Linux - Software that doesn't deliver

[Mike]

Yes, Linux has a multitude of versions but many see that as a strength.
Linux can be tailored for a specific task and that's why there's so many
"fragments". This same multitude can be ignored by the vast majority of
users, unless of course you fit into one of it's niche markets.
Realisticly
there's only 5 or 6 key flavors, with Ubuntu leading the way for the home
user.

How do you know which "5 or 6" are the "key flavors"?

And how are Vista's choice clearly labeled to their target audience?
"Business" is the only clear one. Basic, Premium and Ultimate...not
really
clear, other than that Ultimate sounds "better" than the others. Why do
they need 4 versions? Why not just two? One for home, one for business?

That's HOME Basic and HOME Premium.

Why not just 1 or 2 Linux flavors? Why do they need hundreds? Or even "5
or 6".

Mike

 

[GO]

If you do want to give Linux a try I would recommend Ubuntu. It's by far
the easiest Linux to deal with, that I've seen anyways (PCLinuxOS is
supposed to be quite good too). The Linux forums are not always better than
here, that is, there's "knuckleheads" for both parties (this was one of my
biggest frustrations when I first started playing with Linux, the users in
the forums were very arrogant and had an elitist attitude about them. This
has changed dramatically). I'm not saying it hasn't happened but I did not
see any evidence of this within the Ubuntu forums. Ubuntu is geared for the
home users (ie newbies) and is reflected in the forums. The responses to my
questions were very helpful and quite detailed. There are a lot of users
that could make the switch to Linux and it will do everything they need, but
it's still not a suitable replacement for Windows "power users", IMO. It's
improving in leaps and bounds with every release though, and at the rate MS
releases things it could replace it in a few years

 

[Mike]

Yes, Linux has a multitude of versions but many see that as a strength.

And how are Vista's choice clearly labeled to their target audience?
"Business" is the only clear one. Basic, Premium and Ultimate...not
really
clear, other than that Ultimate sounds "better" than the others. Why do
they need 4 versions? Why not just two? One for home, one for business?

Why do Linux Loonies think that 4 versions of Vista is confusing, but the
"multitude of Linux versions is a strength"?

Nope, no double standards here folks!

Mike

 

[GO]

Check points are a pain. If I want to save the game seconds before
certain death, that should be my choice and not have to wait until I
get to the check point after repeating a hard section twenty times.
If that doesn't straighten out, I won't have much use for Windows. On
the bright side, at least you don't have to genuinize to go to the
next level yet ;-)

Alias

Yeah, check points are a royal pain in the butt. My biggest beef is the
controls. The controls always seem awkward and non-intuitive for games
coming from a console.

On
the bright side, at least you don't have to genuinize to go to the
next level yet ;-)

It's coming. You have heard of Live haven't you? Speaking of Live,
that's something else that concerns me. It might be a good idea on the
consoles but it's something again that doesn't translate well to the PC.
Subscription fees, paying for (simple) content, etc....it's all stuff we
already got included with our games in the first place.

 

[GO]

This is rapidly changing. For normal, home use, it's ready, willing
and able.

Alias

I know. Didn't I already say all that? The biggest thing holding me
back really is time. I've been using Windows for so long I know it like the
back of my hand. Linux is still so foreign in many respects.

 

[GO]

The problem is that Linux has hundreds of versions, and they all suck.
Some are supported for years, some come and go like Top 40 music.
Pick the wrong one and you are left high and dry after a year or 2.

Vista has 4 choices, each one clearly labeled as to target audience.
Each one with guaranteed support for years to come from a major,
respected and well-financed company.

If the Linux Loonies would just standardize on their versions - 1 for
home, 1 for business etc., Linux might stand a chance. The total
chaos, fragmentation and duplication of effort that exists now will
always be the downfall of Linux.

Mike

Yes, Linux has a multitude of versions but many see that as a strength.
Linux can be tailored for a specific task and that's why there's so many
"fragments". This same multitude can be ignored by the vast majority of
users, unless of course you fit into one of it's niche markets. Realisticly
there's only 5 or 6 key flavors, with Ubuntu leading the way for the home
user.

And how are Vista's choice clearly labeled to their target audience?
"Business" is the only clear one. Basic, Premium and Ultimate...not really
clear, other than that Ultimate sounds "better" than the others. Why do
they need 4 versions? Why not just two? One for home, one for business?

 

[GO]

I figure Vista will be as much of a learning curve and has carried
over the some of the same drawbacks of XP as well as its own. The
great thing with Ubuntu is it's so easy to install so if push comes
to shove and you regularly back up, restoring all back is fairly
quick and painless. You can also make an image like with Acronis and
Windows but I haven't gotten to that yet ;-)

Alias

Agreed. Vista's done very little to impress me so far, so that may
ultimately be the push I need to make the move.

