G
Guest
When I start up my computer it clocks my RAM at 333... the RAM I got is 400MHZ... how can I change it to 400MHZ?
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Shenan Stanley
Dustin said:When I start up my computer it clocks my RAM at 333... the RAM I got
is 400MHZ... how can I change it to 400MHZ?
If your motherboard/CPU combination actually allows for it, it would be
controlled by the System BIOS or jumpers on the motherboard - not the OS.
J
Jim
A modern motherboard and RAM use something called SPD (Serial Presence
Detect), which is a fancy way of saying they "talk" to one another to
determine the supported speed of each other, then choose the highest
commonly supported speed among them.
Given no other information, it's very possible that although your RAM is
capable of 400MHz, your motherboard (or CPU) is NOT. So the motherboard
clocked the RAM down to what it could support, namely, 333MHz.
Of course, SPD is not perfect, it doesn't always get things right, so if you
KNOW your motherboard and CPU are capable of 400MHz, and your RAM is 400MHz
(i.e., PC3200), then you should examine the BIOS and override the RAM
settings (if possible). Some motherboards provide very limited options, so
there's no guarantee you actually can make manual changes, you'll just need
to check.
One other thought, it's also possible that your motherboard is
"synchronizing" the CPU and RAM speed for efficiency purposes. In most
cases, a system runs FASTER and more EFFICIENTLY when the CPU and RAM are
running at the SAME SPEED, what's sometimes referred to as a DRAM Ratio of
1:1. So suppose you install an AMD CPU w/ a speed (i.e., FSB, or Front Side
Bus) of 166MHz, I think some Bartons run at this speed. That 166MHz is
*actual*, which is 333MHz DDR *effective* (or in RAM terms, PC2700). Now
you install your PC3200 RAM, but because the CPU is running 333MHz, and the
DRAM ratio is set to 1:1 (synchronous), the BIOS clocks your PC3200 (400MHz)
memory down to PC2700 (333MHz) to maintain synchronicity. Some motherboards
provide the ability to change the DRAM Ratio (i.e., run the CPU and RAM at
different speeds), and thus increase the RAM speed. Some motherboards do
NOT. But even for those that do, it's often more efficient to run
synchronously rather than asynchronously, despite the slight lose in RAM
speed. The difference in CPU vs. RAM speed can cause so many "wait states",
it actually makes the system run SLOWER!
Then again, there are also people who "overclock" their CPU speed (i.e., run
above spec) to keep the CPU and RAM in-sync, and thus the RAM can be run at
PC3200 and still maintain efficiency. But that's beyond the scope of this
discussion, suffice to say, there are a number of options here.
Anyway, that's a lot of stuff to absorb for a single sitting, but hopefully
it will give you plenty to work with. Suggest you investigate your
motherboard, CPU, and RAM capabilities more to learn what can be done.
HTH
Jim
Detect), which is a fancy way of saying they "talk" to one another to
determine the supported speed of each other, then choose the highest
commonly supported speed among them.
Given no other information, it's very possible that although your RAM is
capable of 400MHz, your motherboard (or CPU) is NOT. So the motherboard
clocked the RAM down to what it could support, namely, 333MHz.
Of course, SPD is not perfect, it doesn't always get things right, so if you
KNOW your motherboard and CPU are capable of 400MHz, and your RAM is 400MHz
(i.e., PC3200), then you should examine the BIOS and override the RAM
settings (if possible). Some motherboards provide very limited options, so
there's no guarantee you actually can make manual changes, you'll just need
to check.
