cause of constant CRC errors?

[Christo]

every large file i download gets a CRC error

I have downloaded a demo of FM2005 Gold

from sigames

and am awaiting arrival of the game from amazon, i thought i would try the
demo

i have downloaded the 161 mb files twice and during the extraction of
data1.cab file there is a CRC error

I also get CRC errors on other large installation, mainly games, Such games
have been The Sims2, after registering the Sims 2 i found out on EA support
that changing the hard drive/CD-ROM drive to PIO mode may solve the problem

It worked for the sims and for Rise Of Nations games

however battlefield 1942 and This Football Manager 2005 Demo dont appear to
want to work?

why do i get constant amounts of CRC when installing large files from my
hard drive

(notE: sims 2 was from a CD-ROM as was BF1942) rise of nations and this
FM2005 demo were from my hard drive, am i going to have troubles with the
full game installation CD?

it works fine with other applications such as Adobe AcroBat from my hdd and
Norton AntiVirus and AVG antivirus and Avast Anti Virus, all large programs
that installed fine

it seems to be programs utlizing .cab files

cany anyone give me any hints? is it my hard drive, it is second hand but it
should work...?

Also when i tried to install the game i got a message asking for the windows
XP SP2 CD to replace some files that got damaged

I did insert the original CD and all was well... could this be related to
the CRC problem?

Thanks (in advance)

Chris

 

[Christo]

please note:

I am getting CRC in PIO mode off my hard drive where the self extracting EXE
file is

i thought PIO mode never used cyclic redundancy checks (CRC)

my IDE cables are rounded and have a rubber jacket around them, reason for
this suggestion is it could be crosstalk on the IDE cables? however wouldnt
the rubber coating protect them?

They are open at the ends they plug into the board and into the optical
drives and hard drive.

the hard drive is really really close the optical drives as i have it housed
in a harddrive coller that fits into a 5.25 bay

so could it be because the cables are too close together?

i hope not i have very little room in my puter case despite it being
masssssiiivvveee

the PSU has loads of free 4 pin connectors taking up all the space

the 12 pin power cable has a fat fat rounded wire and it takes up alot of
space

I juat want this thing to stop the CRC errors only occur on cab files and in
games, why is it doing this someone please help i have no idea, i have a few
thoughts on what it may be but i am no expert.

 

[Jerry G.]

I would suggest to run a memory diagnostics to test the RAM to start with.
Then run the diagnostics for your hard drive(s). If these pass, then there
may be an operating system problem, or something running in the background
that is causing the fault. All aspects must be first checked out before
coming to any conclusions.

--

Jerry G.
======


every large file i download gets a CRC error

I have downloaded a demo of FM2005 Gold

from sigames

and am awaiting arrival of the game from amazon, i thought i would try the
demo

i have downloaded the 161 mb files twice and during the extraction of
data1.cab file there is a CRC error

I also get CRC errors on other large installation, mainly games, Such games
have been The Sims2, after registering the Sims 2 i found out on EA support
that changing the hard drive/CD-ROM drive to PIO mode may solve the problem

It worked for the sims and for Rise Of Nations games

however battlefield 1942 and This Football Manager 2005 Demo dont appear to
want to work?

why do i get constant amounts of CRC when installing large files from my
hard drive

(notE: sims 2 was from a CD-ROM as was BF1942) rise of nations and this
FM2005 demo were from my hard drive, am i going to have troubles with the
full game installation CD?

it works fine with other applications such as Adobe AcroBat from my hdd and
Norton AntiVirus and AVG antivirus and Avast Anti Virus, all large programs
that installed fine

it seems to be programs utlizing .cab files

cany anyone give me any hints? is it my hard drive, it is second hand but it
should work...?

Also when i tried to install the game i got a message asking for the windows
XP SP2 CD to replace some files that got damaged

I did insert the original CD and all was well... could this be related to
the CRC problem?

Thanks (in advance)

Chris

 

[kony]

every large file i download gets a CRC error

I have downloaded a demo of FM2005 Gold

from sigames

and am awaiting arrival of the game from amazon, i thought i would try the
demo

i have downloaded the 161 mb files twice and during the extraction of
data1.cab file there is a CRC error

I also get CRC errors on other large installation, mainly games, Such games
have been The Sims2, after registering the Sims 2 i found out on EA support
that changing the hard drive/CD-ROM drive to PIO mode may solve the problem

It worked for the sims and for Rise Of Nations games

however battlefield 1942 and This Football Manager 2005 Demo dont appear to
want to work?

why do i get constant amounts of CRC when installing large files from my
hard drive

(notE: sims 2 was from a CD-ROM as was BF1942) rise of nations and this
FM2005 demo were from my hard drive, am i going to have troubles with the
full game installation CD?

it works fine with other applications such as Adobe AcroBat from my hdd and
Norton AntiVirus and AVG antivirus and Avast Anti Virus, all large programs
that installed fine

it seems to be programs utlizing .cab files

cany anyone give me any hints? is it my hard drive, it is second hand but it
should work...?

