How much silicon paste?

[gf]

Gasket cement? May get a little sticky for removal. I just removed a hs
from a K6-450 that was glued on. It took lots of chiseling to get it off.

Copperkote is not a cement. It does not dry out and does not glue the
cpu to the heatsink.

 

[Black Shuck]

RichGK got up from the bar and shouted: :

Of course the manufacturers of high quality and expensive audio equipment
often use substandard components inside the box.

According to you?

Indeed, they all use the same copper in the PCB, and the wave soldering
machines use the same tin/copper solder, the components and in many
cases designs are identical to the cheaper brands.

Take NAD (a UK Hi-Fi supplier), for many years they sold rebaged Philips
kit for 4x the price, with no other changes than the casing. Even the
service diagrams were philips branded!! Yet audio buffs were raving
about the sound quality in HiFi mags.... Suckers....

 

[recursor]

Indeed, they all use the same copper in the PCB, and the wave soldering
machines use the same tin/copper solder, the components and in many cases
designs are identical to the cheaper brands.

Take NAD (a UK Hi-Fi supplier), for many years they sold rebaged Philips kit
for 4x the price, with no other changes than the casing. Even the service
diagrams were philips branded!! Yet audio buffs were raving about the sound
quality in HiFi mags.... Suckers....

Lol, I read a test in a mag a few years ago where expensive oxygen free cable
was compared sound-wise with Wooly's finest mains cable, all the pundits
preferred the Wooly's cable, it gave a much *tighter* and more accurate sound
apparently..

 

[kony]

Indeed, they all use the same copper in the PCB,

"They"?
There's copper thickness, bonding agent, trace width and
grounding planes, thru-hole plating and other major
differences which may change performance characteristics or
at least make servicing or tweaking more difficult.

and the wave soldering
machines use the same tin/copper solder, the components and in many
cases designs are identical to the cheaper brands.

.... but not all cases
Consider the simple polypropylene filter capacitor- too
often replaced with something cheaper.

Take NAD (a UK Hi-Fi supplier), for many years they sold rebaged Philips
kit for 4x the price, with no other changes than the casing. Even the
service diagrams were philips branded!! Yet audio buffs were raving
about the sound quality in HiFi mags.... Suckers....

True, BUT if it sounded as good to THEM as some other
alternative that cost as much or more, then they could've
done even worse. Seems like that last 2-10% in hi-fi always
costs an extra 2000%, and the last 1% far more.

 

[kony]

Copperkote is not a cement. It does not dry out and does not glue the
cpu to the heatsink.

Actually there is insufficient data to determine this.
Darn near anything will suffice on old CPUs with their lower
heat density, but no long-term use can have happened yet on
high thermal density cores such as Athlon XP, simply because
they haven't been in the market long enough. Being a
suspension of larger copper particles in petroleum base, it
is expected that it would tend to separate and pump out
after numerous thermal cycles. Perhaps there's a newer type
of Copper Kote with ester base, but it wouldn't need be
formulated for CPUs, merely the lowest cost per the spec'd
use.

On the other hand, P4 and Athlon 64 with their integral
heat-spreaders, will again allow use of lower grade thermal
interface, relatively speaking.

 

[GEO Me]

Take NAD (a UK Hi-Fi supplier), for many years they sold rebaged Philips
kit for 4x the price, with no other changes than the casing. Even the
service diagrams were philips branded!! Yet audio buffs were raving
about the sound quality in HiFi mags.... Suckers....

Quite a few years ago I borrowed a book about Hi-Fi components from
the library. The author recomended to burn-in the cables for a few
days, and also recommended the green cables over the red ones, as the
red ones did not transmit well high frequencies.

Geo
PS: Of course one had to check the directionality of the cables.

 

[Black Shuck]

kony got up from the bar and shouted: :
<snip>

Someone's fallen for vendor snakeoil and trying hard to convince
themselves that it was money well spent...

 

[Al Smith]

For what is worth, but in case someone finds it intersting. A while

back, in a different group, a fellow that seems to know quite a bit
recommended "a copper based anti-seize compound". He said:
"you can buy a copper based anti-seize compound at any auto parts
store; and for $5-6 it will do more cpu's than you will see in your
lifetime!"

