PC Randomly Shutting Down

[muckshifter]

well, after that lot, I think we can safely say your CPU has "run in" and is coping very well indeed ... need to look elsewhere I'm afraid.

Back to the drawing board ...

 

[petermitchell44]

Thanks Muckshifter.Will you still be applying your brain towards my problem

 

[muckshifter]

no, not quite given up, just get frustrated with not having the PC here to "play" with

I have a few thoughts, but while I have the resources, spare parts, you will have to purchase them just to see if they are the cause ... I'm reluctant to suggest you spend good money on an "older" system.

I already suggested video card, isn't cheap as they can charge what they like for these old AGP cards ... I also won't rule out PSU and or even the motherboard ... but I would make sure first off that you have exhausted the "faulty" drivers avenue before spending good money.

can I just make sure of one thing ... the PC Freezes, just that, not restarts itself ?

does using the CAD (crtl+alt+del) do anything? is the mouse also frozen?

you mentioned duo core, yet the diagnostic program, speccy, plainly states P4 ... is this a "branded" PC? if so, can you give me make/model ect:

You can take the side of the case off, and give us a pic of the label on the PSU

pop PSI on your system, it won't "fix" anything, but will tell you what software you have installed is out-of-date, is holey, and easy links to updates ... you'll be surprised, let us know.

 

[floppybootstomp]

I saw some AGP grapics cards in PC World the other day for around 40 quid.

If it were me though the first thing I'd change would be the PSU, especially if it's one of those no name generic cheapies.

 

[petermitchell44]

Thanks.

Not apposed to a new Graphics Card. Would a ASUS EN8400GS 512MB or a nVidia GeForce 9500GT 512MB be the way to go.

I have been on the Intel site and they say I have the latest Bios update.

There are 2 basic faults.

1 The PC randomly shuts down and reboots , or doesn't reboot if I disable that feature.

2 The mouse freezes and if I open Task Manager via Ctrl Alt Del it shows that the cpu is frozen .No other keyboard keys are operative.I then have to switch off at the main button on the front of the tower and start again.

My cpu is a Prescott p4 that has Hyper Threading Technology activated so it shows up in Task Manager as 2 Virtual Cores.

My PC is not Branded it was built up by my local Shop that has a good reputation.

With the side off it is not possible to see the PSU details as they are obscured by an internal casing partition.

PSI indicates that I have 7 security threat programs installed. VLC Safari quicktime reader itunes flash player and air. All of these programs are new up to date installations.Do you really trust PSI.


Thanks again Peter

 

[muckshifter]

NO!! neither graphics card will fit your system, you need to look for AGP, (0.8 V / 1.5 V AGP 3.0 connector supporting 1x, 4x, or 8x AGP) an older standard not built into motherboards these days.

With the side off it is not possible to see the PSU details as they are obscured by an internal casing partition.

err, take the other side off ?? as you look at the back of the case, it's the right pannel, nice video here and here

The PC randomly shuts down and reboots , or doesn't reboot if I disable that feature

OK, you need to turn off the automatic reboot so you can actually see the BSOD error, of any ... chances are it will tell us enough about itself to let us troubleshoot further.

To change the recovery settings to disable automatic rebooting:
1. Right-click My Computer, and then click Properties.
2. Click the Advanced tab.
3. Under Startup and Recovery, click Settings to open the Startup and Recovery dialog box.
4. Clear the Automatically restart check box, and click OK the necessary number of times.
5. Restart your computer for the settings to take effect.

if we do the get a BSOD, please write down every last detail and post it for us, you can't take a screenshot, but a picture may help

PSI indicates that I have 7 security threat programs installed. VLC Safari quicktime reader itunes flash player and air. All of these programs are new up to date installations.Do you really trust PSI.

yes, I trust PSI, or it wouldn't be on my system ... I don't "trust" any of the programs you mentioned but do have the Adobe Air installed, and fully updated, 'cos the stupid BBC use it.

Secunia PSI is only a security advisor, it lets you know what out-of-date/security vulnerability of the software you need to update, even EOL (end-of-life) ... be aware when you update some programmes, using Adobe crap as an example, the "old" software are not always removed nor, in some cases even updated, but an entirely new version is installed so you end up with several versions of the same programme ... Adobe is really clever at this.