Also when i tried to install the game i got a message asking for the windows
XP SP2 CD to replace some files that got damaged

I did insert the original CD and all was well... could this be related to
the CRC problem?

Thanks (in advance)

Chris

It's not likely to be the hard drive, check the CPU temps,
voltage levels and run http://www.memtest86.com for several
hours.

You might also try underclocking the system and retrying the
activities causing the CRC errors. With memory, FSB, CPU,
and power consumption lower but still same HDD, that would
tend to rule out the HDD.

 

[_Vanguard_]

every large file i download gets a CRC error

I have downloaded a demo of FM2005 Gold

from sigames

and am awaiting arrival of the game from amazon, i thought i would try
the demo

i have downloaded the 161 mb files twice and during the extraction of
data1.cab file there is a CRC error

I also get CRC errors on other large installation, mainly games, Such
games have been The Sims2, after registering the Sims 2 i found out on
EA support that changing the hard drive/CD-ROM drive to PIO mode may
solve the problem

It worked for the sims and for Rise Of Nations games

however battlefield 1942 and This Football Manager 2005 Demo dont
appear to want to work?

why do i get constant amounts of CRC when installing large files from
my hard drive

(notE: sims 2 was from a CD-ROM as was BF1942) rise of nations and
this FM2005 demo were from my hard drive, am i going to have troubles
with the full game installation CD?

it works fine with other applications such as Adobe AcroBat from my
hdd and Norton AntiVirus and AVG antivirus and Avast Anti Virus, all
large programs that installed fine

it seems to be programs utlizing .cab files

cany anyone give me any hints? is it my hard drive, it is second hand
but it should work...?

Also when i tried to install the game i got a message asking for the
windows XP SP2 CD to replace some files that got damaged

I did insert the original CD and all was well... could this be related
to the CRC problem?

Does it still happen when you use msconfig.exe to disable startup
programs, reboot, and then retry whatever action generates the CRC
error?

Any errors when you run "chkdsk /r c:" (or whatever are the iffy
drives)?

 

[Christo]

Does it still happen when you use msconfig.exe to disable startup
programs, reboot, and then retry whatever action generates the CRC error?

Any errors when you run "chkdsk /r c:" (or whatever are the iffy drives)?

--
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something weird happens when i try a chkdsk in windows cmd

i run it

C:\>chkdsk

it does its thing and says there are problems, blah blah cannot correct
problems in read only mode would you like to run chkdsk at next startup so i
press Y

it runs does its thing on startup and corrects supposed errors

i then try and do it again in the cmd prompt

C:\>chkdsk

again errors found... straight after rebooting from a chkdsk as you say
/chkdsk i imagine is the extension in msconfig, so i am not sure whats going
on?

I did manage to get the demo of fm05 installed, its a bit random though and
not very efficeint

 

[Eric]

first - scan your system and make sure you dont have a virus or some such
thing playing games with you.
What version of windows are you running?
What else is running?
Swap your dimms around ie: exchange DIMM-0 with DIMM-1 if possible
and re-run. If you see new symptoms it could be a bad dimm.
I once had a system that would fail on a HDD format every time. It turned
out to be a bad dimm but for awhile I truly thought my HDD was bad.
Eric

 

[_Vanguard_]

i run it

C:\>chkdsk

Look back at my post. I did NOT say to run just "chkdsk". Notice what
I said and what switches were specified. You can also run "chkdsk /?"
to get help on its syntax and switches. I said to include the /r
switch. I don't think it matters the order of switches and the drive
parameter but, in case order is significant, then try "chkdsk c: /r".
When you reboot, you should see it testing the surface integrity. That
will take awhile to complete depending on how big is your drive.

 

[Noozer]

Look back at my post. I did NOT say to run just "chkdsk". Notice what
I said and what switches were specified. You can also run "chkdsk /?"
to get help on its syntax and switches. I said to include the /r
switch. I don't think it matters the order of switches and the drive
parameter but, in case order is significant, then try "chkdsk c: /r".
When you reboot, you should see it testing the surface integrity. That
will take awhile to complete depending on how big is your drive.

BTW, if you are having CRC errors, the *LAST* thing you want to do is a
defrag, scandisk for chkdsk. Moving/shuffing/repairing files is a *BAD*
thing if your HDD controller is flakey, cable is bad or memory is having
errors.

