Partition Magic & BootIt NG

[David Morgenlender]

I have a Dell Inspiron 8600 notebook, with Windows XP Pro, on order. I already
own the latest Partition Magic, which I planned on using for partitioning the
harddrive. I had been intending to use Drive Image, which I do not currently
own, to image the harddrive for backup, etc. But after reading about the latest
DI here, I've changed my mind, and plan on using BootIt NG for imaging.

My question ... do you know of any problems using PM for partitioning, and
BootIt NG for imaging (& booting, etc.)? (I know BING can do partitioning; but
I've used older versions of PM before, so it should reduce the learning curve.)

=======================================================
Dave Morgenlender
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)
=======================================================

 

[CS]

I have a Dell Inspiron 8600 notebook, with Windows XP Pro, on order. I already
own the latest Partition Magic, which I planned on using for partitioning the
harddrive. I had been intending to use Drive Image, which I do not currently
own, to image the harddrive for backup, etc. But after reading about the latest
DI here, I've changed my mind, and plan on using BootIt NG for imaging.

My question ... do you know of any problems using PM for partitioning, and
BootIt NG for imaging (& booting, etc.)? (I know BING can do partitioning; but
I've used older versions of PM before, so it should reduce the learning curve.)

=======================================================
Dave Morgenlender
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)
=======================================================

No problems. I currently use both since PM is much easier to use for
partitioning than BING. However, I have yet to find another boot
manager that can perform like BING!

 

[David Morgenlender]

I have a Dell Inspiron 8600 notebook, with Windows XP Pro & a 60gb 7200rpm
drive, on order. I already own the latest Partition Magic, which I intend to
use for partitioning the harddrive.

My most recent desktop system has a 24gb harddrive, which was partitioned as
follows:

C - 2gb: Win98SE
D - 2gb: Reserved for additional multi-booted OS
E - 2gb: Reserved for additional multi-booted OS
F - 2gb: Reserved for additional multi-booted OS
G - 4gb: Applications
H - 4gb: Data
I - 4gb: Temporary & other non-backed-up files
J - 4gb Drive Image files

The intent of the first 4 drives was to support multiple operating systems,
using a multi-boot utility, even though I didn't know what the last 3 were going
to be. I had learned that each OS must reside in the first 8gb of the drive,
which is why I allocated these partitions this way.

I haven't seen anybody else mention the use of a partition for temporary files.
But, I find this to be incredibly useful. I put Windows temp folders here.
"Play" files go here, eg copies of real data files I use to try out ideas in
apps such as Photoshop. I can delete files from here when it's convenient,
since the rule is any files that go here can be deleted at any time. I load the
Microsoft Developers Network database here from DVD, since it runs faster from
the harddrive, but doesn't need to be backed up.

Overall this approach has worked well. In fact, I haven't had a need for an
additional OS on this system. My data no longer fits on H, so I've started
using D-F.


On the new notebook's 60gb drive ...

I'd like to minimize the number of partitions, but not to the extent of losing
flexibility, etc. I want to allow for additional OS's, but I don't know what
they'll be at this time, or if they'll even happen.

I use Agent for email & newsgroups. Its data files fragment rapidly. Would you
suggest I put these files in their own partition?

I anticipate accumulating large numbers of large photo files. Occasionally,
I'll archive them to CDR or DVD+R. Any reason to put these on their own
partition.

It's conceivable I'll start accumulating music files (MP3 or newer formats). I
probably would back these up much less frequently than other data files.
Presumably, these should get their own partition.

At least initially, I intend to perform backups by creating partition images
using BootIt NG.

I assume I'll be defragging periodically, using Perfect Disk.

BTW, I realize I use the term "partition" somewhat loosely, when I often mean
volumes within an extended partition.


Any comments on this, or recommendations for partitioning the 60gb drive?

