Is anything major missing from this first-pass freeware filing system by FUNCTION (not by brand)?

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

Can we fit most to-be-installed freeware programs into this hierarchy?
(Later we'll dive down to what specific freeware goes into each level).

CAN YOU NAME A FREEWARE PROGRAM THAT CAN'T BE FIT INTO THIS HIERARCHY?
- archivers (for things like freeware zip and pdf creators)
- browsers (for things like freeware to browse the Internet)
- calendars (for things like freeware to manage your time and crontabs)
- databases (for things like freeware map programs & calculators)
- editors (for things like freeware picture, audio, video editors)
- finances (for things like freeware financial and tax programs)
- hardware (for things like freeware CD rippers and burners)
- mailers (for things like freeware mail programs)
- networks (for things like freeware ethernet sniffers and firewalls)
- os (for things like freeware operating system tweaks and add-ons)
- players (for things that play media files but don't edit them)
- security (for things like freeware encryption programs)
- usenet (for thinngs like freeware USENET NNTP newsreaders)
- vaccine (for things like freeware antivirus and privacy programs)

Since we could delve into this forever, the MAIN QUESTION is whether or not
anything important is MISSING from this list.

PLEASE propose a USEFUL freeware program that you think does NOT fit into
this freeware filing system - and we'll "fix" what needs to be fixed if the
freeware program is important enough to accomodate.

(Later on, once we hone the top level - we'll choose the programs to go
into this top level.) But first, let's hone the top level!
Thanks,
Donna

Note: Yes, I KNOW there are literally hundreds of possible freeware filing
systems. Most I've seen have severe faults in my humblest of opinions. For
example, if I ever see the word "Utilities" on a filing system, I know
right off the bat the creator doesn't think like I do. Everything is a
utility. Also, if they organize the filing system by brand or marketing
name, again, I realize instantly they think differently than I do. Lastly,
if it contains just one program or a hundred programs, again, I know it's
not a good filing system. A rule of thumb is no more than ten programs to a
directory.


Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

My thoughts are you're going to break the 10 program category limit or
miss a lot of great programs with this mild list:

Hi Bear Bottoms,
I'm not sure I understand how we'll "miss" any programs with a 10-entry
rule of thumb for any one directory.

The ten-entry rule of thumb can easily accomodate 1,000 programs
- 10 top-level categories (e.g., editors)
- 10 sub-categories (e.g., picture editors, video editors, sound editors)
- 10 programs within any one category (e.g., irfanview, gimp, paint.net)

Bearing in mind, any one user would only install what was needed, do we
really need to design a system which easily accomodates way more than 1,000
installed freeware programs?

I should think 1,000 is way more than enough for the average user.

Donna

 

[Bear Bottoms]

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:11:07 -0600, Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator

My thoughts are you're going to break the 10 program category limit or
miss a lot of great programs with this mild list:

- editors (for things like freeware picture, audio, video editors)

Best to break this up into Graphics, Audio, and Video

- finances (for things like freeware financial and tax programs)

What about the other Office programs?

- hardware (for things like freeware CD rippers and burners)

These would go into the Video or Audio category IMO. Hardware brings to
mind Hard disk utilities, System informations tools, etc.

- mailers (for things like freeware mail programs)

Pretty broad category for a 10 program rule.

- networks (for things like freeware ethernet sniffers and firewalls)

Seems to be mixing apples and oranges. Firewalls belong in security IMO.

- os (for things like freeware operating system tweaks and add-ons)

10 program rule

- players (for things that play media files but don't edit them)
- security (for things like freeware encryption programs)
- vaccine (for things like freeware antivirus and privacy programs)

Apples and oranges and 10 program rule.

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

Best to break this up into Graphics, Audio, and Video

Hi Bear Bottoms,
I agree. We were working on the top-level categories first.
We just didn't get to the sub-categories yet.

