EWF Custom Shell no installer -> updating the shell in the field

  • Thread starter Thread starter Mick
  • Start date Start date
M

Mick

Hi there, here it goes,

This is what we want to do:

Update our custom shell. EWF protects partition. No installer component. No
Network.



Short about the Product.

We have a CD/DVD drive, no network access.

The system starts up with a custom shell.

The system partition is protected using EWF.

The second partition will be used to store data.

We do not want that the user has any chance in installing another app. So we
do not have the installer component.

We pretty much want an absolute save system and only our customer shell runs
on it. Nothing else can be added.



Let's consider the rare :-) case that our shell has a bug. How do I update
it?



Using DUA:

I don't have web access so I would need to poll from the CD drive (or maybe
a USB stick). The issue is. That I would send CD's to customers and they
want to update when they get the CD.

Is it possible to trigger the DUA to poll when I want? I don't want to poll
every week / minute / second....

I don't want to commit (EWF) any user changes to the system. Can I disable
EWF copy all the files and than enable EWF. Or do I have to
ewfmgr -restore=0 reboot and than "disable; copy files; enable" ewf?





CD (El Torido):

Is it possible to create a CD that looks to the customer like an
installation CD, which updates:

-Only our custom shell.

-Or the whole image in Partition 1, leaving the 2nd partition as is.



Any thoughts on how to implement an elegant, easy way to update the custom
shell. Best would be that customers pop in the CD and get the new system
without doing anything.



Suggestions are greatly appreciated.



Greetings,



Mick
 
Hi Mick,

This can be done. (We have created similar update solution for our product).

We don't use DUA. Our update application is capable of updating our programs
and drivers.

Regarding EWF.
When you start update you can commit EWF overlay. And when you gracefully
reboot your device all changes that you have made up to that point will be
saved to disk. (no need to disable or enable ewf but you need to reboot
device).

For updating your device image you can create El-torito or RAM boot solution
(from CD, USB stick or network) with your update/install wizard that will
reimage/or update your device software.

This is easy for user, but you will need time to create this solution
(mostly programming time).

Regards,
Slobodan
 
Slobodan,
Thanks for the response.

I did not create an El-torito image yet, but hopefully have time to do that
this week. Is there a utility, like sdi2hd, that would copy my new image
from the cd to the 1st partition on the harddrive. Without formatting the
whole drive?

Would I do something like that in order to update my shell:
Create an El-torito image with a custom shell (this is my updating/installer
shell)
The shell would start copying all the files needed to be updated.
ewfmgr -commit
and reboot.

But I don't want to do a commit, since I don't know what the user changed.
If my update shell gets rid of all the overlays (restore=0) I need to reboot
the system. But how do I know that I just did that?

Any suggestion?

Thanks,

Mick
 
I did not create an El-torito image yet, but hopefully have time to do
that
this week. Is there a utility, like sdi2hd, that would copy my new image
from the cd to the 1st partition on the harddrive. Without formatting the
whole drive?
Click to expand...


There are tools like ghost from Symantech that can do this.
Would I do something like that in order to update my shell:
Create an El-torito image with a custom shell (this is my updating/installer
shell)
The shell would start copying all the files needed to be updated.
ewfmgr -commit
and reboot.
Click to expand...

If you are using RAM EWF in your XPe.
And then you boot from CD, you can safely access disk and update files,
since EWF and overlay are not active since XPe located on disk is not
active.

So no need for refmgr. If you chose to use disk overlay then it would be a
problem.
But I don't want to do a commit, since I don't know what the user changed.
If my update shell gets rid of all the overlays (restore=0) I need to reboot
the system. But how do I know that I just did that?

Any suggestion?
Click to expand...

If you are planning to use diskoverlay, then I don't know how to accomplish
this.
One possible way is to disable disk overlay from XPe before going to update.

Regards,
Slobodan
 
Slobodan,
Thanks. I am not quite sure yet if we will use disk or RAM EWF. But I think
RAM is the way to go for us.

Isn't the scenario the same for disk overlay? If I boot from CD the EWF on
the disk will not be active. I could copy/update all files onto the disk.
Any thoughts on that?

