Genuine Advantage - dodgy copy of Windows from Dealer

[Guest]

Hi there,
Late 2004 we purchased a PC from a local specialist who built if for us.
Windows XP Professional was pre-installed. Alarm bells should have rung
straight away when we never received a Windows disc with the system, as he
informed us you didn't need one and any problems to give him a call. Last
year I looked into updating all the security and virus protection on the PC
and found out the automatic updates had been turned off. Neither myself or
any of my family would have changed the status of this. About of year's
worth of updates then started to install. When it got round to updating
media player, the genuine advantage warning came up that we may not have a
genuine copy of Windows XP and then subsequently I couldn't open media
player. We contacted the guy who had built it for us and he said he'd had
many problems as the dealer he'd bought all the licences from originally in
High Wycombe, had now been caught reselling the same licence key several
times which meant most of the copies weren't genuine. He then said there was
nothing he could do as he could not afford to buy all new licences for the
customers he had installed Windows for so it would be up to the customers to
effectively pay again for something they'd already paid him for. The thing
that makes me think this is dodgy is that he came to have a look at the PC
about a year earlier, and I think he must have switched the automatic updates
off because he knew that the Windows on there was fake but wasn't going to
tell any of his customers - he'd just wait for them to somehow find out like
I did. After that long story, my question is, should all new PCs with
Windows pre-installed come with a windows disc, or is it possible for them
just to be pre-loaded by whoever builds it and a new licence key assigned? I
should also point out, we could never find the little sticker on the machine
that has the PID on it. That's what makes me think the man who built it has
been less than honest and not some third party in High Wycombe.

I have recently bought a new laptop (which has a genuine disc supplied!).
Can I install this copy of Windows XP Home onto my PC or will this flag up as
being non-genuine as well? Thing is we don't really want to pay £95 to make
something we've already paid for once a genuine copy.

 

[SG]

First thing I'd do is contact Microsoft and tell them your story. They
should advise you on the best way to take care of this problem.

All the best,
SG

 

[RalfG]

First off, you cannot install the Windows you got with a different PC,
that's illegal.

Next, if the version of Windows he installed were legitimate you should have
been provided with at least an MS authenticity sticker with a valid product
key on it. Your version of Windows would identify itself as OEM in System
Information .. eg- ID number xxxxx-OEM-xxxxxx-xxxxx. Also he should have
provided some way to reinstall the OS, whether recovery discs/partition or
an OEM XP Pro disc set.

I'd think you would have legal recourse over this if he actually billed you
for XP. If he supplied any other software without installation discs I'd be
inclined to think those are pirated too. Whatever the case, as the one
continuing to use it (them) you are also liable.

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

Hi there,
Late 2004 we purchased a PC from a local specialist who built if for us.
Windows XP Professional was pre-installed. Alarm bells should have rung
straight away when we never received a Windows disc with the system, as he
informed us you didn't need one and any problems to give him a call. Last
year I looked into updating all the security and virus protection on the PC
and found out the automatic updates had been turned off. Neither myself or
any of my family would have changed the status of this. About of year's
worth of updates then started to install. When it got round to updating
media player, the genuine advantage warning came up that we may not have a
genuine copy of Windows XP and then subsequently I couldn't open media
player. We contacted the guy who had built it for us and he said he'd had
many problems as the dealer he'd bought all the licences from originally in
High Wycombe, had now been caught reselling the same licence key several
times which meant most of the copies weren't genuine. He then said there was
nothing he could do as he could not afford to buy all new licences for the
customers he had installed Windows for so it would be up to the customers to
effectively pay again for something they'd already paid him for.

What he can afford to do is irrelevant. You paid for something you
didn't get. If he doesn't supply it, take him to small claims court.

The thing
that makes me think this is dodgy is that he came to have a look at the PC
about a year earlier, and I think he must have switched the automatic updates
off because he knew that the Windows on there was fake but wasn't going to
tell any of his customers - he'd just wait for them to somehow find out like
I did. After that long story, my question is, should all new PCs with
Windows pre-installed come with a windows disc,

OEM vendors are required by their agreement with Microsoft to give you
a means of reinstalling, should it be necessary. They can do this in
one of three ways:

1. An OEM copy of Windows
2. A restore CD
3. A hidden partition on your drive, with restore information.

He apparently gave you none of these.