 

[Mr. Happy]

Well, Linux, it was fun to see you again, but its time to send you back to
the hole whence you came.

Linux had 2 years or more since I last messed with it to improve.
Cosmetically, there were some improvements, functionality and ease of use.
ZERO improvement. Well Linux community, give it another try, you keep on
editing those config files and trying to get answers on your forums. I'm
going to get what I want from my computer, even if I have to pay for it
for the next 2 years. Let me know if you fix it between now and then.

You're pretty pathetic. Anyone who starts off by partitioning with PM when
most distros will do that for you when they install, is definitely a
Wintard. Please do stick with Windoze. You deserve to run that old and
pathetic os.

Shake Hands With,
Mr. Happy

 

[Mr. Happy]

The problem is that Linux has hundreds of versions, and they all suck.
Some are supported for years, some come and go like Top 40 music. Pick
the wrong one and you are left high and dry after a year or 2.

Linux development is proceeding at such a rapid pace that most Linux users
don't want to keep a particular version for more than a year or 2. We love
the innovation that comes out RAPIDLY within the Linux community. So stick
with XP, an OLD and p.o.s. operating system. You won't be missed in the
Linux world, I can assure you. If you feel stupid enough, "upgrade" to
Vista.

Mike

Shake Hands With,
Mr. Happy

 

[Mr. Happy]

I prefer to pay money for the Windows operating systems, because as you
pointed out, you get what you pay for.

C.B.

Yep, certainly makes all the malware Windoze scoops up worth more, now that
you've paid for it.

Shake Hands With,
Mr. Happy

 

[GO]

How do you know which "5 or 6" are the "key flavors"?

Same way you learn anything else. Do some research or talk to people.

That's HOME Basic and HOME Premium.

Why not just 1 or 2 Linux flavors? Why do they need hundreds? Or
even "5 or 6".

Mike

I thought I already clarified why there are many variations of Linux.
Ultimately it's the nature of the beast. Linux is Open Source which allows
people to freely modify the code. Groups of people get together and want
Linux to do something specific, so it fragments into it's own project. The
vast majority of these Linux-es don't even show up on the radar. The 5 or 6
big players meet the majorty of user's needs. But you're right it does
have it's faults as they do lose focus while they're doing their own thing.
But versions like Ubuntu are trying to remedy that; they have a solid
financial backing and are focusing on the home user.

 

[GO]

Why do Linux Loonies think that 4 versions of Vista is confusing, but
the "multitude of Linux versions is a strength"?

Nope, no double standards here folks!

Mike

I never said it was confusing. Just wondering why they need 3 home
versions?

And the "multitude of Linux versions is a strength" isn't the strength
(yeah, that's what I said, but not what I meant). It's strength is that
people can customize it to meet their specific needs. Those customized
versions have a big enough demand that they remain as their own version.

 

[Mr. Happy]

How do you know which "5 or 6" are the "key flavors"?


That's HOME Basic and HOME Premium.

Why not just 1 or 2 Linux flavors? Why do they need hundreds? Or even
"5 or 6".

Mike

They don't *need* it you Wintard. The fact is that the operating system is
open source. So anyone, with the knowledge and will, can easily go and
create his/her own distro and put it out for the world to consider. Many of
these distros might be based on an existing one, such as the many now
available that are based on Ubuntu. These other distros do certain things
differently than the way Ubuntu chooses to put out their distro. Some
people appreciate the differences and choose a fork of Ubuntu rather than
Ubuntu. With Linux is all about choice and freedom. If you want to be a
Microsoft serf, then fine, be one. Many of us appreciate the freedom and
innovations that come with the many distros out there.

Shake Hands With,
Mr. Happy

 

[noaim]

I dont understand why u guys sit in here and feud about windows or linux
everyone has a right to there choice of OS. neither one of you guys are
going to change the others mind. Bottom line is no matter how hard the
linux users push it on everyone it isnt going to change the fact of how many
people in the world use windows simply cause of the fact that all the pc's
in the store are running windows (besides for the mac crowd) im simply
stating that it makes no difference how much u guys argue its never going to
change the way things are right now. Untill a corporation with some backing
takes on a linux project to get it installed on pc's that sit in bestbuy its
not going to take over the market. What did however interest me is that you
can order dell computers with linux preinstalled. Maybe there is also
others. I run windows primarily but i have virtual pc with about 4 linux
distros installed and play around with them regularly. Linux does not cover
my needs in every aspect but nor does windows hence why i even have the
virtual pc set up. so quit arguing and bickering about what ones better and
come to reality you will like what you like and they will like what they
like it will never change.