One other thought, it's also possible that your motherboard is
"synchronizing" the CPU and RAM speed for efficiency purposes. In most
cases, a system runs FASTER and more EFFICIENTLY when the CPU and RAM are
running at the SAME SPEED, what's sometimes referred to as a DRAM Ratio of
1:1. So suppose you install an AMD CPU w/ a speed (i.e., FSB, or Front Side
Bus) of 166MHz, I think some Bartons run at this speed. That 166MHz is
*actual*, which is 333MHz DDR *effective* (or in RAM terms, PC2700). Now
you install your PC3200 RAM, but because the CPU is running 333MHz, and the
DRAM ratio is set to 1:1 (synchronous), the BIOS clocks your PC3200 (400MHz)
memory down to PC2700 (333MHz) to maintain synchronicity. Some motherboards
provide the ability to change the DRAM Ratio (i.e., run the CPU and RAM at
different speeds), and thus increase the RAM speed. Some motherboards do
NOT. But even for those that do, it's often more efficient to run
synchronously rather than asynchronously, despite the slight lose in RAM
speed. The difference in CPU vs. RAM speed can cause so many "wait states",
it actually makes the system run SLOWER!
Then again, there are also people who "overclock" their CPU speed (i.e., run
above spec) to keep the CPU and RAM in-sync, and thus the RAM can be run at
PC3200 and still maintain efficiency. But that's beyond the scope of this
discussion, suffice to say, there are a number of options here.
Anyway, that's a lot of stuff to absorb for a single sitting, but hopefully
it will give you plenty to work with. Suggest you investigate your
motherboard, CPU, and RAM capabilities more to learn what can be done.
HTH
Jim
400MHZ... how can I change it to 400MHZ?Dustin said:When I start up my computer it clocks my RAM at 333... the RAM I got is
G
Guest
Jim
I have a NVIDIA nForce 2 Chipset Based K7N2 Delta Series Motherboard. The manual says "You can install DDR200/266/333/400."
My OS is Windows XP Home Edition
My prosessor is a AMD Athlon XP 2600.
I have 512 DRR 3200 400MHZ.
My video card is GeFORCE FX 5200 AGP 128DDR
The reason I'm asking this question is I just got a new game (Unreal Tournament 2004.) At times the screen can freeze a bit. I was wondering which part of my computer would I need to upgrade to fix that problem, or if there's anything else I can do to make it run a little smoother. It really isn't very bad... I've had far worse problems with games on my past computers. I could really use some tips on how to get my computer to run as smooth as possible with games
....and thank you very much for the detailed information.
I have a NVIDIA nForce 2 Chipset Based K7N2 Delta Series Motherboard. The manual says "You can install DDR200/266/333/400."
My OS is Windows XP Home Edition
My prosessor is a AMD Athlon XP 2600.
I have 512 DRR 3200 400MHZ.
My video card is GeFORCE FX 5200 AGP 128DDR
The reason I'm asking this question is I just got a new game (Unreal Tournament 2004.) At times the screen can freeze a bit. I was wondering which part of my computer would I need to upgrade to fix that problem, or if there's anything else I can do to make it run a little smoother. It really isn't very bad... I've had far worse problems with games on my past computers. I could really use some tips on how to get my computer to run as smooth as possible with games
....and thank you very much for the detailed information.
J
Jim
Dustin,
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=19-103-417R&depa=0
Found the above AMD Athlon XP 2600 on Newegg.com, and just as I suspected,
it's 333MHz (DDR), so if your processor's specs match this one, this clearly
explains the ratching down of your RAM to PC2700, it keeps the CPU and RAM
operating sychronously.
The MSI K7N2 is an enthusiasts board, so it should provide plenty of BIOS
options. I searched Yahoo, and found the following review:
http://firingsquad.com/hardware/msi_k7n2_review/
Pay special attention to the following page:
http://firingsquad.com/hardware/msi_k7n2_review/page3.asp
And I quote, "The nForce2 chipset is designed to run a synchronous front
side and memory bus. While it supports DDR400 speeds, we've confirmed that
the timing advantages of DDR333 far outweigh the theoretical benefits of the
faster memory grade. MSI includes several options for tuning the memory bus
within the synchronous operation, be it DDR333 or DDR266. If you'd rather
fiddle with asynchronous settings, there are predefined, selectable FSB/DRAM
ratio combinations. In order to avoid overclocking the AGP bus alongside the
front side bus, MSI has decoupled the two pipelines, allowing the AGP bus to
be set between 66 and 120MHz."