For example, on my system, the "editor" category has:
c:\programs\editors\graphic (e.g., Paint.Net freeware)
c:\programs\editors\video (e.g., DVDFlick freeware)
c:\programs\editors\audio (e.g., Audacity freeware)
c:\programs\editors\text (e.g., Lemmy freeware)
c:\programs\editors\memo (e.g., OpenOffice freeware)
c:\programs\editors\web (e.g., Webtide freeware)
c:\programs\editors\spreadsheet (e.g., OpenOffice freeware)
c:\programs\editors\slide (e.g., OpenOffice freeware)
c:\programs\editors\hex (e.g., hexedit freeware)

What we need first is to get the top-level categories organized.
- archivers
- browsers
- calendars
- databases
- editors
- finances
- hardware
- mailers
- networks
- os
- players
- security
- usenet
- vaccine

Can anyone propose a generally USEFUL freeware program that doesn't yet fit
into one of the top-level categories listed?

Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

What about the other Office programs?

Hi Bear Bottoms,
You had to bring up Office huh!

Sigh.

If there is one nemesis on earth for a well organized system, it's the
enemy ... Microsoft Office (and as a sub enemy to organization, Open
Office).

What can I say. They are too big and disorganized - yet useful - to try to
rein in. You just have to somehow let them run amuck of your system as
little as possible.

For example, I used to list into a text editor, the thousands (yes,
thousands) of files installed by Microsoft office with PC Magazine In-CTRL4
and INCTRL5. Then, one by one, with PC Magazine's COA (change of address),
I'd move them to where they rightfully belong. Sigh. It worked for years,
but, EVERY SINGLE UPDATE from Microsoft ruined the wonderfully crafted
organization.

I finally gave up. Years ago. Microsoft clutter wins. But not completely.

So, for large office applications, they get their own directory. Notice
that with Microsoft Office, you need to give them MULTIPLE directories
because they have no concept of a top-level directory (sigh).

Sun's Office applications are much better behaved, so, in my freeware
system, there is no Microsoft Office - but I am well aware of trying to
wrest it into some semblence of control.

Here is what I use for office applications (bearing in mind most are
editors)

c:\programs\editors\office\msoffice
c:\programs\editors\office\openoffice

If you can propose a better alternative for all-in-one office freeware
applications, please do so as that is the point of this thread.

Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

These would go into the Video or Audio category IMO. Hardware brings to
mind Hard disk utilities, System informations tools, etc.

Hi Bear Bottoms,
Now we're getting somewhere.

As you surmised, while "editors" is one of the easiest categories,
"hardware" is one of the toughest categories of all.

For example, where do DVD Rippers go?
Where do Motorola Phone Tools go?
Where does TouchCopy (for the iPod) go?
Where do disk analyzers go?
Where does SiSoft Sandra go?
etc.

Most people stick 'em in "util" which is a ridiculous setting since it's a
catch-all for everything. So, I've ATTEMPTED (perhaps not wholly
successfully) to break down these hardware-based utilities (there's that
word again) into what they really do.

For example, in my "hardware" section for freeware DVD authoring, I have:
c:\programs\hardware\disc\rippers (e.g., DVDShrink & DVDFabHD Decrypter)
c:\programs\hardware\disc\burners (e.g., ImgBurn & InfraRecorder)
c:\programs\hardware\disc\translators (e.g., DGIndex & TMPGEnc)
c:\programs\hardware\disc\testers (e.g., DVDIdentifier & DVD Info)

So, if you have a BETTER suggestion for hardware utilities (of which there
can be many, e.g., disk, disc, memory, printer, voip, cellphone, usb,
etc.), then that's what this thread is all about.

I suggest you throw out a freeware hardware utility (that word again) so we
can figure out how it could fit into our hardware top-level category.

Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

Pretty broad category for a 10 program rule.

I don't understand this comment.
Are you saying a user would install more than a dozen (or so) email
programs on any one system?

Or, are you saying since they might only install one or two programs (e.g.,
Blat for command line mail and Thunderbird for GUI-based email), that
mailers are too few to deserve a category unto themselves?

