Access Options ?

S

Scientific

Hello everyone,

Is is possible to keep a user from changing record locking in Access under
Tools, Options, Advanced, Default Record Locking in a multi-user environment?
It appears this cannot be done with user permissions. Anyone care to
comment please jump right in :)

-S
 
A

Albert D. Kallal

Scientific said:
Hello everyone,

Is is possible to keep a user from changing record locking in Access under
Tools, Options, Advanced, Default Record Locking in a multi-user
environment?
It appears this cannot be done with user permissions. Anyone care to
comment please jump right in :)

-S

That setting only sets the default when editing a table directly. In any
application in which you want control, your users will NEVER open a table
directly anyway, and they usually not be able to see or use the ms-access
interface.

That record locking setting does NOT effect nor override the actual setting
you have in EACH OF your forms (in teh data tab). So, it the form's setting
that will decide if you locking the whole table, the record, or no locking
at all (and with no locking, then you get that message about a record having
been changed by someone else etc etc etc).

So, changing that setting does not change any of your existing forms in the
application.

The following text is a re-post of mine about hiding the access interface:

------------

You most certainly can, and should hide all of the ms-access interface. The
options to complete hide and keep people out of the ms-access interface can
easily be done using the tools->start-up options. Using those options allows
you to complete hide the ms-access interface (tool bars, database window
etc). Also, using these options means you
do not have to bother setting up security.

Try downloading and running the 3rd example at my following web site that
shows a hidden ms-access interface, and NO CODE is required to do
this....but just some settings in the start-up.

Check out:

http://www.members.shaw.ca/AlbertKallal/msaccess/DownLoad.htm

After you try the application, you can exit, and then re-load the
application, but hold down the shift key to by-pass the start-up options. If
want, you can even disable the shift key by pass. I have a sample mdb file
that will let you "set" the shift key bypass on any application you want.
You can get this at:

http://www.members.shaw.ca/AlbertKallal/msaccess/msaccess.html

So, right before you deploy your application to your users, you create a
mde, lock out hte shift key, and further more with a mde, users can't change
the locking settings for that form....
 
S

Scientific

Albert,

I tried accessing your links but could not log onto either of them, but I
used the Startup options you mentioned and it works great. You also
mentioned something about an .mde file. I don't know what that is or what it
does but am interested in learning more about it. Guess I could start by
using VB help section and see what it says about creating an mde.

Sir, you are a wealth of knowledge and I thank god you are available for the
world. I think it would be a blast hanging out with you and talking about
Access. At any rate, thanks a million for all your help with this :)

-S
 
A

a a r o n _ k e m p f

uh, ADP has much much more reliable locking mechanisms, maybe you
should upsize to a database that doesn't have random locking problems
 
S

Scientific

Aaron,

What's ADP?

-S

a a r o n _ k e m p f said:
uh, ADP has much much more reliable locking mechanisms, maybe you
should upsize to a database that doesn't have random locking problems
 
L

Larry Linson

Scientific said:
What's ADP?

ADP is a database frontend format that is Mr. Kempf's favorite obsession.

It relies on Microsoft SQL Server for its data storage and its locking
options, and its full use is blocked by many experienced DBAs who don't
allow users to perform many of the actions recommended by Mr. Kempf.

Larry Linson
Microsoft Office Access MVP
 
S

Scientific

Larry,

Ohhhh, OK. I think I detect a little cynacism here so I'll gracefully bow
out right about here. Since I have the highest esteem and respect for all
the MVP's here I can say that I appreciate the genius of you all. The very
best professionals of the trade rule these forums, and I honor thee with deep
gratitude.

Thank you for explaining what ADP is. I doubt if I'll ever need to use ADP,
but it's good to know what it is and does. My obssession is to someday
become only half as good at Access as the rest of the MVP kings that roam
this space. May the force be with you :)

-S
 
L

Larry Linson

Scientific said:
Ohhhh, OK. I think I detect a little cynacism

It's difficult to have much respect for a person who claims to be
well-qualified but has only one answer for just about every question -- an
answer that is often clearly not appropriate.

ADPs had their place, and aren't as difficult to use as some thought they
might be, but they certainly aren't the answer to every problem that users
have with databases. They are unusable in many client environments in which
I have worked because those clients had corporate standard server databases
other than Microsoft SQL Server. I could detect no significant advantage
when the client did have MS SQL Server and used ADPs -- ACCDB, MDB, and ADP
each have strong and weak points. The Access team at Microsoft no longer
recommends ADP and ADODB as the method of choice for accessing Microsoft SQL
Server.

