Need Advice with upgrading to AGP Video Card

[Chris]

Hello Folks,

I am looking to upgrade to an AGP video card with the TV-out
connector. First off, I don't play games on the computer. So, I
don't need the fastest most powerful card out there. I would probably
be limited in that regard anyway, since my power supply is 250 volts.

My primary uses for the video card would be for on-line video
streaming. I frequent the "free tube" web site which let's you watch
live TV.. up to a fulll screen. So, it was my hope that wiith the
TV-out option, maybe I could finally ditch cable TV for free tube.
So, the card should be able to handle streaming video well. In
addition, I use the computer for photo editing, etc. I may also use
the system for video editing at some point, unless I upgrade to a
faster system before that.

So, I'm basically looking for an improvement on what I already have
(SIS Mirage 2 integrated VIdeo with 128 MB shared memory) and which
has the TV out option.

Here are the Specs of my system:

AMD Athlon 63 3200+
1.5 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM
120 GB 7200 RPM Ultra DMA Hard drive
DVD+RW/CD-RW
CD-ROM
250 watt power supply

Thanks for any assistance you could give me!!

Chris

 

[GT]

Hello Folks,

I am looking to upgrade to an AGP video card with the TV-out
connector. First off, I don't play games on the computer. So, I
don't need the fastest most powerful card out there. I would probably
be limited in that regard anyway, since my power supply is 250 volts.

My primary uses for the video card would be for on-line video
streaming. I frequent the "free tube" web site which let's you watch
live TV.. up to a fulll screen. So, it was my hope that wiith the
TV-out option, maybe I could finally ditch cable TV for free tube.
So, the card should be able to handle streaming video well. In
addition, I use the computer for photo editing, etc. I may also use
the system for video editing at some point, unless I upgrade to a
faster system before that.

So, I'm basically looking for an improvement on what I already have
(SIS Mirage 2 integrated VIdeo with 128 MB shared memory) and which
has the TV out option.

Here are the Specs of my system:

AMD Athlon 63 3200+
1.5 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM
120 GB 7200 RPM Ultra DMA Hard drive
DVD+RW/CD-RW
CD-ROM
250 watt power supply

I'm sure that's an Athlon 64, but never mind!

Sounds like you have no great demands on the video card other than a TV out
port. Games would require as much power as you can afford, but none of the
things you list require graphics power. Video/photo editing requires lots of
RAM and as fast a processor as you can afford and the 3200+ would manage
fine for now. Video streaming does not place any load on the graphisc card
either. Practically any AGP graphics card with 16MB or more on-board RAM
will be able to handle any 2d (windows work) going.

I don't think you need to spend more than about £5 and you could even look
on ebay ! Why not look for one with passive cooling (no fan) for silent
running? Check out item number 300125107334 on ebay for an example. I
searched for 'AGP 64MB', then chose 'buy-it-now' only and limited the price
to £20 and got a huge list. Search through the descriptions to check for
TV-out. Alternatively, pop into PC-world or a computer shop and don't be
over-sold something fancy!

 

[GT]

[snip]

Alternatively, pop into PC-world or a computer shop and don't be over-sold
something fancy!

I didn't intend to imply that PC-World isn't a computer shop. However, this
grammatical slip is a little too Freudian!

A "Freudian Slip" - when you say one thing, but mean your mother.

 

[kony]

Hello Folks,

I am looking to upgrade to an AGP video card with the TV-out
connector. First off, I don't play games on the computer. So, I
don't need the fastest most powerful card out there. I would probably
be limited in that regard anyway, since my power supply is 250 volts.

My primary uses for the video card would be for on-line video
streaming. I frequent the "free tube" web site which let's you watch
live TV.. up to a fulll screen. So, it was my hope that wiith the
TV-out option, maybe I could finally ditch cable TV for free tube.
So, the card should be able to handle streaming video well. In
addition, I use the computer for photo editing, etc. I may also use
the system for video editing at some point, unless I upgrade to a
faster system before that.

So, I'm basically looking for an improvement on what I already have
(SIS Mirage 2 integrated VIdeo with 128 MB shared memory) and which
has the TV out option.

Here are the Specs of my system:

AMD Athlon 63 3200+
1.5 GB PC3200 DDR SDRAM
120 GB 7200 RPM Ultra DMA Hard drive
DVD+RW/CD-RW
CD-ROM
250 watt power supply

What kind of "improvement" are you looking for over the
video you already had? As GT mentioned, there's nothing
particularly demanding about TV-Out, nor your described
tasks, so we'd need to know where the current video is
falling short. Your present PSU could indeed be a
limitation, if you were just itching to replace something
that might be a good area to focus on.