Mick
 
Isn't the scenario the same for disk overlay? If I boot from CD the EWF on
the disk will not be active. I could copy/update all files onto the disk.
Any thoughts on that?
Click to expand...

Consider that you have changed some file with disk overlay active.
Changes would be saved in disk overlay.

not if you choose to modify this file offline, It would become corrupted,
since you would change file content, but overlay would contain changes made
in XPe.

You would need to disable disk overlay before you update files offline.

Regards,
Slobodan
 
Slobodan,

You are right that is true with the overlays! Well, I most likely end up
using RAM overlay anyway.
But if I create a bootable disk with a custom installer shell. Don't I have
to license each CD I produce and send to customers?

I have some questions about the IMAPI cd burning and will start a new thread
soon. I saw that you posted quite a bit on it already. If the IMAPI
component is included (CDFS and CD-rom too) and the imapi service is
started. Can I just drag and drop files on my burner and it will burn them
on disk. I guess I need to write an application for it, right?
What is it with all those Cd-rom components that have (IMAPI settings x,x)
???
Well I guess I couldn't stop writing :-)

Greetings and Thanks,

Mick
 
Mick,

Since you license devices not mediums, I think that we don't have to license
CD.
And since device will run only one XPe image at a time, this should be ok.
You can put some nice EULA at the beginning of install wizard that will
forbid usage of this CD on devices that were not made and licensed by you.
Also you can make some hardware protection that is not present will prevent
installation.

You have support for Drag and Drop burning, but I don't use it since it
requires explorer (and probably explorer shell), and it would make huge
image at the end.

I'm using IMAPI from our program for burning video content to CD.
But problem is that this can't be used for DVD recording.

Regards,
Slobodan
 
Slobodan,
at the end I also want to burn CD's directly from our custom shell without
showing any MS windows. Is that possible/easy to do? I do have the Explorer
in my image but it still won't burn. I guess I forgot a component.

To the MS people: will there be a DVD burn component -> Longhornstyle

Greetings,

Mick
 
Mick,

This thread changed subject. You should create a new thread.
If you want to write CD from your application then you can use minlogon
build without explorer in your image :)

Is it easy to do? I don't know. I lost five days to make burning
application. You might need from 2 to infinite number of days, everything is
possible depending on your knowledge.

Start by familiarizing yourself with:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/vcsharp/team/code/xpburn/default.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/devio/base/
image_mastering_api.asp

Regards,
Slobodan
 
Thank you. I really appreciate your help.

Mick

Slobodan Brcin (eMVP) said:
Mick,

This thread changed subject. You should create a new thread.
If you want to write CD from your application then you can use minlogon
build without explorer in your image :)

Is it easy to do? I don't know. I lost five days to make burning
application. You might need from 2 to infinite number of days, everything is
possible depending on your knowledge.

Start by familiarizing yourself with:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/vcsharp/team/code/xpburn/default.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/devio/base/
image_mastering_api.asp

Regards,
Slobodan


end have
Click to expand...
 
From DUA: Could you autorun your cd, copy the device update program to your
data partition, (have DUA monitor that instead of the CD)... part of your
update script could disable EWF, reboot, continue the update, enable EWF and
reboot again.
-Anil
 
Anil,
that would work too. When I let the CD autorun and the data is copied onto
the data partition. How do I get the DUA to poll. I guess I would also copy
a script into the DUA folder. That script would do the ewf / reboot / copy.
But then I still would need to set the polling interval from the DUA to
'quite often'. The system will act like a workstation and if the user wants
to install something he won't wait for the DUA to finish the installment on
the next poll in an hour or so. He probably will call the support team first
and tell them that the installation does not work.

But could I not just write a script that disables the EWF sets a run once
registry to run my copy script (If that really works??? I think not).
Reboots, than start the copying, enables ewf and reboots again.

How would I write that DUA script? I only did a short tutorial on DUA. I
guess I would need to write several scripts since DUA deletes the ones
executed. The first one disables EWF and reboots. Is this script really
deleted before the system reboots?

I am just spilling out thoughts. Well I guess I will play around with the
DUA a bit. Too many open questions right now.
Thanks.

Greetings,

Mick
 
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