Homebuilt VS HP

[creAtive oBscura]

I'm trying to help a friend figure out the best system for him and
right now its hard to decide if we should go with a system that I can
build for him from newegg.com or this HP from amazon.com

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=dp_olp_2/103-3870160-1952668?_encoding=UTF8

The HP for $719 + S/H which is about $32 :
AMD Athlon 64 3800+ processor
250 GB hard drive
1 GB of RAM
LightScribe multi-format DVD/CD burner with dual-layer support
9-in-1 memory card reader
ATI Radeon XPress 200 video card with up to 128 MB of shared video RAM
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005
Mouse/Keyboard

The system from newegg.com $772.85 + S/H which is about $55 :
Microsoft Windows XP Home
AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+
Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 ST3250823AS 250GB 7200 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard
Drive
1 GB of RAM
LightScribe multi-format DVD/CD burner with dual-layer support
52-in-1 USB 2.0 Internal Card Reader
430W Power Supply
Geforce 6200TC supporting 256MB
Gigabyte GA-K8NF-9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Motherboard

I kinda prefer the XP Home vs the MCE just because we don't need it.
Any input on what you think would be the better idea would be
appreciated, thanks.

JSV

 

[WooHoo2You]

I like my homebuilt now more then my old HP due to the fact I cannot call
tech support. I have not felt the need to shoot myself due to the fact I
waited 20 minutes on hold just to be routed to India for "help." Then find
someone who knows less then my grandmother about Windows PC's. (she's 78 and
owns a Mac)

 

[Dave]

I'm trying to help a friend figure out the best system for him and
right now its hard to decide if we should go with a system that I can
build for him from newegg.com or this HP from amazon.com

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=dp_olp_2/103-3870160-1952668?_encoding=UTF8

The HP for $719 + S/H which is about $32 :
AMD Athlon 64 3800+ processor
250 GB hard drive
1 GB of RAM
LightScribe multi-format DVD/CD burner with dual-layer support
9-in-1 memory card reader
ATI Radeon XPress 200 video card with up to 128 MB of shared video RAM
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005
Mouse/Keyboard

The system from newegg.com $772.85 + S/H which is about $55 :
Microsoft Windows XP Home
AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+
Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 ST3250823AS 250GB 7200 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard
Drive
1 GB of RAM
LightScribe multi-format DVD/CD burner with dual-layer support
52-in-1 USB 2.0 Internal Card Reader
430W Power Supply
Geforce 6200TC supporting 256MB
Gigabyte GA-K8NF-9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Motherboard

I kinda prefer the XP Home vs the MCE just because we don't need it.
Any input on what you think would be the better idea would be
appreciated, thanks.

JSV

OK, the OS is a wash. (neither is better)
The Newegg system has a MUCH better processor (X2)
The Hard Drive, RAM, DVD burner and card readers are similar.
You'd have to spend more money on a better power supply for BOTH systems, so
that is a wash.
The Newegg system has an infinitely better video card.
The HP unit WILL NOT run Vista (mainly because of the video card)

The reason you'd have to REPLACE the power supply in the HP unit is that the
included power supply does not support PCI Express video cards. I'll bet
you think I made that up, don't you? Actually, I sold a power supply to a
friend of mine when I discovered that his brand new HP Media Center PC had a
PCI Express video adapter, but no PCI Express power supply. So when he
wanted to upgrade his video card (like YOU WILL, also), he had to -replace-
his power supply to do it. There are adapters to run PCI Express video
cards off of molex connectors, but the original power supply in the HP
computer was not powerful enough anyway, even if it had the right connectors
(which it didn't). So that's why I'm telling you (and I'm not guessing
here) that you will need to replace the power supply in the HP computer.
Also, any old generic 430W power supply will choke on the newegg system that
you spec'd out. You will want 450W minimum for either system, and that
better be a GOOD name brand like fortron/sparkle, enermax or seasonic.
Figure $75-$80 bucks minimum for the power supply, and that will be
REQUIRED, no matter which system you choose.