 

[Frank]

Linux development is proceeding at such a rapid pace that most Linux users
don't want to keep a particular version for more than a year or 2. We love
the innovation that comes out RAPIDLY within the Linux community. So stick
with XP, an OLD and p.o.s. operating system. You won't be missed in the
Linux world, I can assure you. If you feel stupid enough, "upgrade" to
Vista.

Yeah, that guy in his garage in Germany is just burning the midnight oil
cranking out worthless toy os's for linturds like you to eat and enjoy
every 6 moths...wow...hahahah...lol!
Right, doris?
Frank

 

[Lang Murphy]

GOOD THINGS ABOUT LINUX:

<snip>

Yes, there are good things about nix...

Failures of Linux:

<snip>

Yes, there are places where nix fails...

From my perspective, which maps very much to your perspective, nix
requires -too much time- of it's user to get things working as expected. I'm
playing around with Ubuntu 7.04 right now. There appears to be pretty good
support in alt.os.linux.ubuntu, but, like here, depends on who responds to
one's queries. No doubt my view is slanted by being one of those folks who,
pretty much, has no problems with Vista. Sure, I've got my one or two nits
that I don't like about Vista, but, generally, I'm a happy camper.

All that said... ultimately, no pun intended, one must spend a fair amount
of time learning nix's different way of doing things. If one is willing to
invest the time, from what I've read, there are few things that nix won't do
that Windows can. Can't comment on the gaming aspect... not a gamer. But if
one is a gamer, and that support happens to be, in fact, one of the major
deficiencies of nix, then, no doubt, I can see that as being a major road
block to moving to nix as a desktop replacement for Windows.

Like yourself, I like to keep an open mind on nix and dip my toes into the
nix pool every couple of years, just to see how things are progressing. I
think some folks may take your indictment of nix as an indication that
you're closed minded. Well... you never would have come to the conclusions
you did, without having attempted using a nix distro. Whether you invested
as much time as nix fans might deem appropriate, is beyond me. No doubt this
thread will generate plenty of replies from that camp, given the number of
nix aficionados who hang out in this ng.

Thanks for the detailed post; appreciated!

Lang

 

[Alias]

Installed Vista myself...bought linux at Best Buy in a box,did not
download it.

Vista doesn't "work out of the box". You need to add Java, Flash, Adobe
Reader (or some substitute), your programs, updates, etc. You also have
to know what to look for and what to look for. With Ubuntu, everything
comes from the same place.

Which flavor of Linux?

Alias

 

[Mike]

Vista doesn't "work out of the box". You need to add Java,

Only if you want to run Java apps. I don't so I don't need the Java
baggage.

Flash,

Only if you want to see animated ads on every web page you look at. I
don't so I don't need Flash either.

Adobe > Reader (or some substitute),

Acrobat reader 5. A 30 second install.

your programs, updates, etc. You also have to know what to look for and
what to look for. With Ubuntu, everything comes from the same place.

So "your programs" come with Linux?

Mike

 

[Alias]

Only if you want to run Java apps. I don't so I don't need the Java
baggage.

Your choice. My point was you need to go to different places to get what
you want with Vista and, with Ubuntu, you don't.

Only if you want to see animated ads on every web page you look at. I
don't so I don't need Flash either.

No You Tube for you then. Gosh, how can you live without seeing Steve
Ballmer do his little jig?

Acrobat reader 5. A 30 second install.

8 is out now. Better rush over to Adobe and get it.

So "your programs" come with Linux?

Mike

All the programs I need come with Ubuntu and Automatix2. What I don't
need and you do are anti virus and anti malware programs. With a hard
firewall router, I don't need a soft firewall either. I also don't need
the WPA and WGA programs.

Alias

 

[The poster formerly known as Nina DiBoy]

You think that too eh? I've actually grown concerned for the future of PC
gaming lately. Too many games these days are being released cross-platform,
but the PC version seems to be an after thought. I understand why they
develop cross-platform as it increases their potential sales, but too many
games just don't translate well, or maybe they would if they put a little
more effort/thought into it.

Yes, the field of PC gaming is dying. It's sad, I'm sure gonna miss it
one day. When my son was very young, he wanted gameboys and Nintendos
and all that stuff just like his friends had. But I saved my money and
bought him a computer instead. Now 10 years later he's loves PC gaming,
but also does all kinds of other cool stuff on his machine like movies,
stop motion animation, authors music, science stuff (he has a USB
microscope and telescope), websites, etc. And he doesn't really like
game consoles, he says they are boring because all you can do is play
games.

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