 

[Chris]

What kind of "improvement" are you looking for over the
video you already had? As GT mentioned, there's nothing
particularly demanding about TV-Out, nor your described
tasks, so we'd need to know where the current video is
falling short. Your present PSU could indeed be a
limitation, if you were just itching to replace something
that might be a good area to focus on.

Well, at this point in time I don't have any real issues with the
current video card. I primarily was looking for the tv-out option.
However, if I was going to go through the trouble of upgrading to
begin with, I'd hope to make an improvement over what I already had.
I certainly wouldn't want degraded performance! Also, if I ever do
plan on purchasing a new computer, I may very well sell this one on
E-bay. So, upgrading to a "better" video card may add a bit more
value to the system. But, I also don't want to spend a lot of money
to do so. So, as GT mentioned, it would be great to find a cheap
decent video card on E-bay that would do the job and not cost and arm
and a leg.

 

[GT]

Hello Folks,

Well, at this point in time I don't have any real issues with the
current video card. I primarily was looking for the tv-out option.
However, if I was going to go through the trouble of upgrading to
begin with, I'd hope to make an improvement over what I already had.
I certainly wouldn't want degraded performance! Also, if I ever do
plan on purchasing a new computer, I may very well sell this one on
E-bay. So, upgrading to a "better" video card may add a bit more
value to the system. But, I also don't want to spend a lot of money
to do so. So, as GT mentioned, it would be great to find a cheap
decent video card on E-bay that would do the job and not cost and arm
and a leg.

A repeat answer, but you are not going to improve performance of anything
you do by upgrading your graphics card, as you don't use any software that
uses 3d power. All you are going to gain is the TV-out, so I would focus on
minimal spend to achieve your requirement. I wouldn't bother buying with a
view to selling in the future, because any budget card you buy now will be
well below gaming spec when you come to sell in a few months. You could
spend £300 on a new PCI-x graphics card and whilst it will be more capable
than any £10 card, it will still be out of date in 6 months!

 

[kony]

Well, at this point in time I don't have any real issues with the
current video card. I primarily was looking for the tv-out option.

I must have been confused about your prior post as something
made me read it as saying your present card did have TV-Out
but with the upgrade you also wanted TV-Out and some "other"
benefit.

One of the problems is your PSU may have been merely
adequate for the system as-is, many of the more powerful
video cards use a significant amount of power but even a
lower end card is going to use more power than the
integrated video does. Since TV-Out isn't demanding you
should choose a current generation, lowest end card from ATI
or nVidia, unless you need something in particular like HDMI
output (I assumed you wanted S-Video out for TV or ???).

However, if I was going to go through the trouble of upgrading to
begin with, I'd hope to make an improvement over what I already had.

Besides the TV-Out, you don't mention anything that would
make any particular level of card an improvement except that
by using a separate card instead of integrated video (any
card at all, even low end or very old) you relieve the
system from devoting a certain amount (128MB) and bandwidth
of system memory to the video, so the rest of the system
would gain a slight (might not be enough to notice in most
uses outside of gaming) performance boost, but for
windows/2D mode, there is nothing demanding enough of the
video itself to see much benefit.

I certainly wouldn't want degraded performance!

It would be hard to find a modern video card that degraded
performance below that of the integrated video, but the
thing is that for 2D uses, the power of modern video cards
in processing is mostly wasted, their mostly going to have
gains in 3D gaming besides the other issue you are facing,
more features like TV-Out but even cheap cards support that
now.

Also, if I ever do
plan on purchasing a new computer, I may very well sell this one on
E-bay. So, upgrading to a "better" video card may add a bit more
value to the system.

I doubt it, you would get very little if any return on this
upgrade when it comes time to sell a used and aged system.
If it were a pretty new system and had a relatively high end
video card you might get 1/3rd to 2/3rd of the value of that
card back out at resale time but even this is doubtful at
auction, for used parts past the current generation. Video
cards just depreciate too much, especially what you're
wanting which is one power miserly enough that it might run
from your marginal 250W PSU.

But, I also don't want to spend a lot of money
to do so.

If you don't want to spend much then how could it be worth
much adding to resale value of the system even in a perfect
world? Your requirements aren't hard to meet, you might
look around for some sale or rebate offers at your favorite
online vendors. I would avoid ebay for something like this
unless you feel like taking the risks, as video cards can
often be partially damaged then resold on ebay (unless
clearly claimed as new in box still).

So, as GT mentioned, it would be great to find a cheap
decent video card on E-bay that would do the job and not cost and arm
and a leg.