Thanks for the kind words.

Larry Linson
Microsoft Office Access MVP
 
S

Scientific

Larry,

I'm a relative newbie in the database arena. I've never heard of any of the
platforms you mentioned apart from SQL server although they do sound quite
interesting. I think I read some place that the max number of users in a
multi-user environment in Access is limited to about six. If that's correct,
then I wonder what kind of platform the banking industry uses such as when we
access bank records online, ect. Working with databases of that magnitude
must be awesome. I envy you and your colleagues who work with such entities.

I can't help but be humbled when I read the posts in these forums from MVP's
such as yourself, Lebans, Kallal, Barton, Vinson, Browne, Steele, Marshall,
Klatuu, and many others including the infamous Arvin Meyer along with other
non MVP's but certainly professionals in their own right. I feel very lucky
that I'm able to make contact with such dominant personalities and above all
thankful to Microsoft for making these forums available to the public.

Irregardless of what path all of you choose to follow, there is one thing
that is most certain and that is people like me would be inconsequential in
the database arena were it not for the contributions of people like you. I
sir applaud you and what you do that helps us common folk achieve our dreams.
I have recieved so much help in these forums from people I have never met,
and the result of that help resides here on my home computer. I have
completed my very first multi-user relational database because of individuals
such as yourself. When I show other people my creation they think I'm
awesome but I quickly let them know that I got a lot of help from the pro's
on the coding part. Thank you for your time and keep up the good work Larry.

-S
 
J

John W. Vinson

I'm a relative newbie in the database arena. I've never heard of any of the
platforms you mentioned apart from SQL server although they do sound quite
interesting. I think I read some place that the max number of users in a
multi-user environment in Access is limited to about six. If that's correct,
then I wonder what kind of platform the banking industry uses such as when we
access bank records online, ect. Working with databases of that magnitude
must be awesome.

Just a comment... it's certainly true that people have *written* that Access
is limited to small numbers of users. In practice with a well designed
application that limit is more like forty or fifty concurrently *updating*
users; the system limit is 255 users, but I'd be uncomfortable getting really
close to that limit. The six user limit is balderdash.

Corporate databases (banking, airline reservations, web businesses, etc.) will
indeed not use Access in that role. SQL/Server and Oracle are the big players
in this role, with huge and complex custom program interfaces to connect to
those data stores. Access plays a different niche; it's a huge player in
corporate database operations, but more in the role of small departmental
applications and for "ad hoc" frontends to the client-server corporate
databases.

And thanks for the kind words about Larry and all of the rest of the
ever-growing gang of volunteers; I've learned most of what I know about Access
right here on these newsgroups myself.
 
T

Tony Toews [MVP]

Scientific said:
I think I read some place that the max number of users in a
multi-user environment in Access is limited to about six.

That is totally incorrect. I've had clients with 25 users in all day
long.
If that's correct,
then I wonder what kind of platform the banking industry uses such as when we
access bank records online, ect.

Those would be using SQL Server, Oracle or equivalent. Or frequently
IBM main frame based systems which are quite robust. And they should
be using those highly reliable systems.

However given the increased time it takes to develop against such
products using Access MDBs/ACCDBs to store non critical business makes
a lot of sense.

Tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Please respond only in the newsgroups so that others can
read the entire thread of messages.
Microsoft Access Links, Hints, Tips & Accounting Systems at
http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
 
D

David W. Fenton

it's certainly true that people have *written* that Access
is limited to small numbers of users.

You mean JET not ACCESS. Jet is the component that is limited to 255
users, not Access.
 
D

David W. Fenton

Irregardless of what path all of you choose to follow, there is
one thing that is most certain and that is people like me would be
inconsequential in the database arena were it not for the
contributions of people like you.

I don't claim that I'm consequential, but I wouldn't be half the
developer that I am (and I may be only half the developer that I
think I am) if it weren't for the help I've gotten over the last
decade from the folks in the Access newsgroups. That's why I try to
give back as much as I can (which may include some stern
talking-to's, as well, since that's one of the ways *I* learned to,
on the receiving end of the occasional blistering scolding from
geniuses such as Michael Kaplan and others), because it's the way
the community works.

I think the Beatles sang something about that...
 