I found it easy to uninstall the offending programme, not always possible, and install the new updated version ... Take some time to learn how PSI works, it is very good at it's job. Don't use Beta software, as PSI will ignore it, do not use PSI beta, use the stable 1.5 version


With the new information you have now given us, I would be swapping out the PSU first. Need to know what is there to best advise on what to look for as a replacement. Although, I hope we "see" a BSOD that will better help us understand what is going on.

Have fun!!

 

[petermitchell44]

Hi Muckshifter thanks again.I intend to work through all the points you have mentioned but before I do I would like to make you aware of the latest new problem.

Since the weekend ,each time I conventionally shut down my PC ,when I start it up again it does not complete the start up sequence to the point where the desktop is being correctly displayed.The start up sequence stops where the screen is showing the picture as I have enclosed.Then if I do nothing but wait , after about 2 minutes the correct desktop will be displayed and all is ok.

During this 2 minute period the cpu continues running and I can move the mouse pointer ,but if I click on any of the icons in the quick start toolbar the pointer and the cpu will freeze.

The picture shows the desktop in white with desktop icons blued out.

 

[muckshifter]

that's a result of corruption in icon cache database ... I think

you will need to go to the hidden folder C:\Users\\AppData\Local\

to unhide the AppData folder, go to Organize ... Folder and Search Options / View tab, and select Show hidden files, folders and drives, and untick "Hide protected operating system files (Recommended)" ... no need to hide file folders, so leave it like that.

sorry, just remembered, in XP the folder is at ... C:\Documents and Settings\Your User Name\Local Settings\Application Data\Iconcache.db

go to that folder and delete ... IconCache.db ... or if you prefer rename it IconCashe.old

create a new file with the same name ... IconCache.db ... note the capitals, set it to Read Only attribute in Properties (if the file is not read only, the cache won’t be reset). Then restart the computer.

Remove the Read Only attribute of IconCache.db file, the icons cache will/should be refreshed. That hopefully will be that "error" sorted.

Why did it happen? 'cos you had a "crash" at the wrong time.

 

[petermitchell44]

I am having a problem replying to the thread.

I log in and type the reply and when I click Submit Reply it tells me I need to log in and I lose the reply I have typed.Is there a time limit between logging in and Submitting a Reply

 

[muckshifter]

no, there is no time limit, I logged in in 2002, may log out one day


never rains but it pours, ay?

 

[petermitchell44]

Right then can you help with this latest problem.I have to relog in every time I access PCreview !

 

[muckshifter]

Right then can you help with this latest problem.I have to relog in every time I access PCreview !

well, on that one you have me stumped.

I take it you just "log-on" in the "normal" way, come to this post and answer, or do you come here first?

Ian may be able to shed a light.

I have never used logout

 

[Taffycat]

Could it be that you have your browser set to automatically clear "cookies" when you close it? Just a thought.

 

[petermitchell44]

Hi Taffycat thats solved that problem.Thanks a lot Peter

 

[muckshifter]

Hi Taffycat thats solved that problem.Thanks a lot Peter

I didn't think, with all the problems you are having, that it would be that obvious.

Good catch TC

They ain't nothing wrong in ignoring cookies.

 

[petermitchell44]

Hi Muckshifter. Back to my problems.I found IconCache.db You said create a new file.I dont think I know how to do that.I know how to creat a new folder but Im sure thats not what you mean.


Is this Graphics Card the right sort of thing.
http://www.softhands.co.uk/video-ca...d-3450-agp-low-profile-ret-p-2023/language/en

http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=gEIQgiuZVAUvuIJa

I did take off the right hand side cover viewed from the back.There really is a support partition hiding the details written on the PSU.This Partition extends all the way forward and supports the two Optical Drives and the Harddrive.


I have now turned off the automatic reboot and am waiting patiently for the PC to turn itself off.It hasnt turned itself off in the last 24 hrs which is unusual.

I have carried out all but one of the advanced Secunia PSI recommendations and now have a score of 99%.The one remaining item is an end of life Microsoft Access 2000.this does not show up in Add/Remove so can I just delete the folder.Could this be the reason my PC has not switched itself off lately.