I don't understand why you are having trouble finding one.
I suggest going to newegg.com and using their search
parameters on the left hand side of the page in the video
card category to choose AGP (I'm assuming your board
supports 4X/8X with the following link, if not backtrack and
choose 2X/4X),
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...&Subcategory=48&description=&Ntk=&srchInDesc=

That's 121 hits, you should probably avoid the old FX5xxx
series (like FX5200, FX5500, etc) merely because they tended
to use more power, run slightly hotter. If you end up having
to replace the PSU to support a card, it will practically
double the cost.


Here's a Radeon 9250 if you only needed composite TV out,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121525

here's a Radeon 9550 with an attractive after-rebate price,
supporting S-Video and Composite TV-Out and at $23 after
rebate I can't feel it worthwhile to use ebay at all.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102458
the heatsink on the following might be "slightly" better,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131049
though with any of these passively cooled cards I recommend
that you leave the adjacent motherboard slot empty and leave
that empty slot's rear case bracket cover off, which will
cause more passive airflow over the card.

If your case cooling is very bad, you might think about
getting a card with a fan but that will increase noise
levels a bit, and these fans tend to have fairly short
lives, it might be a maintenance issue to replace it every
year or two.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814103162

A reasonable alternative from nVidia might be one of their
6200 series.

If you're just itching to go with ebay instead, the best
value would be something older. You just don't need a
current generation card merely to support TV-Out, so long as
you note the specs displayed with item listing you can
discriminate them and the issue of it being slower at gaming
won't matter since you make no mention of that being
important. Too many cards over the years supported TV-Out
to begin listing them all, it's not as though any one has
enough merits you would ignore the others, since the whole
point of a risk on ebay would seem to be trying for the
cheapest thing possible, since as I linked above you can get
brand new cards for under $30. One suggestion would be that
in general if the card has a large heatsink with a fan, that
means it's producing more heat during operation and as such,
using more power from your PSU so again it could come closer
or exceed capacity and you'd have to replace the PSU.

 

[GT]

What kind of "improvement" are you looking for over the

I must have been confused about your prior post as something
made me read it as saying your present card did have TV-Out
but with the upgrade you also wanted TV-Out and some "other"
benefit.

A subtle, but easy mistake. He said, "I'm basically looking for an
improvement on what I already have
[snip] and which has the TV out option". If you miss the 'and' after my
snip, you would arrive at your conclusion/confusion!

 

[Chris]

I must have been confused about your prior post as something
made me read it as saying your present card did have TV-Out
but with the upgrade you also wanted TV-Out and some "other"
benefit.

One of the problems is your PSU may have been merely
adequate for the system as-is, many of the more powerful
video cards use a significant amount of power but even a
lower end card is going to use more power than the
integrated video does. Since TV-Out isn't demanding you
should choose a current generation, lowest end card from ATI
or nVidia, unless you need something in particular like HDMI
output (I assumed you wanted S-Video out for TV or ???).



Besides the TV-Out, you don't mention anything that would
make any particular level of card an improvement except that
by using a separate card instead of integrated video (any
card at all, even low end or very old) you relieve the
system from devoting a certain amount (128MB) and bandwidth
of system memory to the video, so the rest of the system
would gain a slight (might not be enough to notice in most
uses outside of gaming) performance boost, but for
windows/2D mode, there is nothing demanding enough of the
video itself to see much benefit.



It would be hard to find a modern video card that degraded
performance below that of the integrated video, but the
thing is that for 2D uses, the power of modern video cards
in processing is mostly wasted, their mostly going to have
gains in 3D gaming besides the other issue you are facing,
more features like TV-Out but even cheap cards support that
now.



I doubt it, you would get very little if any return on this
upgrade when it comes time to sell a used and aged system.
If it were a pretty new system and had a relatively high end
video card you might get 1/3rd to 2/3rd of the value of that
card back out at resale time but even this is doubtful at
auction, for used parts past the current generation. Video
cards just depreciate too much, especially what you're
wanting which is one power miserly enough that it might run
from your marginal 250W PSU.



If you don't want to spend much then how could it be worth
much adding to resale value of the system even in a perfect
world? Your requirements aren't hard to meet, you might
look around for some sale or rebate offers at your favorite
online vendors. I would avoid ebay for something like this
unless you feel like taking the risks, as video cards can
often be partially damaged then resold on ebay (unless
clearly claimed as new in box still).



I don't understand why you are having trouble finding one.
I suggest going to newegg.com and using their search
parameters on the left hand side of the page in the video
card category to choose AGP (I'm assuming your board
supports 4X/8X with the following link, if not backtrack and
choose 2X/4X),
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...&Subcategory=48&description=&Ntk=&srchInDesc=

That's 121 hits, you should probably avoid the old FX5xxx
series (like FX5200, FX5500, etc) merely because they tended
to use more power, run slightly hotter. If you end up having
to replace the PSU to support a card, it will practically
double the cost.