Price of either unit will be about $800 before shipping (both systems almost
exactly $800). I say that as ($719 plus decent power supply) or ($772 plus
money to upgrade power supply not purchased yet), either option will come
out to about $800. For the money though, the newegg system will be a MUCH
BETTER DEAL. This one isn't even close. The newegg system has a processor
that will be about 30% faster and a video card that will be about 300%
faster. If you buy the HP unit, you're a fool. -Dave

 

[Chris Hill]

I'm trying to help a friend figure out the best system for him and
right now its hard to decide if we should go with a system that I can
build for him from newegg.com or this HP from amazon.com

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=dp_olp_2/103-3870160-1952668?_encoding=UTF8

The HP for $719 + S/H which is about $32 :
AMD Athlon 64 3800+ processor
250 GB hard drive
1 GB of RAM
LightScribe multi-format DVD/CD burner with dual-layer support
9-in-1 memory card reader
ATI Radeon XPress 200 video card with up to 128 MB of shared video RAM
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005
Mouse/Keyboard

The system from newegg.com $772.85 + S/H which is about $55 :
Microsoft Windows XP Home
AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+
Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 ST3250823AS 250GB 7200 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard
Drive
1 GB of RAM
LightScribe multi-format DVD/CD burner with dual-layer support
52-in-1 USB 2.0 Internal Card Reader
430W Power Supply
Geforce 6200TC supporting 256MB
Gigabyte GA-K8NF-9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Motherboard

I kinda prefer the XP Home vs the MCE just because we don't need it.
Any input on what you think would be the better idea would be
appreciated, thanks.

If you build it and it doesn't work, how much will it cost in parts
changing to make it work? If you have a similar system you can swap
parts from, this isn't an issue, but a one-off can cost extensively in
time and money if it doesn't go right. Unless the person is a gamer
or has unusual requirements, it is hard to beat something that comes
in a box with a warranty. Have the guy look at Sam's or costco as
well, both offer a six month return policy no questions asked. You
can't get that on a home-built system.

 

[adsci]

its easy!

(Homebuilt>(!Homebuild))==TRUE, always (as long as you manage it to
build a functioning system)!

reason:
when you're homebuilding you wont pay the money for the guy who puts
your parts together, you really know what is inside your rig, you can
get all those you really want, you can build exactly that computer you
want. additionally you can find the lowest prices on every component and
save money in that way.

my opinion

 

[adsci]

If you build it and it doesn't work, how much will it cost in parts
changing to make it work? If you have a similar system you can swap
parts from, this isn't an issue, but a one-off can cost extensively in
time and money if it doesn't go right. Unless the person is a gamer
or has unusual requirements, it is hard to beat something that comes
in a box with a warranty. Have the guy look at Sam's or costco as
well, both offer a six month return policy no questions asked. You
can't get that on a home-built system.

good point, but my opinion on this is like:

i dont want to buy a computer to find out that something is wrong and
need to send the WHOLE computer back with all my personal data on the HD
to wait for a new one with this fault fixed but maybe with a new problem
(if at all).

and buying a computer just to send it back to get my money back doesnt
make sense.
if i want a new computer and i dont want to wait for warranty service
and dont want to send big boxes - i buy parts and swap the parts that
are faulty.

it my opinion a home build is the faster way to a functioning computer
if something goes wrong (as long as the builder has the experience to
build a computer).

 

[Chris Hill]

good point, but my opinion on this is like:

i dont want to buy a computer to find out that something is wrong and
need to send the WHOLE computer back with all my personal data on the HD
to wait for a new one with this fault fixed but maybe with a new problem
(if at all).

and buying a computer just to send it back to get my money back doesnt
make sense.
if i want a new computer and i dont want to wait for warranty service
and dont want to send big boxes - i buy parts and swap the parts that
are faulty.

Not really. If I buy a box locally from Sam's or costco and it quits,
I'll plug the drive into another machine, erase it and haul it back.
I'll have something new to use in the same day. If my home-built
machine breaks and I don't have parts laying around, I'll order
something and wait a week because I surely won't pay for overnight
shipping. Before Sam's and Costco offered six months money back, I'd
agree. Now-a-days, though, considering building it myself only saves
me about $70, there is no point in it unless you want something you
just can't buy.

 

[adsci]

Not really. If I buy a box locally from Sam's or costco and it quits,
I'll plug the drive into another machine, erase it and haul it back.
I'll have something new to use in the same day. If my home-built
machine breaks and I don't have parts laying around, I'll order
something and wait a week because I surely won't pay for overnight
shipping. Before Sam's and Costco offered six months money back, I'd
agree. Now-a-days, though, considering building it myself only saves
me about $70, there is no point in it unless you want something you
just can't buy.

mmh...
maybe things depends on the dealer you buy from and whether its local

 

[Chris Hill]

mmh...
maybe things depends on the dealer you buy from and whether its local

Definitely. Many stores around here won't do a thing for you after a
couple of weeks, but Sam's and Costco are two big warehouse clubs
which have really good return policies. Basically they'll do whatever
it takes to make you happy in the first six months. Around here it is
usually cheaper to buy actual parts mail order so anything I would
build I'd have to order.

 

[johns]

X-No-Archive:yes

The single core 3800 is a bit faster than a dual core 3800.
The single core is better for games. Dual is better for
running several apps at once.