In plain english, the reviewer is telling you EXACTLY what I said, it's
understood that in most cases, it's far better to run the NForce chipset
"synchronously" rather than "asynchronously", *even* if you have PC3200
(400MHz) RAM. But the board does give you the ability to manually change
the CPU(FSB)/DRAM ratio in order to *force* asynchronous behavior, i.e., run
the CPU @ 333MHz (DDR), and the memory @ PC3200 (400MHz). In this case,
you'd need to use the 4:5 divider (166MHZ (FSB) / 4 * 5 = 400MHz (RAM)).
There shouldn't be ANY problems in running w/ this divider since all your
components remain "in spec", i.e., NOT overclocked. But remember, it's not
a guarantee it will run faster or better, indeed, I suspect performance will
degrade (suggest you run SiSoftware Sandra, see ref. below, to verify).
There just isn't enough difference in RAM speed to compensate for the loss
of synchronicity.
Your other option is to OC the FSB, again, something you can do in the BIOS.
There's no guarantee your specific processor can even handle 200MHz (which
is what you would need to do to support synchonicity w/ the PC3200 RAM). It
might require additional cooling, certainly more than the stock HSF. But
you *may* be able to overclock the CPU *mildly* without any additional
hardware or concern of overheating using 1MHz increment. Perhaps you can OC
to 170, 175, even 180MHz, etc., and improve performance (may also require a
little CPU voltage increase to maintain stability), just don't go overboard
unless you're familar w/ the process. But mild overclocks are no big deal,
and you have plenty of "headroom" in your RAM (400MHz) to do it, in theory,
you could increase the FSB by 33MHz and maintain synchronicity, but try some
smaller increments of 1-5Mhz or so at first.
Anyway, all this discussion doesn't really address "stability", per se,
something you've only alluded to in your latest response. Changing the
divider to 4:5 shouldn't decrease stability, afterall, all components remain
within spec. OC'ing the FSB *may* increase instability unless done properly
(e.g., not going crazy on the FSB changes, adding a little more CPU voltage,
etc.). Btw, if you do OC the FSB, remember to keep the FSB/DRAM ration @
1:1 if you want to keep the RAM speed within spec.
If the fundamental problem with your current system is instability, then I
suggest solving that FIRST, because you're probably already ideally
configured, certainly nothing suggests that instability is likely.
Instability can have MANY sources, it can be very difficult to isolate, esp.
w/ a new system since you have no prior experience w/ the components,
ANYTHING is suspect at this point.
I always check-out a new system using a variety of tools first, to insure
stability.
http://www.memtest86.com
Create the floppy, boot it, and let it run at least one pass, several passes
even better, and overnight if possible. It's surprisingly good at finding
either bad memory (indicated by errors) or some other CPU/memory problems,
such as being overclocked excessively (again, indicated by errors).
http://www.simmtester.com/default.asp
DocMemory 2.0 has been free for quite some time, similar to memtest-86. I
sometimes use it to cross-check memtest86 results.
http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft.htm
Prime95 (torture test option) is a GREAT tool for shaking out the system, a
truly unstable system will typically fail Prime95 within minutes, sometimes
SECONDS! A truly stable system should be able to run Prime95 for several
hours, ideally 24 hours or more. If you can't achieve such stability w/
Prime95, the problems are only going to be WORSE when running games, which
not only severely stresses the CPU and memory, but introduce the issue of
graphics failures as well. At least Prime95 is not graphically intensive,
so you can isolate the test stressing to the CPU/RAM.
http://www.futuremark.com/
Futuremark 3DMark 2001 (DX8.1) and 2003 (DX9) are good starting points for
stressing the video card. Do this ONLY after successfully completing the
previous tests, or else you'll never now if (assuming it's unstable) it's
the CPU, RAM, or graphics subsystem to blame. A special note: make sure
you install the latest NVIDIA drivers (56.64)! If you suspect the graphics
are still unstable, try older versions (53.03, 52.16, etc.). You may also
want to try increasing the AGP voltage slightly (if the option is available
in the BIOS, usually is, sometimes a little more "juice" can increase
stability, esp. w/ today's higher-end video cards, although the 5200 is not
a screamer as video cards go).
