Just ordered this setup from Newegg

B

Bob

I looked quite extensively at other burners, Sony included, and the main
reason I went with the one I did was because many reviewers have expressed
they felt it was the fastest burner with the highest quality burns
available. I did give serious consideration to NEC, though.
Click to expand...

LG seems to be a good unit. Do you know of an internal equivalent?


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
J

J.C. Scott

Bob said:
See how much that system would cost you at Directron in Houston. They
will build it and burn it in for an extra $27, which is cheap
insurance.

http://www.directron.com/

Although you do have a few expensive parts in that system, I find it
hard to believe it will cost you $2K at Directron.

BTW, you shoudl consider a Zalman copper heat sink for that P4. My son
has a 3.2GHz Prescott retail box and the cooler was not adequate. The
Zalman 7700 will cool a rocket motor.
Click to expand...

I've also read from others that the stock fan wasn't sufficient in some
cases. I've heard good things about Cooler Master, as well. After looking
at the Zalman CNPS7700-CU on Newegg, the comments and specs look good to me.
After looking at the photos and some of the comments, my only reservation is
its size and whether it'll actually fit into the Intel 915PBL.
Why buy separate sound and video cards when many Intel chipset
motherboards have integrated sound and video on the board.
Click to expand...

I listen to a lot of music and do a fair amount of recording, and
considering I've had no problem with the Audigy I've used for the last 3
years, I just trust the name and the product, to be honest. For actual
recording I use a Firewire Audiophile 24/96 and haven't had any hassle using
it in conjunction with the Audigy, and I've grown accustomed to some of the
support software provided. Considering how economical an Audigy 2 ZS
actually is though, I didn't feel like taking a chance on the support or
software (if there is any) for the on-board sound being less than sufficient
for my needs.

In relation to on-board video, I highly doubt any Intel motherboard would
run Battlefield 2 at an acceptable level, which will be a staple in my game
playing repertoire. The X850XT seemed a fair choice considering I probably
won't have to think about upgrading for a year or two.
 
B

Bob

I've also read from others that the stock fan wasn't sufficient in some
cases. I've heard good things about Cooler Master, as well.
Click to expand...

The main difference is I can recommend the Zalman 7700 because my son
has one and it keeps his CPU cool. He uses his machine for both DVD
burning and for games.
After looking
at the Zalman CNPS7700-CU on Newegg, the comments and specs look good to me.
After looking at the photos and some of the comments, my only reservation is
its size and whether it'll actually fit into the Intel 915PBL.
Click to expand...

It fit my son's Abit motherboard with the P4.

http://www.directron.com/abitis7.html

http://www.directron.com/p432e.html

http://www.directron.com/cnps7700cu.html
I listen to a lot of music
Click to expand...

So do I and the on-board audio is suffiicent for me. I never really
like Creative products - their tech department sucks.
In relation to on-board video, I highly doubt any Intel motherboard would
run Battlefield 2 at an acceptable level, which will be a staple in my game
playing repertoire. The X850XT seemed a fair choice considering I probably
won't have to think about upgrading for a year or two.
Click to expand...

My son uses the MSI 128MB GeForce4 MX440 AGP Video Card. I really
don't know what games he plays but I have seen him running Half Life
or its latest incarnation. But then I do not believe that's very
demanding since we ran it on ordinary desktops at work.

--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
B

Bob

You may want to look at the LG GSA-4163B, which has received really, really
good reviews. Here's a *very* extensive review on the unit:

It's also listed for $47.99 at Directron vs. $51.99 at Newegg.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the heads up.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
B

Bob

I've also read from others that the stock fan wasn't sufficient in some
cases.
Click to expand...

I forgot to mention that my son also has 3 Panaflow 80mm fans on his
case, one in the front blowing in, one on the side blowing out and one
in the back blowing out - in addition to the fan in the PSU.

http://www.directron.com/80l1a.html

So his case was plenty cool, as measured using Everest. The retail box
cooler is inadequate for high-stress use with that CPU. The Zalman
7700 may be overkill but it has worked well for my son and that
includes in the heat of the summer day in Houston, where it is 100F on
the north side of my house every day.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
J

J.C. Scott

Bob said:
The main difference is I can recommend the Zalman 7700 because my son
has one and it keeps his CPU cool. He uses his machine for both DVD
burning and for games.


