Improve Junk Mail filtering.

[Guest]

Hey, Microsoft! You are dreadfully behind in the email/internet security
war. Why can't Outlook work WITH email providers to do the following:
1] Allow us to list entire domains in Blocked Senders list. If there's a
way to do it now... where are you hiding the instructions??
2] Why isn't, after identifying an email as junk and listing that
address/domain in Blocked Senders list, that address/domain stopped at the
server?? Do you really think I want to go through my Junk Folder to find
email from addresses/domains I already blocked?? THINK!! Okay, so we make a
mistake now and again... after marking an email as junk and/or blocked three
times, it's pretty much a given that we don't want mail from that
address/domain. C'mon MS... get with it.
3] If we block an address/domain in OUTLOOK... why can't that information be
seamlessly transferred to email providers so that 1] the junk is stopped at
the server and 2] and we don't need to set up redundant blocked lists with
email providers... and that would include hotmail and msn email.
If spammers can get in... MS should be able to stop them... you're supposed
to be smarter than they are... OR MS is benefiting somehow from the battle.
MS has already been found to be a spammer in their own right (yeah... sad,
but true). My legitimate email keeps me busy enough... I don't have time to
waste cleaning out the junk that comprises 90% of my email.
MS is also dreadfully poor at other security. And MS tech support isn't
much help!! I recently had problems with cpu usage spiking to 100% and
freezing my system or slowing it down so far that it took my computer ten
minutes to execute a command (I'm not exagerating here). Rebooting was the
only way to reset everything. I thought my computer was clean... after all,
I had SP2, MS Anti-Spyware Beta, Norton Internet Security and Norton System
Works. I even told MS tech support that my computer was CLEAN. IT WAS NOT.
MS and Norton allowed my computer to become compromised. It took many hours,
but I finally resolved the problem MYSELF, with some help from another forum
(a non-microsoft forum). MS tech support had me jumping through hoops and
playing all manner of games that had me chasing my own tail (so to speak) and
accomplished nothing. The non-microsoft forums gave me information that
actually HELPED and pointed me in the right direction for other good
information.
Why must we have a half a dozen protection programs?? I shudder to think of
my vulnerability without Norton (and Norton isn't that great as I found out
the hard way!).
MS practically has the PC world in its back pocket... but MS is NOT a good
leader, does NOT provide the excellence that it CLAIMS to provide either in
the programs it offers OR tech support. MS has gotten too big for its
britches and is arrogant as hell and needs to rejoin us down here where the
human race resides (IOW... a little humility please and BETTER products AND
lower prices... Lord knows you have the money for it... you charge an arm and
a leg for applications and then charge us again for tech support. You should
be ashamed of yourselves. You're a leader, Microsoft??? So, lose the
arrogance, lose the greed, and .... LEAD!!!!!
Thanx for letting me sound off... I just get so p-o'd with arrogant
corporations who talk and say nothing and boast beyond their ability or
desire to DO or DO THE RIGHT THING.

----------------
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http://www.microsoft.com/office/com...2d113801a&dg=microsoft.public.outlook.general

 

[Ben M. Schorr - MVP]

Hey, Microsoft! You are dreadfully behind in the email/internet security
war. Why can't Outlook work WITH email providers to do the following:
1] Allow us to list entire domains in Blocked Senders list. If there's a
way to do it now... where are you hiding the instructions??
*@domain.com

2] Why isn't, after identifying an email as junk and listing that
address/domain in Blocked Senders list, that address/domain stopped at the
server??

What kind of server are you using? There are a lot of different kinds of
mailservers, most of them not made by Microsoft. It would be difficult for
Microsoft to identify exactly what kind of server you're using and nearly
impossible for them to get it to block messages based upon a client-side
block list.

3] If we block an address/domain in OUTLOOK... why can't that information
be
seamlessly transferred to email providers so that 1] the junk is stopped
at
the server and 2] and we don't need to set up redundant blocked lists with
email providers... and that would include hotmail and msn email.

Because one man's junk is another man's gold. What if somebody reports you
as a spammer and suddenly all the messages you send get sent to the trash?
What if you decide you don't want mail from aol.com addresses anymore --
should all aol.com traffic be blocked? (o.k., maybe it should) Not
everybody considers the same things spam and letting one person's block list
control what other people receive is a recipe for bad things.