=======================================================
Dave Morgenlender
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)
=======================================================

 

[David Morgenlender]

How safe is defragging these days, in particular using Perfect Disk? Ever since
I had some minor corruption using Norton SpeedDisk many years ago (without any
error indication), I only defrag after a full backup, and I do a verify after
the defrag. Of course, I haven't had a problem since! This procedure is very
time consuming; since it only happens when I have a lot of time after doing a
full backup (which also takes a lot of time, using DAT tape), I don't defrag
very often.

I realize that defragging is now done using an XP API call. So it's presumably
safer (hopefully, the API is implemented in a very safe manner!). In practice,
is this a safe enough procedure to run frequently, independent of backup
schedule?

=======================================================
Dave Morgenlender
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)
=======================================================

 

[I'm Dan]

No problems. I currently use both since PM is much easier to use for
partitioning than BING. However, I have yet to find another boot
manager that can perform like BING!

David, I agree with CS -- I also use both and there are no inherent
problems.

PM is easier to use than BING, but for best results run PM from floppies
instead of from Windows. PM (and the pre-7.0 versions of DI) do their
magic from DOS. PQ tacked on a Windows front end, but during execution
the transition from Windows to DOS and back to Windows can be
problematic and seems to cause trouble in some cases. This is one
reason why BING is generally more reliable than PM or DI, but PM and DI
can be just as reliable if run from DOS instead of from Windows.

 

[Colin Higbie]

I defrag my computer once per week. I've been doing that since Windows 2000
(before XP even came out) and have never had a problem. I know that doesn't
guarantee everyone the same happy experience, but I've not heard of anyone
having any problems with the built-in defrag feature.

I also use Norton Speeddisk form Norton Utilities 2002 sometimes. However,
after I've run it, the Windows XP defrag still shows fragmented files, so I
think it does a better job than Norton's, at least better than the 2002
version.

- Colin

 

[Jim Byrd]

Hi David - I routinely do a scheduled on-line defrag with Perfect Disk
nightly at 12:10AM and an off-line scheduled defrag weekly, and I've never
had a problem nor had one reported to me, FWIW. I highly recommend Perfect
Disk as the best I've used of many over the years including almost all of
the more well know ones.

--
Please respond in the same thread.
Regards, Jim Byrd, MS-MVP



In

 

[David Morgenlender]

Dan,

David, I agree with CS -- I also use both and there are no inherent
problems.

PM is easier to use than BING, but for best results run PM from floppies
instead of from Windows. PM (and the pre-7.0 versions of DI) do their
magic from DOS. PQ tacked on a Windows front end, but during execution
the transition from Windows to DOS and back to Windows can be
problematic and seems to cause trouble in some cases. This is one
reason why BING is generally more reliable than PM or DI, but PM and DI
can be just as reliable if run from DOS instead of from Windows.

That sounds like a good idea. Unfortunately, I figured I'd never need a floppy
drive with the notebook, so I didn't order one, even though it's cheap. Maybe I
can create a bootable CD to use. (I've never burned a bootable CD; but I'm
sure I can figure out how.)

Thanks!

=======================================================
Dave Morgenlender
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)
=======================================================

 

[Alex Nichol]

I have a Dell Inspiron 8600 notebook, with Windows XP Pro, on order. I already
own the latest Partition Magic, which I planned on using for partitioning the
harddrive. I had been intending to use Drive Image, which I do not currently
own, to image the harddrive for backup, etc. But after reading about the latest
DI here, I've changed my mind, and plan on using BootIt NG for imaging.

My question ... do you know of any problems using PM for partitioning, and
BootIt NG for imaging (& booting, etc.)?

Not that I am aware of. There can be a conflict of interpretation when
you try to mix use of the two as partition managers, but I think that is
sorted, and there is an option in BING to handle it. This would *not*
affect imaging. One point to make is that if you are only using BING
for that you should not install it - just boot its floppy and cancel
install, when it will enter Maintenance mode, and you can click
Partition Work, to select a partition, click image, select a
destination, click Paste. THe destination can be free space 9as its own
hidden partition), space in a different partition (FAT or NTFS) or on an
external USB drive, or on a CDE or DVD disk set if you have a burner

 

[I'm Dan]

That sounds like a good idea. Unfortunately, I figured I'd never need a floppy
drive with the notebook, so I didn't order one, even though it's cheap. Maybe I
can create a bootable CD to use. (I've never burned a bootable CD; but I'm
sure I can figure out how.)