It fit my son's Abit motherboard with the P4.

http://www.directron.com/abitis7.html

http://www.directron.com/p432e.html

http://www.directron.com/cnps7700cu.html



So do I and the on-board audio is suffiicent for me. I never really
like Creative products - their tech department sucks.
Click to expand...

For casual listening, on-board sound would be perfectly suitable I'd
imagine, but as a user who does do some audio production, I'm interested in
relieving the stress of any extra processing that might be required of the
motherboard due to having to take on the load of processing the sound
internally. Also, there's the issue of compatibility related to audio
production software, which I use quite a lot of, including Sequoia, Cubase
and Wavelab, among others. Also, for critical listening, I wouldn't trust
on-board sound to meet the demand.
My son uses the MSI 128MB GeForce4 MX440 AGP Video Card. I really
don't know what games he plays but I have seen him running Half Life
or its latest incarnation. But then I do not believe that's very
demanding since we ran it on ordinary desktops at work.
Click to expand...

I have a GeForce 4 Ti4600. It's not up to the task of playing Battlefield 2,
and it's a far better card, performance wise, than the MX440.

I mean, I can understand investing in a low-end card, or even using on-board
video, if games weren't a primary interest, but in my case they are. Again,
if you're not into games then there's no point in investing in a high-end
card, but if you really want to enjoy a lot of the games that will be coming
out with all the bells and whistles turned on in the game, a low-end
graphics card won't be suitable, unfortunately.
 
K

kony

I happen to like Directron. The main reason is I know some of the
people there. I did business with them back when they were starting
out as Houston Computer Center. They have always treated me right,
even though I am certainly not a large customer. The company is run by
computer enthusiasts, not minimum wage morons. You can immediately see
that when you visit their new facilities.


I have talked to newegg and their people are arrogant. The reason is
because they really don't know what they are doing nor do they care.
Click to expand...


I have quite the opposite impression, that Directron,
including Michael Chang, have arrogant tendencies. This is
from direct correspondence with him. I overlook it now, but
the main point may be that everyone has bad days, any
company may have grunt CSRs that aren't the most courteous.
Even so, in general Newegg has done far better in the
customer relations department than Directron, _IMO_.

Never heard of them.


From what I read here and the other forums, Sony is not alone. People
are bitching about NEC and some of the other brand names.
Click to expand...

Sony is among the worst, which is somewhat inexcusible as
it's not even remotely a Sony drive, rather they slapped a
different bezel on the drive (or sometimes not even that
much, just the name on the bezel). Regardless, Sony chose
to modify the firmware to (do nothing useful) only prevent
easy firmware upgrades that liteon DOES provide to their
customers, so certainly to Sony as well... even if Sony had
to download them from Liteon's website just like everybody
else. Anyway the point was, there's really no good reason
to get the Sony version.


The specs do not match the Sony my son has very well. Maybe you are
thinking about a different Lite-On unit.

His unit is Sony DW-D26A 16X DVD+/-RW DVD Burners, Double Layer 4X
DVD+R, OEM.

http://www.directron.com/dwd26a.html
Click to expand...


Yes you're right- the Liteon at the same price point is a
newer/faster drive, has DVD+R 8X instead of 4X. I guess
that's where Sony takes their markup profits.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16827131250
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16827106967

http://www.directron.com/nd3520bg.html

Yet it is one of the most bitched about drives.
Click to expand...

I disagree, I keep hearing that it burns better on far more
media.

If you could get NEC to provide firmware revisions...
Click to expand...

Right out of the box, it's reported to work better. That
seems pretty straightforward a benefit.

However, you don't seem to have bothered to look for any
firmware. A simple Google search for "NEC firmware" brings
up several viable links, including this:

http://www.de.nec.de/softwareoverview2.php/id/215

However, if one were to do the "normal" thing one would do
when looking for drivers, ie:

- Go to manufacturers website, http://www.nec.com/

- Click on "service and support",

- Click "download drivers",
http://www.nec.com/cgi-bin/support/support.cgi?cat=download

- Click "removable storage", "firmware"

That someone might, with a bit of luck (no, not really luck,
that's the same method to navigate any website), they'd end
up at the NEC firmware downloads page,
http://support.necsam.com/oem/downloads/flashfirmware/

From past experiences with Sony/Liteon drives, I can recall
that I ended up modifying the Liteon firmware to get the
Sony drive to accept it, because Sony couldn't be bothered
to update the firemware in a timely fashion. At least they
rebadged Lite-On drives instead of something bad like BTC.
 