If it's the latter, I tend to agree with you. (I only have two mailers
installed on my system, blat and thunderbird).

But, WHERE would we put mailers then?

Should we move them into the editors top-level category?
c:\programs\editors\mailers

Please advise,
Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

Seems to be mixing apples and oranges. Firewalls belong in security IMO.

You think EXACTLY like I do! I had the SAME CONUNDRUM!
Should I put firewalls in "security" or "networks"?
And vice versa.

Certainly useful network freeware entries are, for example, "macmakeup" &
"WireShark" & "Vidalia", etc. ...

And, just as certainly, useful security freeware entries are, for example,
"TrueCrypt", & "PGP Shredder", & "Advanced File Security" ...

What you are linking (and what I struggled with) is that not all security
is network related and not all network actions are security related ... but
they do mix a bit (for example, what about Jap Anonymizer freeware or
Stunnel freeware, etc.).

If we can figure out a universally held truth, we should strive for that.
But, in the case of "networks" and "security", I go with the 50:50 rule.
About half of you would put, say, "Tor" under network; the other half would
put it under "security".

What actually matters in the end is that we realize it won't be a perfect
system and we make it the best we can by creating the "right" compromise of
categories and sub categories.

So, I agree with you on this one as I've struggled with it myself.
Security and Network are sometimes mixed.

By the way, so are Security and Vaccine, for example:
c:\programs\vaccine\cleaners (e.g., MRU-Blaster & CCleaner freeware)
c:\programs\vaccine\antivirus (e.g., Avast & AntiVir freeware)
c:\programs\vaccine\ads (e.g., Ad-AwarePersonal & SpywareBlaster freeware)
c:\programs\vaccine\idtheft (e.g., Doc Scrubber & ID-Blaster Plus freeware)
c:\programs\vaccine\rootkit (e.g., HiJackThis & RootKit Revealer freeware)
etc.

I ask the collective experts out there ... HOW DO YOU ORGANIZE your
freeware network, security, and vaccine programs?

Is there a more obvious workable method than mine?
Donna

 

[Bear Bottoms]

Hi Bear Bottoms,
I agree. We were working on the top-level categories first.
We just didn't get to the sub-categories yet.

Ah, I understand.

This is a very complex subject and a massive undertaking. The only way
[which I refuse to do] to comprehensively capture as complete a heirarchy
as possible lends to a huge tree and some programs listed various times in
all the categories they fit into. Very complex and sometimes redundant
indeed. I find [KISS] works best for me, though my categories do tend to
expand, albeit slowly.

I'm kinda exploring this myself /always looking for ways to improve this
difficult task/ and here is one list I've collected:

Application Software
Desktop Applications
Spreadsheets and Statistics
CRM Applications
Accounting
Linux Applications
Project Management
Mind Mapping
Code Tools
Code Generators
Analysis
Code Documentation
Compiling
Debugging/Testing
Internationalisation
Localisation
Translation software
Version Control
Change Management
Help Desk / Bug Tracking
Code Editors
Editors - Code
Text Editors
Standards
Code Conversion
Code Migration
Systems Modelling
UML
Software Project Management
Quality Assurance
Useability Testing
Communications
Email
Outlook Add-ons
Email Security
Email Servers
Exchange Add-ons
Anti-spam
Fax
Terminal Emulation
FTP
FTP Clients
FTP Servers
TCP / IP Comms
Serial Comms
Remote Comms
Network Communications
Internet Connection
Wireless
XML Tools
Instant Messaging
SMS Messaging
Collaboration
Components
Component Suites
User Interface components
Buttons
Calendars/Schedulers
Gantt Charts
Charting/Graphing
Grids, Tables, SS
Menus, Tabs, NavBars
Resizers
Trees and Lists
Graphical Development
Diagramming
Drawing Software
Graphical Info Systems
Mapping and GIS
Brainstorming
Problem Solving
Creativity
Wizard creation
Post Code software and data
Addressing software
Libraries
DLLs
C++ Class Libraries
COM Components
ActiveX Components
OCXs
.NET Components
VCL components
Java Beans
Enterprise JavaBeans
J2EE
Component Creation
CORBA
Data and Databases
Databases
Linux Data/Databases
Database Access
Drivers
DB Development
DB Design
DB Management
Data Management
Data Components
DB Maintenance
DB Connectivity
DB Security
Data Validation
SQL
SQL Optimization
Encryption
Compression
Data Conversion
Design Tools
3D Graphics
Multi-media
Imaging Applications
Screen Capture
Desktop Publishing
Image Editing
Illustration
Vector Graphics
Web Imaging Tools
Font Management
Video Editing
Audio Editing
CAD
Documents, Text, Speech
Document Conversion
Word Processing
Spell checking
Text search
Speech Recognition etc
Document Management Workflow
Help
Help Creation
Documentation
Demo/Tutorial Creation
IDEs
C/C++ Development
Cross platform Development
Java Development
Web Development
xBase Development
Mobile Development
Linux Development
Automation
Software Deployment
Installation Software
Software Protection
Evals / Demos
Application packaging
Maths and Stats
Reporting Tools
Printing
PDF Tools
Barcoding
OCR / Scanning
Reporting Components
Reporting COM
Reporting .NET
Reporting Java
Visualisation
System Tools
Linux System Tools
Back Up and Data Recovery
Data Recovery
Anti Virus
Anti-SpyWare
Security
Web Security
Internet security
Network Monitoring
Networking
Operating Systems
Virtual Machines
Linux Distributions
File and Disk Utilities
Search utilities
Desktop Management
Server Software
Microsoft Servers
Linux Servers
Software Asset Management
License Management
System Auditing
Auditing Software
Forensic software
Defragmentation
Registry tools
WEB
e-Commerce
Web Development
Linux Web Dev
Web Components
Web Design
Web page editors
Web Servers
ASP
JSP
PHP
Web - Other Serverside
Web Monitoring / Reports
Web Testing
Content Management
Website Utilities/Apps
Firewall and VPN
HTML
Search Engines
Web Browsers
IDEs
Brainstorming
Code Tools
Systems and Security

 

[Bear Bottoms]

Hi Bear Bottoms,
I'm not sure I understand how we'll "miss" any programs with a 10-entry
rule of thumb for any one directory.

The ten-entry rule of thumb can easily accomodate 1,000 programs
- 10 top-level categories (e.g., editors)
- 10 sub-categories (e.g., picture editors, video editors, sound editors)
- 10 programs within any one category (e.g., irfanview, gimp, paint.net)

Bearing in mind, any one user would only install what was needed, do we
really need to design a system which easily accomodates way more than
1,000
installed freeware programs?

I should think 1,000 is way more than enough for the average user.

Donna

Hmmm, I didn't understand what you meant. 1,000 programs is possibly too
many on the one hand. At one time I wanted to limit my listings to 500 or
less. I'm over that now and still finding more. I'm also trying to develop
a better category tree. It screws my mind up.

The biggest problem is many programs cross many categories. Also,
categories one chooses has many keyword counterparts which almost leads
one in the direction of tagging listings with every keyword you can think
of that one may search for. This whole area of thought brings one back to
compromise it is so daunting.

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

10 program rule

Hi Bear Bottoms,
Again, you've hit the nail on the head.
The OS category was created for all those "things" that just didn't fit
anywhere else.

Most people would shove them under "utilities" but that covers many editors
and databases and other useful program, so, I've banned a category for
"utilities" forever from any of my systems. It's just too broad.

So, I came up with OS for things like:
c:\programs\os\microsoft (e.g., Windows Validation Check & FCIV checksum)
c:\programs\os\registry (e.g., Registry Mechanic & RegScanner freeware)
c:\programs\os\files (e.g., FileDate freeware)
c:\programs\os\tasks (e.g., ProcessExplorer & PSTools freeware
c:\programs\os\system (e.g., SiSoft Sandra freeware)
c:\programs\os\startup (e.g., StartUpCop & startupEntry protection)
c:\programs\os\emulate (e.g., VMWare & MKS Toolkit emulation)
etc.