 

[_Vanguard_]

BTW, if you are having CRC errors, the *LAST* thing you want to do is
a
defrag, scandisk for chkdsk. Moving/shuffing/repairing files is a
*BAD*
thing if your HDD controller is flakey, cable is bad or memory is
having
errors.

What if the errors are caused by "soft spots" on the surface where
retentivity has waned over time. "chkdsk /r" will test the surface and
move the data from flaky spots, if it can successfully read the data.
If the controller is bad, nothing you can do will guarantee you don't
corrupt the data. Even trying to save a disk image will be iffy since
you are still using the same flaky controller to read the data (and
write it onto other media if using that same controller, like a hard
disk and CD/DVD-R sharing the same controller). You are screwed if you
don't have drive images created prior to when the controller went flaky
or have logical file backups that sucessfully read the files.

I don't know if the OP is using WinZip and, if so, configured it to
handle .cab files. You can configure which filetypes are associated
with WinZip in its options, and .cab is one of those. I don't know
about version 9 (latest) but back in version 7 and 8 it was possible to
have WinZip create archive files but it would record the wrong CRC
value. Then when you extract the files from the archive file, WinZip
again recalculates the CRC for the extracted file against the recorded
CRC. It they didn't match, it reported a CRC error. However, the file
extracted okay and the problem was WinZip screwing up the CRC
calculation. It has been over 3 years (version 8 was out a LONG time)
but I recall it had to do with either JPEG or movie files (which are
already compressed) and exceeding a maximum file count or nearing it.
There is an option in WinZip to extract the file despite it claiming
there is a CRC error. When the problem arose, I sent a trouble report
to WinZip how actually confirmed the problem, so I've kept my PKzip
around because it never did exhibit the CRC problem. At this point, the
only things I remember about the WinZip CRC problem what that I was
saving several huge files into the archive file or I added lots of files
which pushed the file count somewhere way over 32K. Maybe I was trying
to archive a directory with all its files, and one of mine has 54K files
under it. I think the old version didn't support files over 4GB and
maxed out at 65K files per archive, but those should be upped in the
latest version. So far we have been assuming the CRC error has been
caused by hardware but it is possible the real cause is software and
maybe WinZip.

The OP also said that a game somehow instigated a request to do a repair
from the Windows install CD. If the OP had already installed Service
Pack 2 for Windows XP but used a Window XP Service Pack 1 installation
CD to do the repair then he has mismatched files (i.e., he tried to use
an SP-1 CD to repair an SP-2 setup). He said he used the "original"
install CD which might only be SP-1. He would need to create a bootable
install CD that slipstreamed SP-2 into Windows XP to use for repairing
his SP-2 system.

The OP also mentioned that he has 3 anti-virus products installed:
Norton Antivirus, AVG, and Avast. Well, that might be okay if he has
only ONE on-access scanner from one of them running. He can use them
all to use their on-demand scanner (i.e., manual scan) but only one
on-access scanner should be running. These operate as a kernel-level
file system driver that will interrogate the data stream on file writes
so having more than one of them performing a similar function but
operating differently might end up with conflicts. Even using
msconfig.exe to disable startup programs won't eliminate the driver
loads for all the anti-virus software. Three chefs in your one kitchen
trying to bake a cake using different procedures will probably get in
each other's way. More is not always better. Pick one anti-virus
product to use its on-access scanner (so you load only one file system
filter driver) and use the on-demand scanners when you want added
detection.

 

[Christo]

What if the errors are caused by "soft spots" on the surface where
retentivity has waned over time. "chkdsk /r" will test the surface and
move the data from flaky spots, if it can successfully read the data. If
the controller is bad, nothing you can do will guarantee you don't corrupt
the data. Even trying to save a disk image will be iffy since you are
still using the same flaky controller to read the data (and write it onto
other media if using that same controller, like a hard disk and CD/DVD-R
sharing the same controller). You are screwed if you don't have drive
images created prior to when the controller went flaky or have logical
file backups that sucessfully read the files.