The GA-K8NF-9 mobo has 3 pci slots right beside the
pci-e slot. A little tight if you add in a video card with a
fan. It is a good mobo, but if you have extra pci cards
like modem, WinTV, you will have to leave that pci slot
next to the video card empty. It will work fine if the modem
is low profile .. and now most are. That mobo is really
waiting for pci-e x1 development. It has plenty of room
for those cards .. maybe the Physics card ???
Buy the mobo bundle from Mwave.com and have it
assembled and tested. It will come in working, and
you have good tech support.

Your DVD burner, is noisy and annoying as hell. The
only quiet DVDs are the Sonys.

Both of your video cards are a joke. The nVidia 7900GTO
is going for around $300 and it has dual DVI and speed
to burn. Also, it is much lower power than other cards in
its class, so the TruePower 480 watt in an Antec SLK
1650B case is good enough, and runs cool. Many times
ComUSA will sell you the Antec case with no power
supply for very little, and you can get the TruePower
480 from lots of places for about $80.

2 gigs ram is mandatory. 1 gig is not sufficient for modern
games.

XP Pro is very adaptable.

The only hard drives that are holding up over the long haul
seem to be the Hitachi SATA drives. They are quick and
very quiet. Maxtors will develop bad spots just as they
run out of their 1 week warranty. Seagates are noisy.
Western Digitals have a bad reputation for many years.
Maybe they've improved ?? I will not touch one.

What kind of monitor ? I'm price watching the wide LCDs
right now. There are plenty of Wide but Dinky monitors, but
I want a large viewing area, so I'm watching the 22 to 23
inchers which are slowly coming down in price. The
Viewsonic 19 inchers and Dell UltraSharps are good, and
they are not a "wide monitor" con job. You need an 8msec
refresh .. 4 is better.

Note: if you put together a top box, like I'm suggesting, building
it is worth the extra money it costs. Otherwise, you are better
off just buying a commercial grade PC. HP and Dell both build
good machines these days. They will always cut you some
where you are not aware of. It is like trying to housebreak
a puppy. The scams I see are:
Weak psupply.
Crappy DVD players ... generally 2 of them you don't need.
Plastic breakable cases that are hard to work in.
Weird OS installs with really out of date drivers, and a ton
of useless poop that is a trial version and costs extra. And
I really wish they'd stop formatting the entire drive as a
single partition. You need a D-partition for backup.
Video cards that are just criminally bad, and when you get
them to sub in a better video card, they will have a high-
end version of the card which is not high-end ... like the
Dell nVidia 6800s ( that don't need a power connector ).

johns

 

[creAtive oBscura]

First of all johns, this is not going to be a gaming computer AT ALL,
just for clarification. The only reason I'd consider upgrading the
graphics is for windows Vista if it requires it, but for most of the
things that MY FRIEND who I'd be building it for will most likely not
utilize DX10. This computer will more be used for normal everyday use,
music storage, some minor sound recording. The graphics card I had
chosen for the system was just the cheapest PCI-e card at newegg, and I
trust MSI, so there is no problem there. I take point from your comment
of the harddrives. we will not be going for high end monitors. The
power supply is a Thermaltake, and I have had no problems with
Thermaltake yet. I would prefer the X2 over the single core because of
the fact that this will be used for recording/burning dvds/cds. Also,
if we were to buy a shelf computer, I would most likely end up
reformatting the harddrive, partly because I am aware of all of the
useless crap on there. We are staying $800 dollars, and so we are
getting 1stick of 1gb of memory, and there will be another thrown in
later on, along with an X-Fi platinum. I was going to use a Lite-On
drive, which is the same price, just farther down the list, and I saw
something somewhere that Lite-On was actually making Sony's drives
once? Not sure, but I have always used Lite-Ons, and will most likely
continue.

 

[creAtive oBscura]

It will hopefully won't cost much at all. The only problem I've had
with ordering online each part, is that UPS had supposedly lost one of
my packages, Newegg right away offered me a full refund, or the
replacements plus free shipping. But it ended up that UPS delivered
the original package by surprise on time with everything else. They
are also very good about taking RMA'd items and things that are DOA,
but the warranties that boxed computers if they come with would be
nice, I agree. But so far, from all of the systems that I've built for
my friends so far, I've had not one call of something gone wrong, and
for one system, its been nearly a year, the other is nearing 4 months,
and the last is nearly a month now. So I've been pretty satisfied with
newegg's performance with the parts they've provided, and the services.
But all of those systems were over $1200, and there is a lot more
saving when you get past $1000 when home-building. So this is a little
more difficult. I'm thinking getting the HP, and upgrading, such as
new PSU, sound card, headphones, and possibly the case itself.
Although all this might void a warranty in anyways.