If you don't have a floppy drive, then you'll also have trouble with
BING. Decent burning programs like Nero and Easy Cd Creator can easily
make bootable CDRs, but you'll need to do that on a machine that has
both a floppy drive and CD burner. Basically, what they do is read the
image of a boot floppy and put it on CD, to which you can also add the
relevant PM files if you want. BING isn't quite so easy because it runs
from its own proprietary boot floppy. It can be done (see BING's
webpage or newsgroup for help), but I'm not sure if there is a way to
get both BING and PM on one bootable CD, so you may have to make two
bootable CDRs.

As Alex said, you don't have to *install* BING if you're just using its
imaging function, but you might want to do it just for convenience
because you don't have a floppy drive.

 

[end user]

I also use DI 6 and PM 8.01. They both work good with XP pro sp1. The
only problems that I have encountered are:
- for DI - verify is not dependable during backup but can
successfully be done after rebooting into window.
- for PM unable to change drive letter partitions.

Otherwise dependable read reliable programs and I will stay with them.

As for DI 7 I don't see a need at present

Locust

 

[NobodyMan]

If you don't have a floppy drive, then you'll also have trouble with
BING. Decent burning programs like Nero and Easy Cd Creator can easily
make bootable CDRs, but you'll need to do that on a machine that has
both a floppy drive and CD burner. Basically, what they do is read the
image of a boot floppy and put it on CD, to which you can also add the
relevant PM files if you want.

<snip>

Not completely true. I've made bootable CDs with Nero and never once
needed a floppy/used the diskette drive. I pulled the MS boot image
off an existing bootable CD and used it to create the bootable CD. It
works like a charm.

Info on how to do this can be found on several web pages doing a
google search.

 

[CS]

<snip>

Not completely true. I've made bootable CDs with Nero and never once
needed a floppy/used the diskette drive. I pulled the MS boot image
off an existing bootable CD and used it to create the bootable CD. It
works like a charm.

Info on how to do this can be found on several web pages doing a
google search.

I think what Dan is referring to is the difficulty that you will have
trying to use BING from a bootable CDR rather than from a floppy.
Bootable CDs are easy enough to make, however, some programs are not
designed to run from a bootable CD. BING has difficulty creating an
Image to CDR of the hard drive when booted from a CD.

 

[Ron Sommer]

I think what Dan is referring to is the difficulty that you will have
trying to use BING from a bootable CDR rather than from a floppy.
Bootable CDs are easy enough to make, however, some programs are not
designed to run from a bootable CD. BING has difficulty creating an
Image to CDR of the hard drive when booted from a CD.

I have created a ramdrive for some Dos programs on a bootable CD.
I have not tried it with BING.

 

[Alex Nichol]

That sounds like a good idea. Unfortunately, I figured I'd never need a floppy
drive with the notebook, so I didn't order one, even though it's cheap. Maybe I
can create a bootable CD to use. (I've never burned a bootable CD; but I'm
sure I can figure out how.)

BING, when you run it to make a boot floppy, can alternatively make a
bootable image of itself, and making a boot CD from that is easy with
one of the third party burning packs - Nero or Easy CD Creator. Just
choose a Boot CD as the type to make, and point it at the file
containing that image

The BING partitioning tool is not that difficult to get to grips with -
and does have the benefit that as all it needs is the BIOS you can work
on an entirely blank hard disk It has a fully functional 30 day trial -
so give it a try

 

[David Morgenlender]

Thanks everybody for your help!

=======================================================
Dave Morgenlender
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)
=======================================================