Pre-built liquid cooled rigs

[Adam Leinss]

Hi everyone.

Plan to get a new computer next year. Was looking around on the
Internet for a cheap PC for my parents and decided I should start
looking for myself. Decided that I would like to go liquid cooled this
time, so I decided to look for builders offering this feature.
However, it appears very few places offer this. Either they use some
"el cheapo" liquid cooling system that just cools the CPU or the prices
are out of this world that only Donald Trump can afford.

Take the example of All American Computers (www.aacdirect.com). Their
cheapest liquid cooled rig is $2579 and that's with the bare essentials
(granted, the rig looks VERY cool). The recommended TJ07 liquid cooled
rig at Puget Computer Systems is $5700!

I then did a pseudo order at Newegg and added up all the parts I would
want (3 SATA Seagates and RAID card for RAID5 setup). With liquid
cooling it come out to be about $2650. At Puget Computer Systems, I
tried to configure a similar system and without the RAID configuration,
I was already at $3000! Adding the RAID stuff would bump the price to

$4000.

So my question is: why so high? Monarch Computer Systems charge $75
for the build labor. Since liquid cooling takes some extra steps, I
can understand $150 for build labor, but why such the price difference?
You would think that these computer places would buy certain pieces in
bulk and get good pricing on them.

OK, another question. Has anyone here every bought a bunch of
components from Newegg in one go to build a PC? How much was shipping
and did everything work or did you have to RMA this and that? Are
there any online retailers that do a decent liquid cooling step and are
reputable (and reasonably priced?).

My fear is ending up with $2500 of parts and not getting them to work
together if I go the home built route.

Thoughts?

Adam

 

[deko]

Plan to get a new computer next year. Was looking around on the

Internet for a cheap PC for my parents and decided I should start
looking for myself. Decided that I would like to go liquid cooled this
time, so I decided to look for builders offering this feature.
However, it appears very few places offer this. Either they use some
"el cheapo" liquid cooling system that just cools the CPU or the prices
are out of this world that only Donald Trump can afford.

Take the example of All American Computers (www.aacdirect.com). Their
cheapest liquid cooled rig is $2579 and that's with the bare essentials
(granted, the rig looks VERY cool). The recommended TJ07 liquid cooled
rig at Puget Computer Systems is $5700!

I then did a pseudo order at Newegg and added up all the parts I would
want (3 SATA Seagates and RAID card for RAID5 setup). With liquid
cooling it come out to be about $2650. At Puget Computer Systems, I
tried to configure a similar system and without the RAID configuration,
I was already at $3000! Adding the RAID stuff would bump the price to

So my question is: why so high? Monarch Computer Systems charge $75
for the build labor. Since liquid cooling takes some extra steps, I
can understand $150 for build labor, but why such the price difference?
You would think that these computer places would buy certain pieces in
bulk and get good pricing on them.

OK, another question. Has anyone here every bought a bunch of
components from Newegg in one go to build a PC? How much was shipping
and did everything work or did you have to RMA this and that? Are
there any online retailers that do a decent liquid cooling step and are
reputable (and reasonably priced?).

My fear is ending up with $2500 of parts and not getting them to work
together if I go the home built route.

I would not trust NewEgg. You'll end up with some half-wit teenager slapping
your system together and end up feeling frustrated and cheated when something
goes wrong. The best thing to do is your own homework. I've built dozens of
systems myself - it's child's play. Everything you need to know can be
researched on the web or in trade mags. Spend some time reading CPU magazine
(and others) to find best-of-breed components. Then research different vendors
(buying everything from one vendor is rarely the best way to go). Call their
support department and/or customer service. Ask a lot of questions. If they
are unwilling to take a pre-sale call or can't answer your questions, cross them
off your list. The quality of pre-sale service/support a vendor provides is the
best indicator of how you will be treated if you need real service after buying
from them.