Which raises another suggestion. Sometimes your components can benefit from
a little more voltage all around. It's not unusual to find your power
supply isn't providing enough voltage, something less than spec, despite
your settings. The PC Health section of the BIOS may actually indicate
that, for example, your CPU is running slightly "undervolted", so increasing
the voltage *slightly* will do no harm, it will actually return the CPU to
spec! Same holds true of RAM and AGP voltages, they *may* need a little
more juice, esp. under stress. While idling, you may get away with it.
Which raises yet another possibility, a weak/underpowered PSU (power
supply). The biggest mistake I see w/ high performance systems is the
unwillingness of the builder to invest in a HIGH QUALITY PSU! If you use a
cheap PSU, it may falter when stressed, it may routinely undervolt
components, it may have too many fluctuations in power causing components to
underspec sporadically (something VERY hard to detect unless monitored
closely). Can't tell you how many times I've seen people buy high-end mobo,
CPU, and RAM, then stick it in a cheap case+psu they picked up from Fry's!
Personally, I recommend the Antec TruePower line first, and as a second
choice, the Enermax line. Quality units that have never caused me problems.
http://www.sisoftware.co.uk/
SiSoftware Sandra is a good all around tool to shake out the system, you can
setup a script (using Burn-in Wizard) to test all the components in a loop.
http://www.passmark.com/
I've also used BurnInTest at times, although it's time limited w/o a
purchase (15 mins a run, 30 days expiration). But even the 15 minute tests
under evaluation can often detect failures. It has the benefit over Sandra
of being able to stress all the components CONCURRENTLY, whereas Sandra
tests them SERIALLY.
Unless you can pass all these tests, it's pointless to assume you can
achieve stability under gaming conditions. At least with these tests, you
have "controlled" conditions under which you can independently stress and
monitor individual subsystems, and therefore isolate the problem. Don't be
afraid to increase the CPU, AGP, or RAM voltages *slightly* to increase
stability if you suspect they're being undervolted. Again, *slightly*! A
simple change like this can make all the difference.
Also make sure your RAM dram timings (in the BIOS again) are using SPD
(defaults). If you suspect memory problems, you might want to switch to
manual settings and UNDER clock them, if only to experiment and determine if
the memory is the culprit. Cheap, generic memory can also fail to live up
to spec too, making manual under-specing your only option (or returning it
and opting for a better brand). Remember, SPD sometimes gets it wrong! You
may want to ignore SPD and set the dram timings manually to spec anyway,
just to be sure.
Of course, if the components all seem normal after these tests, it could bad
drivers in the OS, irq or i/o conflicts, directx problems (suing the right
version for your card? DX8.1 or DX9?) and a slew of other possibilities.
Anyway, that's a lot to muster, but it's what I (and many others) do all the
time w/ a new system. Simply "diving in" to a new system without such
scrutiny is asking for trouble. Take the time to thoroughly shake out all
subsystems, it's time well spent.
HTH
Jim
which part of my computer would I need to upgrade to fix that problem, or if
there's anything else I can do to make it run a little smoother. It really
isn't very bad... I've had far worse problems with games on my past
computers. I could really use some tips on how to get my computer to run as
smooth as possible with games.
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=19-103-417R&depa=0
Found the above AMD Athlon XP 2600 on Newegg.com, and just as I suspected,
it's 333MHz (DDR), so if your processor's specs match this one, this clearly
explains the ratching down of your RAM to PC2700, it keeps the CPU and RAM
operating sychronously.
The MSI K7N2 is an enthusiasts board, so it should provide plenty of BIOS
options. I searched Yahoo, and found the following review:
http://firingsquad.com/hardware/msi_k7n2_review/
Pay special attention to the following page:
http://firingsquad.com/hardware/msi_k7n2_review/page3.asp
And I quote, "The nForce2 chipset is designed to run a synchronous front
side and memory bus. While it supports DDR400 speeds, we've confirmed that
the timing advantages of DDR333 far outweigh the theoretical benefits of the
faster memory grade. MSI includes several options for tuning the memory bus
within the synchronous operation, be it DDR333 or DDR266. If you'd rather
fiddle with asynchronous settings, there are predefined, selectable FSB/DRAM
ratio combinations. In order to avoid overclocking the AGP bus alongside the
front side bus, MSI has decoupled the two pipelines, allowing the AGP bus to
be set between 66 and 120MHz."
