue styles that have matching indents but no number or bullet.
Obviously, these can be modified to match other paragraph settings of the
associated numbered or bulleted styles.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

OK now that too is really helpful, to know how this feature is "thinking".
Or more like it, how MS SW engineers think that writers think. and so it
increments the outline level if you format the following text with the
same
level. Therefore what I see that you're saying I need a normal paragraph
with the same formatting as the outline level but minus the outline level
numbers, for the text that follows the hidden Paragraph.

I am committed to making a working template for myself, no matter how
difficult Word makes it. So, following the advice of the MVP articles I
have
just very tediously created 9 levels of outline level "styles" that number
the way I want them to. I endured many many instances of Word resetting
everything after I had it all set (I had to reset formatting of one
complete
set of "Outlne & numbering" levels, even though we were advised to avoid
this
menu if at all possible, because this seemed to be what was resetting the
Styles.. Then trying to save to template was a major headache, with it
refusing to save despite saving over and over again, and then finally it
did
with no apparent explanation). So now I seem to have a tenuous set of
styles
with a fragile stability for outline levels. Now I see that I need a
version
of "Normal" text without the numbering, for each level (because I want the
indenting to match the settings for the level) to get around the
incrementing
problem. If I get that to work, then I'll move on to creating heading
styles.

I marvel at just how obstinately difficult Word makes this..Have they ever
considered scrapping their automated numbering system and learning
something
from the beautifully simple model implemented by WordPerfect? I can
always
dream.

Thank you both for your replies they were both so extremely helpful. I'll
keep you posted of how I'm doing on my quest to design a basic template..

When you use the style separator, it _hides_ the next paragraph mark it
encounters. So you need to create the paragraph styles separately, for
example,

Numbered HEADING 4[paragraph mark]
Unnumbered body text[paragraph mark]

Then place your cursor anywhere in the heading paragraph and apply the
style
separator. If you have formatting marks showing, you'll see (in W2003)
red
dashed lines around the heading paragraph mark, but the text won't have
moved.
Once you hide the formatting marks the body text paragraph will flow
into
the same line as the heading.

Be aware that the space before and after settings from the heading style
is
applied to the merged paragraph. For example, if the space after the
heading is 14 pts and that after the body text is less, W2003 will place
14
pts after the merged paragraph. (Unfortunately, W2007 places that space
after
the first line of the merged paragraph.) If you don't want that, just
be
sure to make the spacing compatible.

HTH,
PamC


Gnibtay wrote:
I am having tremendous problems with Tables of Contents in Word 2003. I
want
to mark only part of the Paragraph to include in the table of Contents,
and
want to use it in connection with automated outline numbering. A very
simple
request that has been incredibly easy to do in WordPerfect for well over
a
decade. Suzanne I've read your post about using Style Separator, and it
tracks what my book says (Word 2002 for Law Firms). However, When I try
to
use Style Separator to mark part of a paragraph (let's say it is
automated
level Paragraph "a"), it actually causes the paragraph to DISAPPEAR from
the
Table of Contents. Secondly, it removes the automated number of the
FOLLOWING paragraph (formerly known as "b"), and causes it to join the
text
of "a". The next following paragraph (still labeled "c") then comes
immediately after "a". if I click Style Separator again, "c" joins the
text
of "a" and all of it disappears from the TOC, and the next paragraph
becomes
"d". I could wipe out my whole outline by proceeding in this manner.
Furthermore, it then seems to DISABLE MY ENTER KEY. It seems to convert
the
Enter key into a Hidden Paragraph key and there is no way out. The
Enter key
no longer works, unless I repeatedly hit Ctrl-z to undo all the prior
invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts.
This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you
help me?

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

The easiest way to access a style that is not currently displayed in the
Styles & Formatting task pane is to press Shift while clicking the down
arrow beside the Style dropdown on the Formatting toolbar. This forces the
Style dropdown to show All Styles (and not the pseudo-All Styles of the task
pane). Once you've used the style in your document, you should see it in the
task pane.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

Thank you Suzanne; this is another extremely useful comment about
something I
didn't realize was an option. Can I get to these "List Continue" styles
through the "Styles & Formatting" pane?
Any other thoughts you have, please keep them coming. These are helping
me
break through my inability to comprehend Word's approach to writing.