I don't know if the OP is using WinZip and, if so, configured it to handle
.cab files. You can configure which filetypes are associated with WinZip
in its options, and .cab is one of those. I don't know about version 9
(latest) but back in version 7 and 8 it was possible to have WinZip create
archive files but it would record the wrong CRC value. Then when you
extract the files from the archive file, WinZip again recalculates the CRC
for the extracted file against the recorded CRC. It they didn't match, it
reported a CRC error. However, the file extracted okay and the problem
was WinZip screwing up the CRC calculation. It has been over 3 years
(version 8 was out a LONG time) but I recall it had to do with either JPEG
or movie files (which are already compressed) and exceeding a maximum file
count or nearing it. There is an option in WinZip to extract the file
despite it claiming there is a CRC error. When the problem arose, I sent
a trouble report to WinZip how actually confirmed the problem, so I've
kept my PKzip around because it never did exhibit the CRC problem. At
this point, the only things I remember about the WinZip CRC problem what
that I was saving several huge files into the archive file or I added lots
of files which pushed the file count somewhere way over 32K. Maybe I was
trying to archive a directory with all its files, and one of mine has 54K
files under it. I think the old version didn't support files over 4GB and
maxed out at 65K files per archive, but those should be upped in the
latest version. So far we have been assuming the CRC error has been
caused by hardware but it is possible the real cause is software and maybe
WinZip.

I have used winzip in the past, but i am now only using WinRAR to handle
zip/iso/cab

I have had the CRC problem with winZip 8

The OP also said that a game somehow instigated a request to do a repair
from the Windows install CD. If the OP had already installed Service Pack
2 for Windows XP but used a Window XP Service Pack 1 installation CD to do
the repair then he has mismatched files (i.e., he tried to use an SP-1 CD
to repair an SP-2 setup). He said he used the "original" install CD which
might only be SP-1. He would need to create a bootable install CD that
slipstreamed SP-2 into Windows XP to use for repairing his SP-2 system.

I have windows XP with SP2 Slipstreamed

The OP also mentioned that he has 3 anti-virus products installed: Norton
Antivirus, AVG, and Avast. Well, that might be okay if he has only ONE
on-access scanner from one of them running. He can use them all to use
their on-demand scanner (i.e., manual scan) but only one on-access scanner
should be running. These operate as a kernel-level file system driver
that will interrogate the data stream on file writes so having more than
one of them performing a similar function but operating differently might
end up with conflicts. Even using msconfig.exe to disable startup
programs won't eliminate the driver loads for all the anti-virus software.
Three chefs in your one kitchen trying to bake a cake using different
procedures will probably get in each other's way. More is not always
better. Pick one anti-virus product to use its on-access scanner (so you
load only one file system filter driver) and use the on-demand scanners
when you want added detection.

No, sorry i may have used bad english, I have installed three, but since
uninstalled two of them and am now left with one (Norton)

Norton was being a bit buggy so i tried AVG and avast, but then norton
started to do its job (another story though)

I am going to be upgrading my hard disc from ATA to SATA shortly anyhow, in
which case everything may be resolved if it is as you say a problem with the
controller, The game has installed now so it is being a bit random and am
not sure what it could be, I have ran powermax (maxtor diagnostic tool) i
did a full complete scan and the drive came through clean...

as for the suggestion you made about MSCONFIG startup, i am not entirely
sure which programs i should be terminating from here, could i not just do a
safemode boot and try to install in safe mode?

 

[Christo]

first - scan your system and make sure you dont have a virus or some such
thing playing games with you.
What version of windows are you running?
What else is running?
Swap your dimms around ie: exchange DIMM-0 with DIMM-1 if possible
and re-run. If you see new symptoms it could be a bad dimm.
I once had a system that would fail on a HDD format every time. It turned
out to be a bad dimm but for awhile I truly thought my HDD was bad.
Eric

Thanks for the advice

I have 0 viruses according to AVG and norton (in the past 2 days)

I am running Win XP Home SP2

ZoneAlarm, Norton, Spybot IE Resident, Outlook Express is running 95% of
time and well other general programs such as IE and I have recently started
to run opera instead of IE, my USB modem all that kind of stuff

as for the DIMMS i dont think it appears to be that, I have tried removing
DIMMS recently i have 2 and removed the memory from each and it worked fine
(as in the computer turned on and let me do regular stuff like browse net
etc.)

 

[_Vanguard_]

as for the suggestion you made about MSCONFIG startup, i am not
entirely sure which programs i should be terminating from here, could
i not just do a safemode boot and try to install in safe mode?

I was thinking not of the install problems but of the later problems
when using the systems and getting CRC errors. While Safe mode also
eliminates the startup programs, it isn't a normal boot and some
programs and installs just don't work under Safe mode. I can't remember
what it was but about a month ago there was something I tried installing
under Safe mode but the install detected Safe mode and refused to
install. Using msconfig gives you a cleaner boot but more of your
normal setup, like for video. In msconfig under the Startup tab, you
can just uncheck the items to not load them. In fact, I do this with
qttask which is a superfluous load-time task for Quicktime (and later I
tell the msconfig prompt to no longer prompt me that I'm booting with
some startup programs disabled since I want to keep them disabled; some
programs will reinstall their Run key startup if they are executed and
detect it is missing, so I leave it there but disabled). msconfig's
Startup tab only disables the startup programs in the Startup groups
(you and All Users) and in the registry Run keys. I would first start
with just disabling the programs listed under the Startup tab. If the
CRC problem still occurs then use the Services tab to disable
non-critical services (don't disable those listed as Yes under the
Essential column). If you use the General tab and use the Diagnostic
Startup mode, I think that will end up disabling networking, but if you
don't need it then you could try that mode.