If spammers can get in... MS should be able to stop them...

They do stop a lot of them. But they can't stop them all. It's too
difficult for a machine to know exactly what is and isn't spam to absolute
certainty and MS doesn't have the resources (or the incentive) to manually
watch every message and clean it by hand.

you're supposed to be smarter than they are...

Nothing is fool-proof because fools are so ingenious.

but true). My legitimate email keeps me busy enough... I don't have time
to
waste cleaning out the junk that comprises 90% of my email.

Get a good anti-spam product. Block lists are a fairly weak defense;
spammers change or spoof their addresses more often than something that
happens really often. SpamBayes is pretty good, and free for personal use.
Let me set some expectations, though, no anti-spam product is going to stop
100% of the spam and have zero false positives without imposing additional
effort upon your correspondants.

MS is also dreadfully poor at other security.
http://www.linux.org.

And MS tech support isn't much help!!

Ah, well forget Linux then. How about http://www.apple.com?

only way to reset everything. I thought my computer was clean... after
all,
I had SP2, MS Anti-Spyware Beta, Norton Internet Security and Norton
System
Works. I even told MS tech support that my computer was CLEAN. IT WAS
NOT.
MS and Norton allowed my computer to become compromised.

Most of my clients who call me to say they got infected (and who are running
anti-virus software) are running Norton. Now that could just be because
Norton has such huge market share that it's statistically normal for them to
have the most infections. But I've been disappointed with their recent
product in general.

How did you get your computer compromised?

It took many hours, but I finally resolved the problem MYSELF,

Good. Can't you just feel the self-esteem coursing through your veins?

MS tech support had me jumping through hoops and
playing all manner of games that had me chasing my own tail (so to speak)
and
accomplished nothing.

Sure, but you told them your computer was clean when it wasn't. How are
they supposed to know how to fix your computer if you give them incorrect
information?

The non-microsoft forums gave me information that
actually HELPED and pointed me in the right direction for other good
information.

Those sound like wonderful forums. Clearly you're wasting your time over
here.

Why must we have a half a dozen protection programs??

1. Capitalism.
2. There are thousands of attack vectors.

I shudder to think of my vulnerability without Norton (and Norton isn't
that great as I found out
the hard way!).

I'd have told you if you'd asked.

MS practically has the PC world in its back pocket... but MS is NOT a good
leader, does NOT provide the excellence that it CLAIMS to provide either
in
the programs it offers OR tech support.
http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/

MS has gotten too big for its
britches and is arrogant as hell and needs to rejoin us down here where
the
human race resides (IOW... a little humility please and BETTER products
AND
lower prices...
http://www-306.ibm.com/software/os/warp/

Thanx for letting me sound off... I just get so p-o'd with arrogant
corporations who talk and say nothing and boast beyond their ability or
desire to DO or DO THE RIGHT THING.

I'm sorry you had a bad experience.


--
Aloha,

-Ben-
Ben M. Schorr, OneNote-MVP
Roland Schorr & Tower
http://www.rolandschorr.com
Microsoft OneNote FAQ: http://www.factplace.com/onenotefaq.htm

**I apologize but I am unable to respond to direct requests for assistance.
Please post questions and replies here in the newsgroup. Mahalo!

 

[Brian Tillman]

Hey, Microsoft! You are dreadfully behind in the email/internet
security war. Why can't Outlook work WITH email providers to do the
following: 1] Allow us to list entire domains in Blocked Senders
list. If there's a way to do it now... where are you hiding the
instructions??

They're not hidden. Open the Blocked Senders list (Actions>Junk E-Mail>Junk
E-mail Options>Blocked Senders), click Add, and read the examples. You can
block entire domains by leaving off the username portion. If you want to
block subdomains (i.e., @a.somedomain.com, @b.somedomain.com, etc.) a rule
can do that easily. Use the condition "with specific words in the message
header" and specify "somedomain" or "somedomain.com" as the specific words.

2] Why isn't, after identifying an email as junk and
listing that address/domain in Blocked Senders list, that
address/domain stopped at the server?? Do you really think I want to
go through my Junk Folder to find email from addresses/domains I
already blocked??

