Chuck,
Just a message to let you know that I have followed your many replies to the
problem of no connection to the workgroup in XP. I've used your suggestions
about revising the browser setup on our LAN which has 2000 Prof OS's on most
of the member computers. That worked equally well up to the point of seeing
all members of the workgroup in My Network Places, but without being able to
open shares either to or from the computer with XP(SP2). That PC is a laptop
that the user joins to the LAN when she comes to work. Without telling
anyone, she bought and installed Norton Internet Security. Shutting that off
resolved all the connection problems. She subsequently uninstalled NIS and
reinstalled it without any bad effects on any connections, and all continues
to work as expected. I have disabled the browser service on all PC's in the
workgroup except for two. One stays powered on all the time. I have modified
the registry MaintainServerList to Yes. The other is only off on weekends
when there is no one else logged on. I have left that set to Auto. I have
also left the Browser service on Automatic on both. If there is anything else
I might do to improve or maintain performance, I would be glad to hear it.
Thanks for your multiple advisories on this subject.
Are you the OP or speaking for the OP, or is this now a new thread?
There are so many ways that you can screw Windows Networking up, causing the no
connection, access denied, and other symptoms, and so few ways to get it right.
Thanks for acknowledging my multiple advisories, but very few are the same in
combination of symptom, diagnosis, and problem, that I seldom try to refer to
any prior thread. It's far simpler to diagnose the problem as reported.
How many computers total in your LAN? Any running a server OS? Are they all NT
based? How many portables?
Since you appear to still possibly have a browser performance issue, I will post
here the latest copy of my browser discussion, article publication pending.
Apologies that it's getting longer (though IMHO better organised).
First a link to the referenced Microsoft article about the browser:
<
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winntas/deploy/prodspecs/ntbrowse.mspx>
In any large office (enterprise domain) environment, you have dozens, if not
hundreds of computers. You don't have to constantly turn the browser service on
or off there. How does that work, and why doesn't a Small Office / Home Office
(SOHO) workgroup environment work the same way?
In a computer network, there are clients, and there are servers. A client is any
computer accessing shared data on another computer, and a server is any computer
providing shared data to another computer. A domain, or workgroup, is a
collection of clients and servers which have a common purpose.
The computers operating as clients, and as servers, all run a Windows operating
system, and all connect to a network. That summarises the similarities between
a SOHO workgroup and an enterprise domain. There are an almost infinite number
of differences between them.
How do the clients know which servers are out there, providing shared data for
them? When you look in Network Neighborhood, and see a list of shares (or
don't), where does the list come from (or why are some shares not there)? The
list is provided by the browser subsystem, and any omissions from the list are
the fault of the browsers.
You can't have every server on the network constantly advertising its presence
to every client - that would create chaos. The browser subsystem tames the
chaos. The servers are listed by the browser servers, and the browser servers
("browsers") provide the server list to the clients.
Just as having every server advertise to every client is bad, so would be having
every server advertise to one server, and that one server distribute the server
list to all of the clients. The official recommendation from Microsoft calls
for 1 browser for every 32 computers in the domain (workgroup). If you have
more than 32 computers, you have backup browsers. The backup browsers have
their activity coordinated by a master browser.
If you have more than one computer, you should have a browser. If you have more
than two computers, you should have a backup browser, and a master browser.
With just two computers, the backup and master browser might be the same
computer.
Each backup browser periodically sends its server list to the master browser,
which aggregates all of the lists into one master list, and distributes back to
each backup browser. The backup browsers distribute the list to the clients,
which then have something to display in Network Neighborhood.
In an enterprise domain, the domain controller (master authentication server)
generally acts as the master browser. The domain controller is always online,
and always accessible. There are major problems in a domain environment, if the
domain controller isn't available.
The domain controller functionality, and the browser functionality, both include
failover mechanisms, so there will always be a domain controller, and a master
browser, available if the server providing that functionality becomes
unavailable for any reason.
There are many differences between an enterprise domain environment, and a SOHO
workgroup environment.
In an enterprise domain network, for instance:
1) The role of any computer, as a client or server, is very formal.
2) Servers are traditionally fixed in location, and stay connected and online,
constantly.
3) Servers generally run a server operating system.
4) Clients typically only need to know (see) the presence of servers.
5) Clients typically don't become browsers, because there are usually at least
2 servers present on the domain, acting as browsers.
6) The configuration of a server is very carefully maintained, generally by a
server administrator. The performance and stability of a server is carefully
guarded.
The master browser role, and the browser role, are generally chosen for a
computer running as the domain controller, and for a computer running a server
operating system.
Contrast all that with your typical SOHO workgroup, where you have 2 or more
computers, all sharing data with each other in a web of shares.
1) The role of any computer, as a client or a server, is casual.
2) Some computers, wirelessly or otherwise connected, may move around. Many
computers are casually disconnected from the network, or turned off, at the whim
of the owner.
3) Most computers run a client operating system, though acting as servers.
4) All computers need to know (see) the presence of other computers in Network
Neighborhood.
5) All computers become browsers, unless otherwise configured.
6) Many computers have software or settings changes made at the whim of the
owner, which may hamper performance or stability, as a client or as a server.
The master browser will be one of the workgroup computers, and be subject to the
treatment of a workgroup computer.