J

James A. Fortune

John said:
...
is limited to small numbers of users. In practice with a well designed
application that limit is more like forty or fifty concurrently *updating*
users;

That's my estimate as well. See:

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.databases.ms-access/msg/15e0b6c818324860

:)

James A. Fortune
(e-mail address removed)

The setup cost to power a home completely in the northern U.S. using
solar cells is expected to drop from about $35,000 to about $3,500
within two years. -- Popular Mechanics
 
S

Scientific

Everyone,

Thank you for the enlightenment on the capabilities of Access/Jet, SQL
Server and Oracle. I need to do some reading about Jet. I've heard the term
thrown around here and there. SQL Server and Oracle sound like awesome
applications that dwarf Access, but seem quite intimidating to the newbie
that I am. They say you must crawl before you can walk so I'll crawl my way
through Access first before walking up to SQL or Oracle.

As always mates, I never leave these forums disappointed. Hearing the
varying opinions among you opens new roads for me to traverse and I'm a huge
sponge trying to soak it up. Just wish I could spend a lot more time here,
but duty calls.

Thanks to all yet again :)

-S
 
L

Larry Linson

Scientific said:
... I think I read some place that the max number of users
in a multi-user environment in Access is limited to about six.
If that's correct,

It is not correct, but you'll find heavy-duty enterprise applications use
heavy-duty enterprise server databases. However, those heavy-duty enterprise
server databases may well be "front-ended" with Access clients!

Here's some "boilerplate" that I have used in the past regarding number of
users in Access-Jet multiuser (the concept, by the way, is the same for
Access 2007 - ACE multiuser):

"Factors in how many users can be supported in multiuser include the
requirements, design, and implementation of the database application and the
hardware, software, and network environments. If all factors are near
perfect, we have reliable reports of over 100 concurrent users. Even if not
all are near perfect, we routinely see reports of 30 - 70 users. But, in
cases where we are rather sure that all are about as far from perfect as can
be, people have reported Access "falling over" with as few as four users.

I'd venture to guess that if someone went out of their way to do everything
wrong, it would be possible to create a database that wouldn't even support
one or two users. <GRIN>"

Now, since these comments were intended for users who did/do not distinguish
between Access (the User Interface and Development Tool), let me quickly
point out that David and others are correct that Jet or ACE are the
(default) database engines to which the limitations on number of users
actually apply.

And, just to follow up on using Access as a client to server databases such
as Microsoft SQL Server, Oracle, Sybase, MySQL, PostgreSQL (these last two
are freely-downloadable, open-source packages, but people do pay, and
handsomely for technical support), here's some "boilerplate" for that topic:

"Because you have a copy of the Access client on each users machine, with
just one user, the limit would be determined by the number of concurrent
connections that you can have with the server machine or database, and the
capability of the server database.

I have worked with Access clients to server databases which supported just
under 200 users. Others have reported supporting user audiences in the "low
hundreds" as well. My guess is that just was the largest number they had
occasion to have in the C/S environment. I'm sure that most of the clients
with whom I've dealt in recent years would use a web-based application if
they anticipated more users than a few hundred."
then I wonder what kind of platform the banking industry
uses such as when we access bank records online, ect.
Working with databases of that magnitude must be awesome.
I envy you and your colleagues who work with such entities.

The databases I mentioned earlier are used in banking and other enterprise
applications, as are several varieties of mainframe (and maybe, still, even
some minicomputer) databases, hierarchical as well as relational.

In a previous "incarnation" (1977-84), I was privileged to be associated
with a highly-skilled group of mainframe and minicomputer developers working
on credit card applications, and I created (in IBM S/360 mainframe and in
IBM Series/1 minicomputer) assembler language "database handlers" with
performance as the critical item... it was, indeed, interesting and
demanding. The goal was to retreive the desired client's record 90% of the
time with only one physical disk-read; my database handlers met that
criteria 95% of the time.

But, frankly, I get as much or more satisfaction out of using Access (and
various database engines) to solve business problems than I did from
creating that "infrastructure" for credit card authorization.

Thanks again for your kind words... I consider all the people you list as
good friends as well as valued colleagues. I have learned a lot from each
of them, and some of them (possibly just being kind) say they have learned
from me, as well.

Larry Linson
Microsoft Office Access MVP
 
D

David W. Fenton

SQL Server and Oracle sound like awesome
applications that dwarf Access

This is like saying:

A 747 looks like an awesome machine that dwarfs a Hundai.

In other words, apples meet oranges.

For the bazillionth time:

Access is a database development platform.

It ships with a default database engine, Jet, that supports small
workgroups very well, but can utilize virtually any database engine
as a data store, if the database provides ODBC or OLEDB drivers.
 

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments. After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.

Ask a Question

Top