New System Hard Drive.

B

Bullwinkle Moose

I am finding myself is a situation where my computer is 4 years old. This
includes the original Hard drive which is a 40 gig drive with 3 partitions
on it. It is beginning to show signs of its age and I want to replace it
shortly.

I run windows xp sp2 prof. and the 1st partition is 12 gig with only windows
and associated files on it.

I have and additional 2 hard drives one of which is external. I use this for
music and movies. I back up my data every couple of days onto DVD's.

I want to replace the 40 gig drive with a 200 gig hard drive also with 3
partitions. With windows on the 1st (eventually the c: drive) partition.

I own Ghost 9.0 and Partition Magic 8.05. and would like to do this the
easiest way possible. I'm thinking of putting this new drive temporarily as
an external drive and copy the
contents of the partitions to this new drive and then install it as the
first drive c:, f:, g.

Is this the best way to go about it? first use Ghost to copy the partition
contents to the new drive. Then physically swap the new drive with the old
drive?

Regards,
 
P

PA20Pilot

Hi,

Ghost is a good call on your part. Use its advanced/clone options.

.........Then physically swap the new drive with the old
drive?

Exactly. Depending on things, you may need to fool around with your
drives jumpers a little along the way.


---==X={}=X==---

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com

Your only internet source for spiral staircase plans.
http://jself.com/stair/Stair.htm

Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA)
Technical Counselor
 
D

David Vair

Yes, Ghost is a good way to do this. When you are done doing the ghost of the windows partition
boot with just the new drive connected, that way it will stay at C. If Windows sees others drives
when it first encounters the new drive the letters MAY get screwed up.
 
P

PA20Pilot

Hi again,

........When you are done doing the ghost of the windows partition
boot with just the new drive connected, that way it will stay at C.

That's not really possible. When Ghost is done cloning the drive it'll
boot back into Windoze all by itself. Temporarily, Ghost will assign
drive letters to the cloned drive as long as it's in there with the
original still running things. As soon as you remove the original and
boot from the clone your drive letters will revert to what the original
disk was.

Windoze doesn't get confused by there being two bootable drives in there
because only one of them is cabled/jumpered to be the boss of things at
any one time.


---==X={}=X==---

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com

Your only internet source for spiral staircase plans.
http://jself.com/stair/Stair.htm

Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA)
Technical Counselor
 
A

Anna

Original post (condensed)...
(SNIP)
I want to replace the 40 gig drive with a 200 gig hard drive also with 3
partitions. With windows on the 1st (eventually the c: drive) partition.
Is this the best way to go about it? first use Ghost to copy the partition
contents to the new drive. Then physically swap the new drive with the old
drive?


Response by Dave Vair...
Yes, Ghost is a good way to do this. When you are done doing the ghost of
the windows partition boot with just the new drive connected, that way it
will stay at C. If Windows sees others drives when it first encounters the
new drive the letters MAY get screwed up.
--
Dave Vair
CNE, CNA, MCP, A+, N+


PA20Pilot said:
Hi again,

.......When you are done doing the ghost of the windows partition
boot with just the new drive connected, that way it will stay at C.

That's not really possible. When Ghost is done cloning the drive it'll
boot back into Windoze all by itself. Temporarily, Ghost will assign drive
letters to the cloned drive as long as it's in there with the original
still running things. As soon as you remove the original and boot from the
clone your drive letters will revert to what the original disk was.

Windoze doesn't get confused by there being two bootable drives in there
because only one of them is cabled/jumpered to be the boss of things at
any one time.

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com


Dave Vair's advice is indeed correct. After a user directly clones his or
her HD to another internal HD with the Ghost disk imaging program, the
initial boot following the cloning operation should be undertaken with ONLY
the destination drive connected, i.e., the recipient of the clone. Should
both internal drives be connected at the time of that initial boot
immediately following the cloning operation, there is a decided risk that
subsequently the cloned drive will NOT boot (although its contents could be
used for restoration purposes). Admittedly this will not ALWAYS be the case,
but it happens with sufficient frequency that the user should be aware of
this possibility assuming he or she is interested in using the cloned drive
as a bootable drive. (Nearly) needless to say, the preceding has no
relevance where a USB/Firewire external HD is the recipient of the clone.

