New 9800 Pro - graphic issues

[Shawk]

Hi all,

Got the new card today. Everythings working great - scores have doubled
BUT.... I've developed graphical glitches - looks like thousands of tiny red
fireflies. Only happens in games (Far Cry), benchmarking (Aquamark) and
also can be seen in the Direct3D tests in DxDiag. Tried various drivers
(Cat 4.3, 4.6 and Omega 4.6). Any ideas?

Specs are:

NF7-S v2 Mobo
XP2800+
1gig 3200 Ram (pair 512's)
Audigy S/Card
Win XP Pro
DX9.0b

Thanks, Shaun

 

[@ndrew]

Hi all,

Got the new card today. Everythings working great - scores have
doubled BUT.... I've developed graphical glitches - looks like
thousands of tiny red fireflies. Only happens in games (Far Cry),
benchmarking (Aquamark) and also can be seen in the Direct3D tests in
DxDiag. Tried various drivers (Cat 4.3, 4.6 and Omega 4.6). Any
ideas?

Specs are:

NF7-S v2 Mobo
XP2800+
1gig 3200 Ram (pair 512's)
Audigy S/Card
Win XP Pro
DX9.0b

Are you overclocking at all? Also what is your heat like in the case?
To be honest sounds like it may be a heat issue.

regards

@ndrew

 

[Shawk]

Are you overclocking at all? Also what is your heat like in the case?
To be honest sounds like it may be a heat issue.

regards

@ndrew

@ndrew

No overclocking at all but you could be right on the heat. This is just a
cheap bog-standard case with no case fans and I've been reading that 9800
Pro's run hot - probably about time I had a better case - I've upgraded
everything else. I think there's a utility for checking temps on an NF7-S
(2) - I'll d-load that and see what it says. What am I looking at for
normal temps under load and at idle?

Thanks, Shaun

 

[Heywood]

A suggestion:
Add at least 2 case fans (I run 6 on a full tower), Athlon 64, and ati
Radeon 9700 Pro...nothing overclocked. After my warranty was ove on
the 9700 Pro, I took off the stock cooler and added a VGA Silencer
with better results (Not to do until AFTER your warranty is
over....one in back exhausting air and one in front pulling in fresh
air...should help...The 9800's are HOT RUNNING and I for one do not
like the stock cooling on them!!!! Remember heat is ehausted into the
case by the 9800, the CPU fan, ram and general system hot air.

I have a friend who took his side tower cover off and directed a floor
fan at the card (for the summer anyway) hwy, it seems to work!

At least the case fans will get some of the hot air out! Remember that
when the card goes into 3d mode....there is more heat!

 

[Shawk]

@ndrew

No overclocking at all but you could be right on the heat. This is just a
cheap bog-standard case with no case fans and I've been reading that 9800
Pro's run hot - probably about time I had a better case - I've upgraded
everything else. I think there's a utility for checking temps on an NF7-S
(2) - I'll d-load that and see what it says. What am I looking at for
normal temps under load and at idle?

Thanks, Shaun

ABIT EQ says the system is at 39degrees and the CPU at 53. No idea how hot
the GPU is - anyway of testing that? Thanks.

 

[Cristián Pérez V.]

Maybe it´s your power supply, When I bought my msi 9800 pro, I got problems
in the image; I had a generic 350 Watts power supply, I changed to a
Thermaltake 480 watts, and now the card runs like hell....;-)

 

[Heywood]

Maybe it´s your power supply, When I bought my msi 9800 pro, I got problems
in the image; I had a generic 350 Watts power supply, I changed to a
Thermaltake 480 watts, and now the card runs like hell....;-)



Temp;s seem ok...cpu a bit high.

For the heck of it, open the case and place a fan directed at the
card....see what happens as it is a cheap way th begin diagnosis.
Hate to say this but creative sound cards have also caused
problems...hogging the bus! <unlikely though>

The powersuply is a good place to start,,,,must have good 12v
rails....Cheapos do not work well no matter what they are rated at!

 

[Sham B]

Sounds like a heat issue. Try underclocking the card to be certain. You could also try...

- running the computer with the side off, and blowing air into it with a desk fan, and seeing if
that clears the issue
- running the computer from cold, starting the game as soon as you get to desktop. If you see the
fireflies increase over time, then its heat because the problem gets worse as the system gets
hotter. If they appear straight away then its a card imperfection, and you should look to returning
the card for a swap.