My rationalization is these are things which the OS should have and which
are things the OS does or does not do for which we needed to augment.

However, if you have a BETTER category for these types of things, please
let us know but the word "utility" is banned and shall not be considered.

Anything else is fair game though as this is yet another of those more
difficult categories...

Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

This whole area of thought brings one back to
compromise it is so daunting.

I know. I know. You and I are kindred souls!
I've been doing this for more than a decade on the Windows-based PC and I
am STILL honing my hierarchies!

For example, do I put usenet into a category in and of itself or do I stick
usenet under browsers.

In yet another attempt at honing the system I've perfected over the years
for MY PC, and my tastes, I propose that system for all to see and comment
upon.

I suspect we'll find a major flaw and minor tweaks ... which is why I
propose this top-level hierarchy:

Can anyone propose a generally USEFUL freeware program that doesn't yet fit
into one (or more) of the top-level categories listed?
- archivers
- browsers
- calendars
- databases
- editors
- finances
- hardware
- mailers
- networks
- os
- players
- security
- usenet
- vaccine

Donna

 

[Bear Bottoms]

However, if you have a BETTER category for these types of things, please
let us know but the word "utility" is banned and shall not be considered.

Oops...I have a utility category

 

[Krazee Brenda]

Note: Yes, I KNOW there are literally hundreds of possible freeware filing
systems. Most I've seen have severe faults in my humblest of opinions. For
example, if I ever see the word "Utilities" on a filing system, I know
right off the bat the creator doesn't think like I do. Everything is a
utility. Also, if they organize the filing system by brand or marketing
name, again, I realize instantly they think differently than I do. Lastly,
if it contains just one program or a hundred programs, again, I know it's
not a good filing system. A rule of thumb is no more than ten programs to a
directory.

Donna

New category.

DonnaWare

Obsessive-compulsive orderliness beyond the sane definition of (wo)mankind.

DonnaWare

 

[Krazee Brenda]

I'm kinda exploring this myself /always looking for ways to improve this
difficult task/ and here is one list I've collected:

< <snipped Bare stuff>

No porn, list....

SuxWare

 

[Bear Bottoms]

I know. I know. You and I are kindred souls!
I've been doing this for more than a decade on the Windows-based PC and I
am STILL honing my hierarchies!

For example, do I put usenet into a category in and of itself or do I
stick
usenet under browsers.

I solved that with an Internet category...though a bit broad, you can
certainly easily find programs that interact with the internet such as
Usenet, browsers, RSS, Chat, downloaders, FTP, P2P, Remote, VPN, and some
Internet /utilities/ etc.

In yet another attempt at honing the system I've perfected over the years
for MY PC, and my tastes, I propose that system for all to see and
comment
upon.

I suspect we'll find a major flaw and minor tweaks ... which is why I
propose this top-level hierarchy:

Can anyone propose a generally USEFUL freeware program that doesn't yet
fit
into one (or more) of the top-level categories listed?
- archivers
- browsers
- calendars
- databases
- editors
- finances
- hardware
- mailers
- networks
- os
- players
- security
- usenet
- vaccine

Donna

My top level categories are:

AUDIO
DVD/CD
EDUCATION
EMAIL
FILE MANAGEMENT
GAMES
GRAPHICS
HARD DRIVE
INTERNET
LINKS
LINUX
OFFICE
PARENTAL CONTROL
PORTABLE
SECURITY
TECH SUPPORT
***UTILITIES***
VIDEO
WEB DEVELOPMENT
WEB SERVICES

However, I am working on a complex project to improve on that...like I
said though...it screws my mind up.

 

[pstevens2]

Hi Bear Bottoms,
You had to bring up Office huh!

Sigh.