Gnibtay

Note that, in addition to the List Number and List Bullet series of
styles
(which can be linked to an outline-numbered list), there is a series of
List
Continue styles that have matching indents but no number or bullet.
Obviously, these can be modified to match other paragraph settings of the
associated numbered or bulleted styles.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA

OK now that too is really helpful, to know how this feature is
"thinking".
Or more like it, how MS SW engineers think that writers think. and so
it
increments the outline level if you format the following text with the
same
level. Therefore what I see that you're saying I need a normal
paragraph
with the same formatting as the outline level but minus the outline
level
numbers, for the text that follows the hidden Paragraph.

I am committed to making a working template for myself, no matter how
difficult Word makes it. So, following the advice of the MVP articles
I
have
just very tediously created 9 levels of outline level "styles" that
number
the way I want them to. I endured many many instances of Word
resetting
everything after I had it all set (I had to reset formatting of one
complete
set of "Outlne & numbering" levels, even though we were advised to
avoid
this
menu if at all possible, because this seemed to be what was resetting
the
Styles.. Then trying to save to template was a major headache, with it
refusing to save despite saving over and over again, and then finally
it
did
with no apparent explanation). So now I seem to have a tenuous set of
styles
with a fragile stability for outline levels. Now I see that I need a
version
of "Normal" text without the numbering, for each level (because I want
the
indenting to match the settings for the level) to get around the
incrementing
problem. If I get that to work, then I'll move on to creating heading
styles.

I marvel at just how obstinately difficult Word makes this..Have they
ever
considered scrapping their automated numbering system and learning
something
from the beautifully simple model implemented by WordPerfect? I can
always
dream.

Thank you both for your replies they were both so extremely helpful.
I'll
keep you posted of how I'm doing on my quest to design a basic
template..
:

When you use the style separator, it _hides_ the next paragraph mark
it
encounters. So you need to create the paragraph styles separately,
for
example,

Numbered HEADING 4[paragraph mark]
Unnumbered body text[paragraph mark]

Then place your cursor anywhere in the heading paragraph and apply the
style
separator. If you have formatting marks showing, you'll see (in W2003)
red
dashed lines around the heading paragraph mark, but the text won't
have
moved.
Once you hide the formatting marks the body text paragraph will
flow
into
the same line as the heading.

Be aware that the space before and after settings from the heading
style
is
applied to the merged paragraph. For example, if the space after
the
heading is 14 pts and that after the body text is less, W2003 will
place
14
pts after the merged paragraph. (Unfortunately, W2007 places that
space
after
the first line of the merged paragraph.) If you don't want that,
just
be
sure to make the spacing compatible.

HTH,
PamC


Gnibtay wrote:
I am having tremendous problems with Tables of Contents in Word 2003.
I
want
to mark only part of the Paragraph to include in the table of
Contents,
and
want to use it in connection with automated outline numbering. A
very
simple
request that has been incredibly easy to do in WordPerfect for well
over
a
decade. Suzanne I've read your post about using Style Separator, and
it
tracks what my book says (Word 2002 for Law Firms). However, When I
try
to
use Style Separator to mark part of a paragraph (let's say it is
automated
level Paragraph "a"), it actually causes the paragraph to DISAPPEAR
from
the
Table of Contents. Secondly, it removes the automated number of the
FOLLOWING paragraph (formerly known as "b"), and causes it to join
the
text
of "a". The next following paragraph (still labeled "c") then comes
immediately after "a". if I click Style Separator again, "c" joins
the
text
of "a" and all of it disappears from the TOC, and the next paragraph
becomes
"d". I could wipe out my whole outline by proceeding in this manner.
Furthermore, it then seems to DISABLE MY ENTER KEY. It seems to
convert
the
Enter key into a Hidden Paragraph key and there is no way out. The
Enter key
no longer works, unless I repeatedly hit Ctrl-z to undo all the prior
invisible marks and eventually, if I'm lucky it eventually reverts.
This
makes me deeply regret that my firm ever converted to Word. Can you
help me?