Well, then, have the Junk E-mail filter delete the messages instead of move
them to the Junk E-mail folder.

3] If we block an
address/domain in OUTLOOK... why can't that information be seamlessly
transferred to email providers so that 1] the junk is stopped at the
server and 2] and we don't need to set up redundant blocked lists
with email providers

How would you propose doing this, since there's NO MECHANISM in the SMTP/POP
mail protocols to implement such a thing? Are you suggesting the Microsoft
was a way to force all mail providers to implement new protocols that do not
exist today?

MS is also dreadfully poor at other security.

I can't argue with this.

I even told MS
tech support that my computer was CLEAN. IT WAS NOT. MS and Norton
allowed my computer to become compromised.

So, you want not only Microsoft but all AV/antispy vendors to read the minds
of the hackers and spammers and implement avoidance techniques before a
threat exists? No one has a crystal ball that good.

Why must we have a half a dozen protection programs??

Do you have a screwdriver, a hammer, and a saw in your toolbox at home?
Why? Why not just have one tool? Certainly you can built a house with just
a tape measure, can't you? Why have all those other tools? While you're at
it, why have so many eating utensils? Who needs fork, spoon, _and_ knife,
for cryin' out loud?

MS practically has the PC world in its back pocket... but MS is NOT a
good leader, does NOT provide the excellence that it CLAIMS to
provide either in the programs it offers OR tech support. MS has
gotten too big for its britches and is arrogant as hell and needs to
rejoin us down here where the human race resides

Some would agree with this as well, while others won't. It's opinion.

(IOW... a little
humility please and BETTER products AND lower prices... Lord knows
you have the money for it... you charge an arm and a leg for
applications and then charge us again for tech support. You should be
ashamed of yourselves. You're a leader, Microsoft??? So, lose the
arrogance, lose the greed, and .... LEAD!!!!!

Make sure you don't ask your boss for a raise this year. After all, you
make enough money as it is doing what you do. In fact, you should work
overtime and not expect any additional compensation.

The truth is that if you buy something form Microsoft, you DO get support
included for a period, just like any vendor will give you a limited
warrantee on an item you buy. That Ipod, for example, is probably warranted
for, oh, 90 days. The real problem is in all the OEM software that comes
bundled with a PC. The responsibility for that software actually lies with
the PC vendor, since you didn't buy it from Microsoft and the PC vendors
REALLy abrogate their responsibility when it comes to that software. I
think most people's real beef is with the bundler, not Microsoft.

Thanx for letting me sound off... I just get so p-o'd with arrogant
corporations who talk and say nothing and boast beyond their ability
or desire to DO or DO THE RIGHT THING.

A corporation is an amoral contruct whose sole purpose is parting you and
your money. If enough people stop buying the products that corporation
offers, it'll change if it wishes to survive.

 

[news.microsoft.com]

Well, then, have the Junk E-mail filter delete the messages instead of
move them to the Junk E-mail folder.

Very patient of you to answer all this newbie's questions about
irrationalities in his first computer experience and his first news/computer
exposure to Microsoft but there was a point he made which you didn't
address: Why can't one formulate a rule to actually delete junk mail, -
meaning why on earth doesn't the 'and permanently delete it' function work
at all? If you try to implement it, it can stop the whole rule from working.
Why is it there if it cant be made to work?

(Oh and one other thing, is there a newsgroup which comprises slightly more
knowledgeable MVPs about Outlook than here? I posted a SERIOUS question
about a major problem a few days ago and no one knew the answer: I looked at
the M.P.O. group and there are even fewer responses to questions than here)

 

[news.microsoft.com]

(Sorry about that, when I put M.P.O. I meant to say 'where there are MORE
answers than M.P.O.G. but still no one knew')





"Can someone please assist: I like to see the sender of a piece of email,
then the subject matter or visa versa, then the date then the size. All this
not necessarily with a preview

This is how my out look email has been set up for a decade or so by
default. It has been the same with Outlook 2002 for a year or longer.