In plain english, the reviewer is telling you EXACTLY what I said, it's
understood that in most cases, it's far better to run the NForce chipset
"synchronously" rather than "asynchronously", *even* if you have PC3200
(400MHz) RAM. But the board does give you the ability to manually change
the CPU(FSB)/DRAM ratio in order to *force* asynchronous behavior, i.e., run
the CPU @ 333MHz (DDR), and the memory @ PC3200 (400MHz). In this case,
you'd need to use the 4:5 divider (166MHZ (FSB) / 4 * 5 = 400MHz (RAM)).
There shouldn't be ANY problems in running w/ this divider since all your
components remain "in spec", i.e., NOT overclocked. But remember, it's not
a guarantee it will run faster or better, indeed, I suspect performance will
degrade (suggest you run SiSoftware Sandra, see ref. below, to verify).
There just isn't enough difference in RAM speed to compensate for the loss
of synchronicity.
Your other option is to OC the FSB, again, something you can do in the BIOS.
There's no guarantee your specific processor can even handle 200MHz (which
is what you would need to do to support synchonicity w/ the PC3200 RAM). It
might require additional cooling, certainly more than the stock HSF. But
you *may* be able to overclock the CPU *mildly* without any additional
hardware or concern of overheating using 1MHz increment. Perhaps you can OC
to 170, 175, even 180MHz, etc., and improve performance (may also require a
little CPU voltage increase to maintain stability), just don't go overboard
unless you're familar w/ the process. But mild overclocks are no big deal,
and you have plenty of "headroom" in your RAM (400MHz) to do it, in theory,
you could increase the FSB by 33MHz and maintain synchronicity, but try some
smaller increments of 1-5Mhz or so at first.
Anyway, all this discussion doesn't really address "stability", per se,
something you've only alluded to in your latest response. Changing the
divider to 4:5 shouldn't decrease stability, afterall, all components remain
within spec. OC'ing the FSB *may* increase instability unless done properly
(e.g., not going crazy on the FSB changes, adding a little more CPU voltage,
etc.). Btw, if you do OC the FSB, remember to keep the FSB/DRAM ration @
1:1 if you want to keep the RAM speed within spec.
If the fundamental problem with your current system is instability, then I
suggest solving that FIRST, because you're probably already ideally
configured, certainly nothing suggests that instability is likely.
Instability can have MANY sources, it can be very difficult to isolate, esp.
w/ a new system since you have no prior experience w/ the components,
ANYTHING is suspect at this point.
I always check-out a new system using a variety of tools first, to insure
stability.
http://www.memtest86.com
Create the floppy, boot it, and let it run at least one pass, several passes
even better, and overnight if possible. It's surprisingly good at finding
either bad memory (indicated by errors) or some other CPU/memory problems,
such as being overclocked excessively (again, indicated by errors).
http://www.simmtester.com/default.asp
DocMemory 2.0 has been free for quite some time, similar to memtest-86. I
sometimes use it to cross-check memtest86 results.
http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft.htm
Prime95 (torture test option) is a GREAT tool for shaking out the system, a
truly unstable system will typically fail Prime95 within minutes, sometimes
SECONDS! A truly stable system should be able to run Prime95 for several
hours, ideally 24 hours or more. If you can't achieve such stability w/
Prime95, the problems are only going to be WORSE when running games, which
not only severely stresses the CPU and memory, but introduce the issue of
graphics failures as well. At least Prime95 is not graphically intensive,
so you can isolate the test stressing to the CPU/RAM.
http://www.futuremark.com/
Futuremark 3DMark 2001 (DX8.1) and 2003 (DX9) are good starting points for
stressing the video card. Do this ONLY after successfully completing the
previous tests, or else you'll never now if (assuming it's unstable) it's
the CPU, RAM, or graphics subsystem to blame. A special note: make sure
you install the latest NVIDIA drivers (56.64)! If you suspect the graphics
are still unstable, try older versions (53.03, 52.16, etc.). You may also
want to try increasing the AGP voltage slightly (if the option is available
in the BIOS, usually is, sometimes a little more "juice" can increase
stability, esp. w/ today's higher-end video cards, although the 5200 is not
a screamer as video cards go).