Here's a Radeon 9250 if you only needed composite TV out,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121525

here's a Radeon 9550 with an attractive after-rebate price,
supporting S-Video and Composite TV-Out and at $23 after
rebate I can't feel it worthwhile to use ebay at all.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102458
the heatsink on the following might be "slightly" better,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131049
though with any of these passively cooled cards I recommend
that you leave the adjacent motherboard slot empty and leave
that empty slot's rear case bracket cover off, which will
cause more passive airflow over the card.

If your case cooling is very bad, you might think about
getting a card with a fan but that will increase noise
levels a bit, and these fans tend to have fairly short
lives, it might be a maintenance issue to replace it every
year or two.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814103162

A reasonable alternative from nVidia might be one of their
6200 series.

If you're just itching to go with ebay instead, the best
value would be something older. You just don't need a
current generation card merely to support TV-Out, so long as
you note the specs displayed with item listing you can
discriminate them and the issue of it being slower at gaming
won't matter since you make no mention of that being
important. Too many cards over the years supported TV-Out
to begin listing them all, it's not as though any one has
enough merits you would ignore the others, since the whole
point of a risk on ebay would seem to be trying for the
cheapest thing possible, since as I linked above you can get
brand new cards for under $30. One suggestion would be that
in general if the card has a large heatsink with a fan, that
means it's producing more heat during operation and as such,
using more power from your PSU so again it could come closer
or exceed capacity and you'd have to replace the PSU.

Hello Kony,

I just wanted to thank you for your extensive insight on this issue.
It was extremely helpful to me. To be honest with you, my knowledge
of video cards is rather low. While I've upgraded many components in
the past, I usually never touched the video, as I saw no reason to.
But, it's pretty obvious that with my system as is, I'm pretty limited
to the low end cards. But, since I'm not a gamer, that's no big deal.
It's hard to believe anyone would dish out $250.00 for a graphics
card. I didn't pay much more than that for my whole system.

Your links on Newegg were also helpful. I took at a look at all cards
you mentioned. I'll most likely go with the Radeon 9550 with the
rebate offer. That seems like the best deal.

Thanks again for the help!

Chris

 

[Chris]

Man, I just received the Sapphire Radeon 9550SE card today and guess
what... I can not for the life of me get the TV out to work properly.
The image is all washed out, flickering up and down, and in black and
white. Terrible. I used their include VGA to composite adapter and
hooked to the composte in of my TV. I also played with the settings
in ATI, but nothing works.

What a drag. I put in a trouble ticket with ATI. Hopefully on of
their skilled technicians will get back to me soon, otherwise this is
going right back to Newegg.

 

[kony]

Man, I just received the Sapphire Radeon 9550SE card today and guess
what... I can not for the life of me get the TV out to work properly.
The image is all washed out, flickering up and down, and in black and
white. Terrible. I used their include VGA to composite adapter and
hooked to the composte in of my TV. I also played with the settings
in ATI, but nothing works.

What a drag. I put in a trouble ticket with ATI. Hopefully on of
their skilled technicians will get back to me soon, otherwise this is
going right back to Newegg.

Sorry to hear you're having bad luck. If this is a simple
inline pin adapter for the S-Video to Composite, you
probably need to find the right driver setting to change.
I'm not familiar with the Catalyst Control Center anymore
but would look in there first.

 

[Noozer]

What resolution? What TV? Have you tried SVideo?

 

[Paul]

Man, I just received the Sapphire Radeon 9550SE card today and guess
what... I can not for the life of me get the TV out to work properly.
The image is all washed out, flickering up and down, and in black and
white. Terrible. I used their include VGA to composite adapter and
hooked to the composte in of my TV. I also played with the settings
in ATI, but nothing works.

What a drag. I put in a trouble ticket with ATI. Hopefully on of
their skilled technicians will get back to me soon, otherwise this is
going right back to Newegg.

That could be a problem with the adapter itself. S-video consists of
two signals, Y and C. If only one was connected and working, I think
you'd get black and white. This is what is inside the adapter (see
ascii-art schematic at the top of the page).

http://www.epanorama.net/circuits/svideo2cvideo.html

Paul

 

[Chris]

Hello,

Well, I finally got it to work! After posting messages to the
Sapphire Help forum, I found that I needed to actually move a jumper
on the card itself. Apparently it was set to PAL format instead of
NTSC format. Once I did that, I also had to apply NTSC in Catalyst.
Once this was done, I got a nice clear picture of just my wallpaper.

To change that, I had to clone the monitor display to the Secondary
display, and that finally did the trick! This is great, I'm watching
Sky News on my TV while I'm typing here and the picture is just as
clear as cable! I'm impressed!

Chris