Suddenly the view has defaulted to a completely useless view of the fact
that an item has been RECEIVED (which is kinda obvious as this is, for
example, my inbox), next the time a message came in with the date. There
is a PLUS on the very left which you have to click on to get the sender
which you have to click on again to get the subject matter.(and I cant sort
at all any more) As this is completely stupid, is this a problem for scanpst
or detect and repair or is there some way of changing back to see the fields
I want. The field chooser doesn't seem to do this.

There IS a subject column but it is empty, a date column but it is also
empty and all the info is shifted towards the left of the panel.

Does anyone know what has happened and How do I get back please?"

 

[Ben M. Schorr - MVP]

Very patient of you to answer all this newbie's questions about
irrationalities in his first computer experience and his first
news/computer exposure to Microsoft but there was a point he made which
you didn't address: Why can't one formulate a rule to actually delete junk
mail, - meaning why on earth doesn't the 'and permanently delete it'
function work at all? If you try to implement it, it can stop the whole
rule from working. Why is it there if it cant be made to work?

I've never had a problem with it working. I don't generally use it but for
those sites where I've turned it on it's always worked.

(Oh and one other thing, is there a newsgroup which comprises slightly
more knowledgeable MVPs about Outlook than here? I posted a SERIOUS
question about a major problem a few days ago and no one knew the answer:
I looked at the M.P.O. group and there are even fewer responses to
questions than here)

What was your question?


--
Aloha,

-Ben-
Ben M. Schorr, OneNote-MVP
Roland Schorr & Tower
http://www.rolandschorr.com
Microsoft OneNote FAQ: http://www.factplace.com/onenotefaq.htm

**I apologize but I am unable to respond to direct requests for assistance.
Please post questions and replies here in the newsgroup. Mahalo!

 

[Ben M. Schorr - MVP]

"Can someone please assist: I like to see the sender of a piece of email,
then the subject matter or visa versa, then the date then the size. All
this
not necessarily with a preview

This is how my out look email has been set up for a decade or so by
default. It has been the same with Outlook 2002 for a year or longer.

Are you still using Outlook 2002?

There IS a subject column but it is empty, a date column but it is also
empty and all the info is shifted towards the left of the panel.

Does anyone know what has happened and How do I get back please?"

If you go to View | Current View is it still set to your custom view? What
happens if you reset the view (View | Current View | Define Views...)

Aloha,

-Ben-
Ben M. Schorr, OneNote-MVP
Roland Schorr & Tower
http://www.rolandschorr.com
Microsoft Outlook FAQ: http://www.factplace.com/outlook.htm

**I apologize but I am unable to respond to direct requests for assistance.
Please post questions and replies here in the newsgroup. Mahalo!

 

[Brian Tillman]

which you didn't address: Why can't one formulate a rule to actually
delete junk mail, - meaning why on earth doesn't the 'and permanently
delete it' function work at all?

It certainly works for me.

(Oh and one other thing, is there a newsgroup which comprises
slightly more knowledgeable MVPs about Outlook than here? I posted a
SERIOUS question about a major problem a few days ago and no one knew
the answer: I looked at the M.P.O. group and there are even fewer
responses to questions than here)

If the level of service you receive from a newsgroup does not suit you, then
paying for an incident with Microsoft is your best bet.

 

[news.microsoft.com]

Hi guys

Thanks for the responses to my OT posting:

My point wasIt always set itself up like this by default whenever I installed Outlook

Are you still using Outlook 2002?

Yes, is outlook XP appreciably better? Is it worthwhile upgrading to Office
XP? I have it on another computer and must confess I hadnt noticed much
difference, if any? Is the filtering any better or does it use the same
rules which dont SEEM to have changed in years?

I have found (with great difficulty) that I can reset the view to my default
by going into ORGANISE in the button bar but what I was wondering was why it
suddenly keeps defaulting to this nonsensical view?

 

[news.microsoft.com]

Sorry I should have said ORGANISE-USING VIEWS-MESSAGE WITH AUTO-PREVIEW

(I posted because I couldn't make any headway at all by using
VIEW-CURRENT-DEFINE VIEWS but ORGANISE cured the problem, subject of course
to it coming back again if I cant identify what causes this problem in the
first place)

 

[Brian Tillman]

Yes, is outlook XP appreciably better?

The version of Outlook contained in Office XP is 2002. In other words,
Outlook XP = Outlook 2002.

 

[news.microsoft.com]

I suspected that