Liquid cooling is the best way to go for a high-end system - cooler and quieter.
Also becoming more mainstream:
http://searchdatacenter.techtarget.com/originalContent/0,289142,sid80_gci1161823,00.html

Here's a review of the unit I would buy:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/zalman-res1plus_8.html

Zalman may have an even better model available now...

 

[Adam Leinss]

I would not trust NewEgg. You'll end up with some half-wit
teenager slapping your system together and end up feeling
frustrated and cheated when something goes wrong.

Thanks for your insight. I don't think Newegg builds systems, do they?
All I see for desktops there are the ones that are built by other
manufacturers. When I mentioned Newegg, I meant getting all the parts
individually and putting it together myself.

I've built dozens of systems myself -
it's child's play. Everything you need to know can be researched
on the web or in trade mags. Spend some time reading CPU magazine
(and others) to find best-of-breed components.

I have had a subscription to Maximum PC for the past 2 years. So I
browsed the back pages and found some attractive prices from various
builders. So I went to these web sites and I found out that they are
owned by the same company, yet act like they are completely
independent! Examples are www.cyberpowerpc.com and www.ibuypower.com.
You can tell this by the whois information for the domains and looking
at the components you can customize for each section. Why would a
company operate as two completely distinct ones?

In terms of homework, I'm using resellerratings.com before buying from
anyone!

Adam

 

[deko]

I would not trust NewEgg. You'll end up with some half-wit

Thanks for your insight. I don't think Newegg builds systems, do they?
All I see for desktops there are the ones that are built by other
manufacturers. When I mentioned Newegg, I meant getting all the parts
individually and putting it together myself.


I have had a subscription to Maximum PC for the past 2 years. So I
browsed the back pages and found some attractive prices from various
builders. So I went to these web sites and I found out that they are
owned by the same company, yet act like they are completely
independent! Examples are www.cyberpowerpc.com and www.ibuypower.com.
You can tell this by the whois information for the domains and looking
at the components you can customize for each section. Why would a
company operate as two completely distinct ones?

Whenever there's a question like "why would they do..." the answer is usually
money. Any hint of dishonest practice should be a big red flag.

Quality Cables USA Inc. (QCUSA) is another one to watch out for - coolgear.com
and usbgear.com. I tried buying from them once... never again. From what I can
tell, they are a Florida-based rip off.

 

[Brian K]

Whenever there's a question like "why would they do..." the answer is
usually money. Any hint of dishonest practice should be a big red flag.

Quality Cables USA Inc. (QCUSA) is another one to watch out for -
coolgear.com and usbgear.com. I tried buying from them once... never
again. From what I can tell, they are a Florida-based rip off.

For what it's worth I recall an article about how to build your own
liquid cooled system. I think it was Cnet or Tom's Hardware. They took
a regular case and sealed all the ventilation with some bonding
material. I think it was a polymer used in bonding auto body dents and
holes. Then they used ??? to insure that all the electrical components
were made waterproof. Finally, fresh cooking oil was added and the unit
was sealed.

I'm sorry I don't have all the details. But if you search, you can find
this information. The article also mentioned system integrators who
build reliable but inexpensive liquid cooled machines for those who
don't want to build their own.

--
________
To email me, Edit "blog" from my email address.
Brian M. Kochera
"Some mistakes are too much fun to only make once!"
View My Web Page: http://home.earthlink.net/~brian1951

 

[ticars]

Just curious, but why would you have to or even want to seal all the
ventilation???

And isn't the liquid that is used in those systems generally non
conductive and non corrosive? Making the connectors water proof
shouldn't really be neccesary, should it???

 

[Eric Furness]

Just curious, but why would you have to or even want to seal all the
ventilation???

And isn't the liquid that is used in those systems generally non
conductive and non corrosive? Making the connectors water proof
shouldn't really be neccesary, should it???

I also read the article. The entire case was filled with oil, like a
pole transformer.. he he

 

[job]

Get one of the aftermarket Water systems. They've made some of them idiot
proof to install.