I'm at a loss to understand Jim's comment that "When Ghost is done cloning
the drive it'll boot back into Windoze all by itself." As I've stated above,
where the cloning operation involves internal HDs, the prudent course of
action in most cases is that immediately following the cloning operation the
source disk should be disconnected and the initial boot be made with only
the destination drive, i.e., the recipient of the clone, connected.
Thereafter, there will be no problem in that both drives can be connected
upon bootup and each drive will be subsequently be bootable.
Anna
 
P

PA20Pilot

Hi Anna,

........... the prudent course of action in most cases is that
immediately following the cloning operation the source disk should be
disconnected and the initial boot be made with only the destination drive,

Maybe you're using a different version of Ghost from mine, perhaps newer
than 2003. When I clone a drive there is no opportunity to disconnect
the cloned drive before the computer reboots after making the clone,
unless you're there at the exact instant the computer reboots after
completing the cloning operation. Ghost shuts Windows down, does its
cloning, then reboots. It doesn't matter in the least if the cloned
drive is in there or not for later booting. As I wrote earlier, Windoze
is only going to be looking for a boot disk in one place at a time, if
it find the first original disk it won't go past there looking to boot
again. Ghost does have a dos way of doing things too, maybe that what
you're writing anout, I use the GUI interface right from Windoze.

............Should both internal drives be connected at the time of that
initial boot immediately following the cloning operation, there is a
decided risk that subsequently the cloned drive will NOT boot

Why do you think that? Has that been happening to you?

---==X={}=X==---

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com

Your only internet source for spiral staircase plans.
http://jself.com/stair/Stair.htm

Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA)
Technical Counselor
 
A

Anna

Anna wrote...
.......... the prudent course of action in most cases is that immediately
following the cloning operation the source disk should be disconnected and
the initial boot be made with only the destination drive,

PA20Pilot said:
Hi Anna,
Maybe you're using a different version of Ghost from mine, perhaps newer
than 2003. When I clone a drive there is no opportunity to disconnect the
cloned drive before the computer reboots after making the clone, unless
you're there at the exact instant the computer reboots after completing
the cloning operation. Ghost shuts Windows down, does its cloning, then
reboots. It doesn't matter in the least if the cloned drive is in there or
not for later booting. As I wrote earlier, Windoze is only going to be
looking for a boot disk in one place at a time, if it find the first
original disk it won't go past there looking to boot again. Ghost does
have a dos way of doing things too, maybe that what you're writing anout,
I use the GUI interface right from Windoze.


Anna writes...
...........Should both internal drives be connected at the time of that
initial boot immediately following the cloning operation, there is a
decided risk that subsequently the cloned drive will NOT boot

Why do you think that? Has that been happening to you?

---==X={}=X==---

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com

Your only internet source for spiral staircase plans.
http://jself.com/stair/Stair.htm

Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA)
Technical Counselor


Jim:
I do use the Ghost 2003 program. For basic disk-to-disk cloning (our
virtually exclusive interest) we prefer that version to the later Symantec
ones. As you may have noted from my previous posts on this issue re the
cloning of HDs with the Ghost 2003 program, I nearly always use the Ghost
bootable floppy disk (or Ghost bootable CD) to perform the cloning
operation. I prefer its simplicity of use as well as the portability aspects
of using that media. (Truth to tell, we've been using this media for so long
now that it's become second nature for us). I virtually never use Ghost's
GUI.

After the cloning operation has concluded and the user receives the "Clone
Completed Successfully" message, it's a simple matter of pressing the
Continue > Quit buttons which will shut down the Ghost program, and at the
A:\ prompt simply removing the floppy disk or CD and powering off the
machine. So there will be no "automatic" rebooting of the machine. After
shutting down the machine we ordinarily disconnect the source disk and boot
with *only* the destination drive (the drive that was the recipient of the
clone). Which brings me to responding to your final question re my previous
comment that "Should both internal drives be connected at the time of that
initial boot immediately following the cloning operation, there is a decided
risk that subsequently the cloned drive will NOT boot."...

Let me illustrate the problem with an example...
For simplicity's sake, let's say the computer is equipped with only two
HDs - no optical drives or any other storage devices are connected. The user
clones his/her C: drive to the second HD. But following the cloning
operation, instead of disconnecting the C: drive (as we recommend) and
making that *initial* boot with *only* that second cloned drive connected,
the user boots with both drives connected. As expected, the source disk will
retain it's C: drive assignment letter and the cloned drive will be
designated D:.

Here's the problem, at least a potential problem. The user now wants to boot
directly to the newly-cloned HD. In a significant number of cases it will
not boot. It will not boot because it retains the D: drive letter assignment
because of that former initial boot with both drives connected. Had the
initial boot following the cloning operation been made with *only* the
cloned drive connected, there would be no subsequent problem. As I've
indicated, the problem does not *always* arise. Actually, in probably a
majority of cases, no problem will arise even when the source & destination
disks have been connected and booted to following the cloning process. But,
in our experience, it happens with sufficient frequency that the user should
be aware of this potential problem. BTW, we have also run into this
identical problem with other disk imaging products, e.g., Acronis True
Image.