K

kony

He should not have spent in the neighborhood of $2K in the first
place. One of the ways to save would have been to buy a motherboard
with on-board video.
Click to expand...


You seem to have forgotten to tell us we can't have decent
systems BEFORE we went out and bought them. NOW what are we
supposed to do? Are we allowed to buy games?

$2K might be a bit rich, but then people spent a lot on all
sorts of things they "could" get cheaper if they'd make a
few sacrifices... IMO, integrated video is fine for office,
email, surfing, DVD- but not gaming... PCs are customizable
because we can't all get by on low-end stuff.

BTW, if you must settle for integrated video, skip Intel's
version as it's incredibly slow... moreso than the old
nForce2 chipsets or ATI's current.
 
J

J.C. Scott

Bob said:
The main difference is I can recommend the Zalman 7700 because my son
has one and it keeps his CPU cool. He uses his machine for both DVD
burning and for games.


It fit my son's Abit motherboard with the P4.
Click to expand...

I went ahead and dropped an order for one.
 
K

kony

That's not what I read. No one bitches about the Sony on the H/W
forums but I have heard lots of bitching about NEC, Lite-On and LG.
Click to expand...

Depends on which HW forums you visit... fewer might bitch
because it's know you can hack them to use Liteon firmware-
but WHY? Why do that when you can buy same drive at same
price-point (or better) and not have to deal with that?

It's a bit ridiculous to use "bitching" about Lite-On as a
reason to use a Sony, since a Sony _IS_ a Lite-On except for
that Sony firmware problem. More likely, Sony just sells
far fewer drives due to the slight markup.
 
B

Bob

It's a bit ridiculous to use "bitching" about Lite-On as a
reason to use a Sony, since a Sony _IS_ a Lite-On except for
that Sony firmware problem. More likely, Sony just sells
far fewer drives due to the slight markup.
Click to expand...

Are you sure that is all there is to the Sony?

I have read that Sony's firmware is improved compared to LiteOn.

All I can tell you is that my son literally beats the livin' crap out
of his Sony and it has never caused him any problems. He has not
burned any double layer so we don't know how it works there.

As I gather these are the main contenders for DVD burner in the $50
price class:

Sony DW-D26A
NEC ND-3520A
LG GSA-4163B
Lite-on SOHW-1673

The reviews indicate that none of them is completely reliable, and
that it may take a little more time for this class of DVD burners to
mature.

So how does one decide which is the best for the money?


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
B

Bob

I went ahead and dropped an order for one.
Click to expand...

Assuming it fits, which it should, the only other issue is whether to
wire in the speed control. The tech group at Directron said not to
wire it in, but to let the fan run full speed all the time. It does
add a slight bit of extra noise but it is not excessive.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
S

S.Heenan

Bob said:
Sony DW-D26A
NEC ND-3520A
LG GSA-4163B
Lite-on SOHW-1673

The reviews indicate that none of them is completely reliable, and
that it may take a little more time for this class of DVD burners to
mature.

So how does one decide which is the best for the money?
Click to expand...


Hard to do wrong with a Pioneer 109.
 
B

Bob

Hard to do wrong with a Pioneer 109.
Click to expand...

Since it is in the $50 range for a dual layer DVD burner, it belongs
on the list

Sony DW-D26A
NEC ND-3520A
LG GSA-4163B
Lite-on SOHW-1673
Pioneer DVR-109

So which is the best for the money for ordinary everyday use? Forget
about dual layer - too expensive.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
 
R

Robert Heiling

Bob said:
Since it is in the $50 range for a dual layer DVD burner, it belongs
on the list

Sony DW-D26A
NEC ND-3520A
LG GSA-4163B
Lite-on SOHW-1673
Pioneer DVR-109

So which is the best for the money for ordinary everyday use? Forget
about dual layer - too expensive.
Click to expand...

I don't know how broad that "$50" category there is and I paid ~$70 for
this one that will do dual layer. Haven't used that feature yet because of
cost of media, but I haven't burned a coaster on it yet. It's probably a
rebranded something or other, but it's labelled an I/O Magic IDVD16DD. I
went thru a BTC and its replacement before giving up on those after I had a
stack of coasters sitting here.

Bob
 
J

J.C. Scott

Bob said:
Assuming it fits, which it should, the only other issue is whether to
wire in the speed control. The tech group at Directron said not to
wire it in, but to let the fan run full speed all the time. It does
add a slight bit of extra noise but it is not excessive.
Click to expand...

So I assume you didn't wire it in?
 
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