Which raises another suggestion. Sometimes your components can benefit from
a little more voltage all around. It's not unusual to find your power
supply isn't providing enough voltage, something less than spec, despite
your settings. The PC Health section of the BIOS may actually indicate
that, for example, your CPU is running slightly "undervolted", so increasing
the voltage *slightly* will do no harm, it will actually return the CPU to
spec! Same holds true of RAM and AGP voltages, they *may* need a little
more juice, esp. under stress. While idling, you may get away with it.
Which raises yet another possibility, a weak/underpowered PSU (power
supply). The biggest mistake I see w/ high performance systems is the
unwillingness of the builder to invest in a HIGH QUALITY PSU! If you use a
cheap PSU, it may falter when stressed, it may routinely undervolt
components, it may have too many fluctuations in power causing components to
underspec sporadically (something VERY hard to detect unless monitored
closely). Can't tell you how many times I've seen people buy high-end mobo,
CPU, and RAM, then stick it in a cheap case+psu they picked up from Fry's!
Personally, I recommend the Antec TruePower line first, and as a second
choice, the Enermax line. Quality units that have never caused me problems.
http://www.sisoftware.co.uk/
SiSoftware Sandra is a good all around tool to shake out the system, you can
setup a script (using Burn-in Wizard) to test all the components in a loop.
http://www.passmark.com/
I've also used BurnInTest at times, although it's time limited w/o a
purchase (15 mins a run, 30 days expiration). But even the 15 minute tests
under evaluation can often detect failures. It has the benefit over Sandra
of being able to stress all the components CONCURRENTLY, whereas Sandra
tests them SERIALLY.
Unless you can pass all these tests, it's pointless to assume you can
achieve stability under gaming conditions. At least with these tests, you
have "controlled" conditions under which you can independently stress and
monitor individual subsystems, and therefore isolate the problem. Don't be
afraid to increase the CPU, AGP, or RAM voltages *slightly* to increase
stability if you suspect they're being undervolted. Again, *slightly*! A
simple change like this can make all the difference.
Also make sure your RAM dram timings (in the BIOS again) are using SPD
(defaults). If you suspect memory problems, you might want to switch to
manual settings and UNDER clock them, if only to experiment and determine if
the memory is the culprit. Cheap, generic memory can also fail to live up
to spec too, making manual under-specing your only option (or returning it
and opting for a better brand). Remember, SPD sometimes gets it wrong! You
may want to ignore SPD and set the dram timings manually to spec anyway,
just to be sure.
Of course, if the components all seem normal after these tests, it could bad
drivers in the OS, irq or i/o conflicts, directx problems (suing the right
version for your card? DX8.1 or DX9?) and a slew of other possibilities.
Anyway, that's a lot to muster, but it's what I (and many others) do all the
time w/ a new system. Simply "diving in" to a new system without such
scrutiny is asking for trouble. Take the time to thoroughly shake out all
subsystems, it's time well spent.
HTH
Jim
manual says "You can install DDR200/266/333/400."Dustin said:Jim,
I have a NVIDIA nForce 2 Chipset Based K7N2 Delta Series Motherboard. The
Tournament 2004.) At times the screen can freeze a bit. I was wonderingMy OS is Windows XP Home Edition.
My prosessor is a AMD Athlon XP 2600.
I have 512 DRR 3200 400MHZ.
My video card is GeFORCE FX 5200 AGP 128DDR.
The reason I'm asking this question is I just got a new game (Unreal
which part of my computer would I need to upgrade to fix that problem, or if
there's anything else I can do to make it run a little smoother. It really
isn't very bad... I've had far worse problems with games on my past
computers. I could really use some tips on how to get my computer to run as
smooth as possible with games.