 

[petermitchell44]

I wouldnt be suprised to find that Im missing the obvious with all my problems.
Now realise that I picked the wrong Graphics Card again how about
http://www.google.co.uk/products/ca...log_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CC0Q8wIwAg#

 

[muckshifter]

Hi Muckshifter. Back to my problems.I found IconCache.db You said create a new file.I dont think I know how to do that.I know how to creat a new folder but Im sure thats not what you mean.

ah, yes, I'm getting too old for this job, well, my brain is ... it's a DBase file, doh!!

1. Close down all explorer.exe processes using the Task Manager, (CTRL+SHIFT+ESC) ... then right click any instance of explorer.exe & close (Or else it will create a faulty file during logoff/restart) your desktop may go "funny"
2. simply delete the IconCache.db
3. Use the Task Manager (CTRL+SHIFT+ESC) to launch the explorer.exe again (Or press CTRL+ALT+DEL to perform a restart/logoff)
4. When the Windows Explorer (explorer.exe) starts again, it will/should recreate a correct Icon-Cache file

Is this Graphics Card the right sort of thing.
http://www.softhands.co.uk/video-ca...d-3450-agp-low-profile-ret-p-2023/language/en

http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=gEIQgiuZVAUvuIJa

You don't need a "low-profile" card, but I see it comes with a std plate to use also, cant view the Asus site for some reason, my browser crashes.

As floppy said, PCWorld are fine for this sot of purchase, as with a resonable PSU ... just don't buy a PC from them

I did take off the right hand side cover viewed from the back.There really is a support partition hiding the details written on the PSU.This Partition extends all the way forward and supports the two Optical Drives and the Harddrive.

Be a devil, unscrew the 4 retaining screws that hold the PSU in place, and have a look ... finding a replacment will be easier if you know what you have to start with.

Unplug from the mains supply, no need to pull all the conecting cables from inside the case, see if you can get alll the details off the lable as show in that video link I posted.

I have now turned off the automatic reboot and am waiting patiently for the PC to turn itself off. It hasnt turned itself off in the last 24 hrs which is unusual.

aye, PC's know what your doing, is being stubborn.

I have carried out all but one of the advanced Secunia PSI recommendations and now have a score of 99%.The one remaining item is an end of life Microsoft Access 2000. this does not show up in Add/Remove so can I just delete the folder. Could this be the reason my PC has not switched itself off lately.

Well, if you had a software error appertaining to an old, un-updated software program, then yes, indeed it could well be the "error" we been looking for ... it's usually drivers that are a bugger, PSI does not check drivers, shame ... proof is in the pudding.

If you ain't using, nor "installed" then yes, delete the offending MA2k link, following that link from PSI is what I would do, then, with an evil grin, I press the delete key.

HTH

 

[muckshifter]

I wouldnt be suprised to find that Im missing the obvious with all my problems.
Now realise that I picked the wrong Graphics Card again how about
http://www.google.co.uk/products/ca...og_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CC0Q8wIwAg#

err, not from what I can see ... you NEED AGP

Be cearful, there are several revisions of AGP, you fortunately have one of the latest/last incarnations (0.8 V / 1.5 V AGP ((v3.0 connector)) supporting 1x, 4x, or 8x AGP)

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&q=agp+8+card&gfns=1&client=ie9-lb

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Pny-Geforce-6200-Graphics-Card/dp/B000P4LHUS

http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/pny-geforce-6-6200-agp-graphics-card-03758040-pdt.html

Minimum recommended 350W system power supply


just a couple I searched for

Please remember, you don't "need" a new card unless we can say it is the cause of your "problems" ... however, if want to waste, err, spend some money on a bit of an improvement, actually a great improvment for games, then go ahead.

 

[petermitchell44]

Ive removed the last offending item in the PSI



Ive deleted the IconCache removed all running instances of explorer.exe and sure enough IconCache has miraculously reappeared when I rebooted..Ive rebooted a few times but unfortunately nothing has changed.

Each time I reboot ,when the desktop appears it is white with the icons blued out.Then it takes a full 1 minute to load the antivirus and then after a further 1 minute the normal correct desktop will appear.It is as if the PC is starting correctly but doing so extremely slowly.
During this 2 minute period the cpu is running at only between 1 and 2 % level and whilst I can move the pointer around ,if I click on it it will cause the cpu to freeze.

I am confused as ,on my other PC ,the antivirus does not load untill after the desktop has finished loading whereas on this PC the antivirus loads during the desktop loading cycle.