But is it conductive? You don't want to use a conductive paste,
just in case you gob it over the circuits on the motherboard.

 

[Ed]

Gasket cement? May get a little sticky for removal. I just removed a hs
from a K6-450 that was glued on. It took lots of chiseling to get it off.

No not cement/glue, more like a high temp grease with ALU / CU in it.

I tried the Permatex? brand ALU stuff for thermal paste on a AMD Slot-A
and Socket-A, it wasn't very good, the cheap white paste did better.

I just popped a boxed K6-233, used a fine blade at corners and the HS
popped right off, hardened black epoxy looking stuff.

Ed

 

[Ed Light]

You don't have your amps hand-built with gold connectors ? Tut, tut.

Such tin ears.


--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at
(e-mail address removed)
Thanks, robots.

 

[Ed Light]

Lol, I read a test in a mag a few years ago where expensive oxygen free
cable was compared sound-wise with Wooly's finest mains cable, all the
pundits preferred the Wooly's cable, it gave a much *tighter* and more
accurate sound apparently..

That show's there is an audible difference.

So, did they test many different hi-fi cables or just that one brand?

--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at
(e-mail address removed)
Thanks, robots.

 

[recursor]

That show's there is an audible difference.

So, did they test many different hi-fi cables or just that one brand?

--

They tested several named brands of hi-fi (speaker) and several genereric 3
core (uk mains) and some corner electrical shop twin core (speaker) cable. The
general gist of the results was that expensive hi-fi cable is a waste of time,
but of course that kind of listener test is bound to be pretty subjective. Maybe
if they had only chose peeps with perfect pitch and that they would have got
different results...maybe!

 

[Randy Howard]

That show's there is an audible difference.

There has never been a documented case of anyone being able to tell with
a statistically significant percentage the difference in a double-blind
listening test between the most expensive speaker wire available and lamp
cord.

Quite the opposite is true of speakers of course, because the designs are
often radically different. But, as Dunlavy used to say, "wire is wire".

Many people can "hear" differences when they know there is one, but in
properly conducted tests, they rarely identify the correct cable more
than the expected 50% by random chance (assuming two samples).

None have done so convincingly.

So, did they test many different hi-fi cables or just that one brand?

It doesn't matter.

 

[Ed Light]

There has never been a documented case of anyone being able to tell with
a statistically significant percentage the difference in a double-blind
listening test between the most expensive speaker wire available and lamp
cord.

Then you've read every article in the audio press that was ever published?


--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at
(e-mail address removed)
Thanks, robots.

 

[Rob Morley]

Then you've read every article in the audio press that was ever published?

Don't you think purveyers of exotic speaker wire would be shouting
about it if they could prove their claims in a proper scientific way?

 

[kony]

No not cement/glue, more like a high temp grease with ALU / CU in it.

I tried the Permatex? brand ALU stuff for thermal paste on a AMD Slot-A
and Socket-A, it wasn't very good, the cheap white paste did better.

I just popped a boxed K6-233, used a fine blade at corners and the HS
popped right off, hardened black epoxy looking stuff.

Ed

INteresting... on the K6-2 it was more of a light grey
silicone rubber, same substance that conducted over the core
also held the spreader on all four corners of the ceramic
carrier.

 

[Ed Light]

Don't you think purveyers of exotic speaker wire would be shouting
about it if they could prove their claims in a proper scientific way?

Oh, you assumed it. OK.


--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at
(e-mail address removed)
Thanks, robots.

 

[Randy Howard]

Then you've read every article in the audio press that was ever published?

It would be huge news in the audiophile press if it happened. There have
been several well-publicized attempts, reported in the same forums, and
they have all been embarrassing failures.

I'll tell you what, you find a documented example of it happening, rather
than having me try to prove a negative.

 

[Randy Howard]

Don't you think purveyers of exotic speaker wire would be shouting
about it if they could prove their claims in a proper scientific way?

Of course they would. They've paid a lot of money over the years attempting
to set up a test and bring in the "best ears" in the business, none of
those attempts have been more successful than a coin flip.

 

[Rob Morley]

Oh, you assumed it. OK.

I didn't assume anything, I just asked you a question.