If there is one nemesis on earth for a well organized system, it's the
enemy ... Microsoft Office (and as a sub enemy to organization, Open
Office).

What can I say. They are too big and disorganized - yet useful - to try to
rein in. You just have to somehow let them run amuck of your system as
little as possible.

For example, I used to list into a text editor, the thousands (yes,
thousands) of files installed by Microsoft office with PC Magazine In-CTRL4
and INCTRL5. Then, one by one, with PC Magazine's COA (change of address),
I'd move them to where they rightfully belong. Sigh. It worked for years,
but, EVERY SINGLE UPDATE from Microsoft ruined the wonderfully crafted
organization.

I finally gave up. Years ago. Microsoft clutter wins. But not completely.

So, for large office applications, they get their own directory. Notice
that with Microsoft Office, you need to give them MULTIPLE directories
because they have no concept of a top-level directory (sigh).

Sun's Office applications are much better behaved, so, in myfreeware
system, there is no Microsoft Office - but I am well aware of trying to
wrest it into some semblence of control.

Here is what I use for office applications (bearing in mind most are
editors)

c:\programs\editors\office\msoffice
c:\programs\editors\office\openoffice

If you can propose a better alternative for all-in-one officefreeware
applications, please do so as that is the point of this thread.

Donna

c:\programs\suites

Would stand for all in one collections and could include office,
graphics, admin, security etc. They are almost a standalone enough
genre that they could be stripped from sub-categories into their own.

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

I solved that with an Internet category...though a bit broad, you can
certainly easily find programs that interact with the internet such as
Usenet, browsers, RSS, Chat, downloaders, FTP, P2P, Remote, VPN, and some
Internet /utilities/ etc.

Just back from a trip; sorry I was out of pocket today.

An "Internet" category might work.

For example ... freeware mail user agents
c:\programs\internet\mailers\blat
c:\programs\internet\mailers\thunderbird

And ... freeware usenet clients
c:\programs\internet\usenet\freeagent
c:\programs\internet\usenet\pan

And freeware web browsers ...
c:\programs\internet\browsers\firefox
c:\programs\internet\browsers\ie

And freeware chat clients ...
c:\programs\internet\chat\aim
c:\programs\internet\chat\yahoo

And freeware file-transfer & login clients ...
c:\programs\internet\ftp\cuteFtp
c:\programs\internet\telnet\putty

etc.

But, I agree that "internet" may be too broad a category as I'd bet half my
programs interact with the Internet in some way.

Donna

 

[Donna Ohl, Grady Volunteer Coordinator]

My top level categories are:
AUDIO DVD/CD EDUCATION EMAIL FILE MANAGEMENT GAMES GRAPHICS HARD DRIVE
INTERNET LINKS LINUX OFFICE PARENTAL CONTROL PORTABLE SECURITY
TECH SUPPORT ***UTILITIES*** VIDEO WEB DEVELOPMENT WEB SERVICES

Wow. This is a GREAT list to see what categories I'm missing.
I can see I forgot all about "games", for example.
While that says something about me, I'm sure there are people out there who
really do play freeware solitaire (shoot me if I ever do, by the way), so
I'll thankfully ADD "games" to my listings.

Some cagtegories you listed I had not thought of are ...
- education (what might that be?)
- links (why would a directory of links be needed?)
- linux (I thought we were talking Windows OS here?)
- parental control (now that's an interesting one)
- portable (what might this be?)
- web services (what might that be?)

Can you elaborate on these half-dozen new categories?
Donna

 

[Krazee Brenda]

Hi Bear Bottoms,
Again, you've hit the nail on the head.

Hi Bear Bottoms,
You had to bring up Office huh!

Hi Bear Bottoms,
Bearing in mind,

Hi Bear Bottoms,
I know. I know. You and I are kindred souls!

Hi Bear Bottoms,
Now we're getting somewhere

Hi Bear Bottoms,
You think EXACTLY like I do!

ProjectileVomitWare