Regardless of all of the above considerations, there is expected to always be a
master browser in any workgroup (domain). "Always" is a relative term, subject
to the browsers checking for a master browser periodically, not every second.
Short of there being a domain controller in your workgroup (there won't be), or
a computer running a server operating system (there may not be), the server
chosen to be the master browser will probably be the server that's been up the
longest (not necessarily online the longest).
Anytime that a backup browser realises that there is no master browser present
on the domain, the browser is authorised to hold an election to determine a new
master browser.
What happens if any server loses contact with another? If a browser server
loses contact with the master browser, it may elect itself a master browser.
This gives you a workgroup (domain) with 2 master browsers, neither able to see
the other. This is where many browser problems start.
Differences between operating system, and configurations, of the various
servers, combined with changing the identity of the master browser, will make
for an ever changing workgroup, as seen in Network Neighborhood. And complaints
that "I can't always see all the computers in my workgroup" become natural (Here
are the key words "always" and "all" again).
What happens if the master browser is rebooted? While it's being rebooted, a
master browser election may be held, and when the server that was the master
browser comes back up and online, it may find that it's no longer the master
browser. Or it may not. The more servers online at any time, the more backup
browsers to notice the absence of the master browser when it's rebooted.
Timing is a major issue here. In any domain (workgroup), as I said, there has
to always be a master browser visible to any backup browser. Any time any
backup browser can't contact the master browser, it assumes that there's a
problem with the master browser, and elects a new master browser. The greater
number of backup browsers that there are on the network, the greater the chance
that one backup browser will realise the absence of the master browser, and
start an election.
What if you, on your home workgroup, casually unplug the network cable on the
master browser? Depending upon how long you leave it unplugged, the master
browser may be replaced. If you simply plug the cable back in, you will have a
workgroup with two master browsers. Some servers may still recognise the old
master browser, others the new one.
What if you carry your laptop away from the router, and it loses network
connectivity? If it's a backup browser, and it realises that contact with the
master browser has been lost, it may elect itself master browser. When it
reconnects to the network, the above situation may apply.
There are also challenges when you have computers running Windows 9x (95, 98, or
ME) on the same network with computers running NT (NT, 2000, XP, Server 2003).
The rules for detecting the absence of the master browser ("Browse Master" in
Windows 9x) vary between the 2 platforms. This leads to the problems when a
working LAN of Windows 9x computers has a Windows XP computer added.
<
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/archive/win95/w95brows.mspx>
<
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=246489>
System configurations, and personal firewalls, may affect the ability of a
server to be seen by a browser, or to act as a master browser. The
restrictanonymous registry setting may prevent any server from being enumerated
("seen") by a browser. Any personal firewall, depending upon configuration, may
prevent a server from being seen as a master browser, or may prevent a master
browser from communicating with the backup browsers.
The bottom line is, in a SOHO workgroup environment, if you can't control the
above factors (and the chaotic environment makes that unlikely), the best thing
to do is to restrict the number of browsers on the network. By doing that, you
lessen the possibility of master browser changes and conflicts. So the advice
given is generally to use one (or two, with the second being the backup)
browsers, and turn the service off on all others.
Of course, even with just two browsers on the LAN, you could (as noted above)
end up with a browser conflict. And if both browsers should be offline, or
separated from the rest of the LAN, you will have no browser service in the rest
of the LAN. So reducing your browser population to two is not a cure all, nor
is it guaranteed to produce success all of the time.
So Microsoft gives us the Browstat program, which will show us what browsers you
have in your domain / workgroup, at any time. At least, with knowledge, you can
detect a problem when it happens, on a LAN with Windows NT / 2K / XP.
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=188305
You can download Browstat from either:
<
http://www.dynawell.com/reskit/microsoft/win2000/browstat.zip>
<
http://rescomp.stanford.edu/staff/manual/rcc/tools/browstat.zip>
Browstat is very small (40K), and needs no install. Just unzip the downloaded
file, copy browstat.exe to any folder in the Path, and run it from a command
window, by "browstat status". Make sure all computers list the same master
browser.
For more information about the browser subsystem (very intricate), see:
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=188001
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=188305
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=231312
<
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winntas/deploy/prodspecs/ntbrowse.mspx>
<
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/archive/win95/w95brows.mspx>
Summary rules for dealing with the browser:
1) Diagnose the problem before making changes to the browser infrastructure.
As I said, the complaint "I can't always see all of the computers from every
computer" is a good symptom of a browser conflict. Lack of "always" or "all" in
the complaint may indicate a different cause. Don't go changing the browser
setup without having some chance of producing results.
2) Browstat, which only works on Windows NT systems, is a good diagnostic tool,
when only Windows NT / 2000 / 2003 / XP systems are involved.
3) It is best to run the browser service on any wired server on the LAN, and
let the browser subsystem elect a master browser as necessary.
4) If you have a small LAN with no computers running a server OS, all servers
are potential master browsers. If you take any server offline, and it is
powered up, you need to power it off before reconnecting it (or at least restart
it while reconnecting it). Or be prepared to diagnose browser conflicts.
5) If you have a small LAN with no computers running a server OS, and any of
the servers are wirelessly connected, disable the browser service on all
wirelessly connected servers. Or be prepared to diagnose browser conflicts.
--
Cheers,
Chuck
Paranoia comes from experience - and is not necessarily a bad thing.
My email is AT DOT
actual address pchuck sonic net.