Before you decide its a bad card, also consider using a different (better) PSU if you have one
available because the issue might be a lack of power. If you can't (or dont want to) do that,
temporarily disconnect everything except the HD you need to play the game (you can get a no-CD patch
from gamecopyworld so that you dont need an active CD drive to play your game). then try and see if
you get less fireflies. If you do, then its power related.

that should give you a few directions to try.

For what its worth, I have a very similar setup to you (9800 pro, 2x512Mb, XP2800, MSI NF2 mobo),
and when I first installed the card, I had issues with it warming up the case enough to crash the
processor consistently. Because I work from home and use the computer for writing, the use of loads
of case fans was out (I like to be able to think and a bit of quiet is nice!). Adding an arctic
cooler solved the problem straight away, because it vents the heat away at source. this will of
course invalidate your warranty, so you have to be
1. Happy with not being able to take your card back
2. Sure it is heat, and not an imperfection in the card


S

 

[Dodgy]

ABIT EQ says the system is at 39degrees and the CPU at 53. No idea how hot
the GPU is - anyway of testing that? Thanks.

I believe the xt will tell you, but I don't think the pro can.

You can always prove if this a heat issue by running the pc lid-less
so it can get some air.

D0d6y.

 

[Shawk]

All,

Thanks for all the suggestions. So far I've:

Taken out and removed the drivers for the Audigy and gone back to on-board
sound - no diff.
Tried OpenGl games to see if its just D3D - no diff
Taken one of the case sides off to allow some more air to the card - no
diff. (havent got a fan to blow into the case unfortunately)
Left the PC off for a couple of hours, rebooted and tried Aquamark as soon
as desktop appears - very slightly less 'fireflies' - maybe

Tonight I'll try disconnecting CDRom and DVD drives to take some load off
the PSU (a 350w FSP (Sparkle?) jobby) but meanwhile (and as this is an
ongoing upgrade project anyway) I've ordered a new Thermaltake Lanfire case
with 4 fans and a new 480w Thermaltake dual-fan PSU (Butterfly?). Should be
here by Friday so see what happens then. (6 fans! - if it doesnt stop the
fireflies at least I should be able to fly it to work)

Dreading the fact the card might be an RMA - though their prices and
delivery are excellent I haven't heard good things about Overclockers
returns process :-(

Thanks again, dont go away - might need to ask more questions. Shaun

 

[Shawk]

Sounds like a heat issue. Try underclocking the card to be certain. You could also try...

Sham B

Using Radlinker I dropped the core to 351 from 378 and left the memory at
337.5. The fireflies disappeared!! However I havent got a clue what this
means - noob when it comes to this stuff. Any further advice please?

Thanks, Shaun

 

[Sham B]

It means your core is overheating. Under normal conditions, the heatsink should get around as hot
as a hot mug of tea - the sort of heat where you can keep your hand on it, but any hotter and you
would have to let go.

I suspect either:

1. your core is okay but it is not making contact with the heatsink.. I suspect when you touch the
heatsink, you will find that it is not that hot.
2. the core is fked., possibly caused by 1.

If its 1, then Im afraid it means taking off the heatsink to find out, immediately voiding your
warranty, and even then you need to buy some decent paste to fix the problem, and Im assuming that
the damage is not now permanent. So its not something you should consider. If its 2 then, well... it
speaks for itself.

you have a dud. Unless its something really obvious like the fan isnt spinning because something is
stopping it, and it can be easily freed, you need to send it back. Send overclockers an email
telling them that you have a problem with the picture when using the card in games, and you had the
problem from the word go. tell them it the same way you told the NG initially.

They will most likely either take it back or suspect that you have decided to overclock it and
broken it that way... so if they start asking questions, *whatever you do* dont mention the word
'overclock' or 'underclock' unless you really have to.

Sorry.

I know its a pain in the arse, but thats what I think the situation is, and cant think that it is
anything else that can be fixed by the NG.

If they get shirty, come back to the NG and tell us.

S

 

[Shawk]

It means your core is overheating. Under normal conditions, the heatsink should get around as hot
as a hot mug of tea - the sort of heat where you can keep your hand on it, but any hotter and you
would have to let go.

I suspect either:

1. your core is okay but it is not making contact with the heatsink.. I suspect when you touch the
heatsink, you will find that it is not that hot.
2. the core is fked., possibly caused by 1.

If its 1, then Im afraid it means taking off the heatsink to find out, immediately voiding your
warranty, and even then you need to buy some decent paste to fix the problem, and Im assuming that
the damage is not now permanent. So its not something you should consider. If its 2 then, well... it
speaks for itself.

you have a dud. Unless its something really obvious like the fan isnt spinning because something is
stopping it, and it can be easily freed, you need to send it back. Send overclockers an email
telling them that you have a problem with the picture when using the card in games, and you had the
problem from the word go. tell them it the same way you told the NG initially.