Interestingly enough, if the booting problem with the cloned drive does
occur along the lines I've described, should the need later arise to restore
the system using the contents of that cloned drive - there's no problem. Its
contents can be re:cloned to a HD for restoration purposes and that
recipient drive *will* be bootable.

BTW, I should mention that all this is another reason why we are strong
advocates of equipping one's desktop computer with removable hard drives.
The simplicity of using that hardware configuration for making disconnects &
connects of one's HDs is most appealing in addition to its other advantages.
Virtually every desktop computer we build comes equipped with removable HDs,
and it's a configuration we highly recommend to our customers.
Anna

P.S.
Jim, since you have an interest in using Ghost 2003, you might be interested
in perusing my post of 2/17/06 in the
microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support NG under the subject "Re: Adding
a drive". In that post I detailed the steps for using a Ghost bootable
floppy disk (or CD) to undertake the cloning process. I also covered created
the bootable floppy (CD) as well.
 
P

PA20Pilot

Hi again Anna,

I don't see a good reason to fool with a boot disk rather than the four
clicks it takes to clone a drive using the Windows GUI. Do the clicks,
come back in a few minutes and the jobs done, no plugging cords, moving
jumpers, removing floppies etc.

I do use a removable drive as my destination.

........ in probably a majority of cases, no problem will arise even when
the source & destination disks have been connected and booted to
following the cloning process. But, in our experience, it happens with
sufficient frequency that the user should be aware of this potential
problem.

That's another reason I'd suggest you stop using the boot floppy and
stick with Windoze GUI, I've never had a problem and I've done enough to
have run into something. Windoze does create new drive letters for the
clone, such as C,D and E will turn into F,G, and H on the clone, but as
soon as you use the clone as your booting OS it'll be returned to what
it was originally, C, D and E.

I clone my drives weekly and promptly remove them afterward by turning
the key on their caddies.

I will also continue to keep my fingers crossed hoping that'll keep me
safe from your sometimes experiences using Ghost.

---==X={}=X==---

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com

Your only internet source for spiral staircase plans.
http://jself.com/stair/Stair.htm

Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA)
Technical Counselor
 
P

PA20Pilot

Hi again,

Just in the last two days I had two different problems with Ghost 2003.
Restoring my drive here at home with a clone copy my CD drive got in
between C,D and E. Had to reassign letters to fix that one. And also
today while cloning my daughters drive at school, Ghost froze with a
minute and 24 seconds remaining. Had to leave without a clone on that one.

So........ I spoke too soon, but after a couple of years of things going
well I can't say I've always had good luck any longer.


---==X={}=X==---

Jim Self
AVIATION ANIMATION, the internet's largest depository.
http://avanimation.avsupport.com

Your only internet source for spiral staircase plans.
http://jself.com/stair/Stair.htm

Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA)
Technical Counselor
 
K

Kerry Brown

PA20Pilot said:
Hi again Anna,

I don't see a good reason to fool with a boot disk rather than the
four clicks it takes to clone a drive using the Windows GUI. Do the
clicks, come back in a few minutes and the jobs done, no plugging
cords, moving jumpers, removing floppies etc.

I do use a removable drive as my destination.

....... in probably a majority of cases, no problem will arise even
when the source & destination disks have been connected and booted to
following the cloning process. But, in our experience, it happens with
sufficient frequency that the user should be aware of this potential
problem.

That's another reason I'd suggest you stop using the boot floppy and
stick with Windoze GUI, I've never had a problem and I've done enough
to have run into something. Windoze does create new drive letters for
the clone, such as C,D and E will turn into F,G, and H on the clone,
but as soon as you use the clone as your booting OS it'll be returned
to what it was originally, C, D and E.

I clone my drives weekly and promptly remove them afterward by turning
the key on their caddies.

I will also continue to keep my fingers crossed hoping that'll keep me
safe from your sometimes experiences using Ghost.

I can second Anna's experience. I have cloned hundreds of drives using
Acronis True Image 8.0 and with Norton Ghost 2003 and 10.0. I have learned
the hard way that occasionally booting with both drives installed may cause
something to happen such that one or possibly both won't boot after that. I
have also learned that cloning and imaging the drive from a boot CD or
floppy is far less error prone and faster.

Kerry
 

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