However, maybe your problem is not with getting CRCs sometime during the
use of your system but only during installs (which extract huge files
from archive files). Are the CRC error only when installing programs or
during normal use of your computer? Are these old games you are trying
to install? Do you know if they are using old InstallShield v3 (which
had problems) or the MSI Windows Installer (do you see any .msi files on
the install CD)? You won't be able to fix any IS3 problems but maybe
reinstalling MSI would help? Unfortunately,
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=292539 doesn't list a redistributable
for MSI for Windows XP so maybe the only way to step on the current
install of it to fix it is to run the Repair from the Windows XP install
CD. http://support.microsoft.com/?id=884016 indicates a new version is
available. I don't know how to tell what version of MSI is currently
installed. Maybe its logfile tells its version
(http://support.microsoft.com/?id=314852).
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=555175 mentions some troubleshooting
tips. I'll presume you already ran the Disk Cleanup wizard to empty the
temp dirs. The CRC error isn't mentioned in that KB article but is
mentioned in http://support.microsoft.com/?id=817472. Uffda. You'd
think if they are going to switch transfer mode and make the drive
slower that they would alert the user. Although the KB article says the
latest service pack for Windows XP fixes the problem (and you have
SP-2), have you checked to see if the transfer mode is getting changed
for your IDE controllers in Device Manager? I don't have the mentioned
registry data item so my Windows XP would roll down the transfer mode
based on cumulative CRC errors rather than consecutive ones. I would've
thought that these errors, cumulative or consecutive, would be within a
maximum time range but they don't mention expiring the count so maybe it
is per Windows session (i.e., starting from the load of Windows, not
from when you login).

You aren't overclocking anything, right? Did you configure the BIOS to
use the SPD (serial presence detect) for the memory sticks to let them
report their settings, or did you use customized settings for CAS, row
delay, and other memory settings?

If you are using a hard disk that can exceed UDMA33 (i.e., you are using
a UDMA66/100/133 IDE drive), you are using the 80-wire/40-pin cable,
right? You mention using round cables and I would suspect these have
the 80-wires needed to eliminate crosstalk. However, I believe the
ATA-5/6 spec was for flat ribbon cable to use the intervening grounding
signal lines to reduce cross-talk and don't know if rolling it up might
obviate some of that protection (i.e., signal lines that used to have an
intervening grounding line now might be next to each other and running
in parallel. The cheapie round cables just roll up a flat ribbon cable
and put heatshrink around it to keep it round. The better ones include
shielding with aluminum foil and braided mesh, and some don't use any
ribbon cable but separate wires that they twist within the bundle (or
they separate the wires in the ribbon cable to twist them rather than
just rollup the ribbon cable).

 

[_Vanguard_]

... http://support.microsoft.com/?id=884016 indicates a new version is
available. I don't know how to tell what version of MSI is currently
installed. ...

Follow-up -

I finally figured out how to determine what version of Windows Installer
was currently on my system. Run:

msiexec.exe /?

It reports its version (along with all its command-line switches). I
currently have version 3.

 

[Christo]

Follow-up -

I finally figured out how to determine what version of Windows Installer
was currently on my system. Run:

msiexec.exe /?

It reports its version (along with all its command-line switches). I
currently have version 3.

I also currently have version 3, isnt this the old version your previous
post referred to?

I believe my rounded IDE cales will infact be the cheapy cables you mention,
i am not sure if they are 80 pin cables, i read that the 80 pin cables
reduce the cross talk however i have no way to identify if they are 80 pin

And when you ask if the CRC errors are only during installs or normal PC
peration, mainly only during installs

I have been gettin corrupted .cab files and what not when installing other
things as well, only seems to be a problem for large installations and like
you say switching the mode from DMA to PIO sometimes resolves the problem
but makes the system slower

As far as i can tell my system constantly uses DMA mode according to the dev
manager

I have tried manually switching to PIO mode but i do still get the CRC
errors

not sure how when CRC isnt implemented under PIO

Thanks for the links and advice above, the problem appears to have stopped
right now, but it has done so in the past and i am sure it will ressurect
its self later on