They will most likely either take it back or suspect that you have decided to overclock it and
broken it that way... so if they start asking questions, *whatever you do* dont mention the word
'overclock' or 'underclock' unless you really have to.

Sorry.

I know its a pain in the arse, but thats what I think the situation is, and cant think that it is
anything else that can be fixed by the NG.

If they get shirty, come back to the NG and tell us.

S

Bugger!....

One last question - do the 9800 pro's fans speed alternate? i.e. should it
go faster when the card is under load and therefore hotter? This one
doesnt - just want to make sure that's normal before I start complaining

Thanks, Shaun
..

 

[Sham B]

One last question - do the 9800 pro's fans speed alternate? i.e.
should it go faster when the card is under load and therefore hotter?

No. Constant speed.

S

 

[McGrandpa]

Damn. I haven't seen anything like that with any of mine. Wait, the
first Ti4600 I had DID have very tiny yellow flecks show up onscreen,
but only after first entering any 3D mode. Didn't matter if OGL or D3D,
just a 3D mode. I first realized I was having this problem in
Morrowind.
It was hardware, not the ram (that happened to be bad from the beginning
on the 2nd Ti4600). Something else in the hardware 'broke' when going
into 3D for some reason.
It could be drivers, mobo/chipset drivers as well as video (for the AGP
slot), memory on the vid card, poor seating in the AGP slot. Process of
elimination time. Check to see what AGP settings you have in your mobos
BIOS?
McG.

 

[McGrandpa]

@ndrew

No overclocking at all but you could be right on the heat. This is
just a cheap bog-standard case with no case fans and I've been
reading that 9800 Pro's run hot - probably about time I had a better
case - I've upgraded everything else. I think there's a utility for
checking temps on an NF7-S (2) - I'll d-load that and see what it
says. What am I looking at for normal temps under load and at idle?

Thanks, Shaun

My 9800 Pro does run hot when in 3D, and I keep a case fan type blower
pointed right at the vid card AND, I leave the sides off the case
too. I like it having lots of fresh air in there.
McG.

 

[McGrandpa]

Bugger!....

One last question - do the 9800 pro's fans speed alternate? i.e.
should it go faster when the card is under load and therefore hotter?

This one doesnt - just want to make sure that's normal before I start
complaining

Thanks, Shaun

Hell yes! Mine goes from so quiet I have to look under it to be sure
it's running to sounding like a jet about to take off when it gets
loaded up, like with Halo or Far Cry! The 9800 Pro can deffo change the
fan speed. SO, that means the 9800 Core KNOWS what the temp is....it
just doesn't tell US what it is :-\ I hate that.
McG.

 

[Shawk]

Hell yes! Mine goes from so quiet I have to look under it to be sure
it's running to sounding like a jet about to take off when it gets
loaded up, like with Halo or Far Cry! The 9800 Pro can deffo change the
fan speed. SO, that means the 9800 Core KNOWS what the temp is....it
just doesn't tell US what it is :-\ I hate that.
McG.

Wonder why mine doesn't then..... power supply? Think I might hold off
complaining until I get that 480w Antec and the case with a thousand fans.
Ta, Shaun

 

[McGrandpa]

Wonder why mine doesn't then..... power supply? Think I might hold
off complaining until I get that 480w Antec and the case with a
thousand fans. Ta, Shaun

It's possible my Built By ATi 9800 Pro 128 does NOT vary speed. It
could be the CPU fan. But, it sure does seem all the noise is coming
from the 9800 fan. Everest says mine has a 350 core. It is BIOS dated
January 29, 2004. It's not an old card. But it still has the R350
core, not a 360. There is not much chance it has any 'extras'. Which
makes the FX5900 128 a better choice in *some* ways. But the 9800 is
faster.
I think you've already hit on the problem. Since it's brand new, I'd
RMA the card, as it's apparently faulty craftsmanship that's the
culprit. Yes, I'm afraid I really would at this point
McG.

 

[Sham B]

Absolutely. I think the longer you leave it, the more overclockers will get suspicious. I cant say
I really blame them because they sell to the people that are more likely to break the gear
(overclockers and tinkerers) and are probably used to people trying to send back stuff that was
overvoltaged or whatever and broke. Obviously, you hve not broken it and its a dud card, but the
longer you keep it, the more you will be lumbered with OCs inherently suspicious returns policy.

S