Personally, I find both 2 and 3 unacceptable (especially 3; a hard
drive crash can leave you with nothing), and would never choose to buy
a computer that came with an operating system unless I got a complete
generic installation CD for that operating system.

or is it possible for them
just to be pre-loaded by whoever builds it and a new licence key assigned? I
should also point out, we could never find the little sticker on the machine
that has the PID on it. That's what makes me think the man who built it has
been less than honest and not some third party in High Wycombe.

I have recently bought a new laptop (which has a genuine disc supplied!).
Can I install this copy of Windows XP Home onto my PC or will this flag up as
being non-genuine as well?

No. It's not a question of being non-genuine; it's a matter of having
only a single license to use it. You can't put it (its key, really) on
two different systems.

Thing is we don't really want to pay £95 to make
something we've already paid for once a genuine copy.

You shouldn't have to. Sue him. My guess is that as soon as he
realizes you mean business, he'll supply you with a genuine copy.

 

[SG]

Small claims court? well Ken I really don't think it's worth while for that.
The reason I suggested MS was let them tell her what to do. Someone like
this needs to be looked into and MS should surely do this. What would be
ideal is to find ALL of his customers and file a class action suite against
him and/or his provider. No telling how many machines he has put XP on and
I'm sure MS would love to know.

All the best,
SG

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

Small claims court? well Ken I really don't think it's worth while for that.

I do. As I said, as soon as the seller realizes that the purchaser
won't tolerate being cheater, he will likely give in and supply a
legal version. He certainly doesn't want to go to court.

The reason I suggested MS was let them tell her what to do. Someone like
this needs to be looked into and MS should surely do this. What would be
ideal is to find ALL of his customers and file a class action suite against
him and/or his provider. No telling how many machines he has put XP on and
I'm sure MS would love to know.

All the best,
SG

 

[Lem]

I do. As I said, as soon as the seller realizes that the purchaser
won't tolerate being cheater, he will likely give in and supply a
legal version. He certainly doesn't want to go to court.

I know next to nothing about the UK legal system, but it's my
understanding that there is a "special procedure" in its county courts
for dealing with the types of issues most people refer to as "small
claims" (under £5,000 -- which is rather large compared to most US small
claims rules). The UK rules appear to strongly encourage what's
commonly called ADR (alternate dispute resolution).

This site is the starting point for bringing a "small claims" action in
the UK -- but it also includes links to sites that may be able to
provide advice on how to achieve the result you want short of actually
going to court:
http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/infoabout/claims/index.htm



--
Lem -- MS-MVP - Networking

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm

 

[Edward W. Thompson]

I do. As I said, as soon as the seller realizes that the purchaser
won't tolerate being cheater, he will likely give in and supply a
legal version. He certainly doesn't want to go to court.




I know next to nothing about the UK legal system, but it's my
understanding that there is a "special procedure" in its county courts for
dealing with the types of issues most people refer to as "small claims"
(under £5,000 -- which is rather large compared to most US small claims
rules). The UK rules appear to strongly encourage what's commonly called
ADR (alternate dispute resolution).

This site is the starting point for bringing a "small claims" action in
the UK -- but it also includes links to sites that may be able to provide
advice on how to achieve the result you want short of actually going to
court: http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/infoabout/claims/index.htm



--
Lem -- MS-MVP - Networking

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm

MS charges £95.00 to provide a 'valid' registration for a pirate copy of
WINXP Pro. Notwithstanding an award of costs, the Small Claims Court
process will cost more than that especially if you take time into
consideration.

 

[M.I.5¾]

Small claims court? well Ken I really don't think it's worth while for
that. The reason I suggested MS was let them tell her what to do. Someone
like this needs to be looked into and MS should surely do this. What would
be ideal is to find ALL of his customers and file a class action suite
against him and/or his provider. No telling how many machines he has put
XP on and I'm sure MS would love to know.

ITYWF that the OP is in the UK where the legal system does not support the
concept of a 'class action law suite'

All the best,
SG

 

[Phat Sam]

First thing I'd do is contact Microsoft and tell them your story. They
should advise you on the best way to take care of this problem.

I know the feeling well.... I bought an OEM copy from some
fly-by-night that I later discovered he seems to Spam people with
several different domain names that all end up pointing to his same
store.... Problem is I had a crash after I ordered the cd-rom and lost
the original e-mail, I tried to contact him (and once actually had
contact with him again, when he tried to say the key was a authentic
key, but I'm not supposed to connect to the web to get support.... Had
I seen that screen that I just saw last night, I'd reported him
then... Unfortiantly, now I don't have the CD, invoice, e-mail, etc...
So I had to bight the big one and pay $145.00