Convert Access to SQL - Is this possible?

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Greetings. I have many accounting systems developed in Access. I want to go
to a web based system. I understand about creating Active Server Pages, using
SQL, FrontPage, or PHP, apache and mySQL.

But I am confused about one thing. I created many one-to-many relationships,
which have forms and subforms. Now I read that to do this, you need to use
something like Oracle or PostgresSQL, because of transactions.

I am brand new to this conversion, but is this wrong? I have to do the
form/subform to make my things work right. Could someone help me, and point
me in the direction of some sample web databases to try? Or some information,
FAQ's, or books to look at?

Thanks in advance!
Mike
 
SQL-Server has support for transactions.

However, porting a database from Access to SQL-Server doesn't mean that all
of your current transactions under Access will be preserved; because there
is so many possibilities/methods of doing this transfert.

You should buy one or two great books on this or consult a professional who
is already familiar with this subject. Errors might be costly in this
field.

S. L.
 
Thank you very much for responding!

Could you explain a bit further, regarding transactions
please? I am not too worried about porting table
information. My concerns are in the design of the
relationships of tables (one to many), and the design of
the forms, either in PHP or in an asp or aspx.

Could someone out there point me in the direction of
creating a simple form with two tables, using the
form/subform, to create a transaction? I have read a few
books, but this part is not covered.

Again, thanks for any help.

Mike
 
What is *your* exact definition of a transaction and in what context do you
want to use this?

I ask you the question because it looks like that you seem to make some sort
of relation beetween the schema/relationships of tables and the notion of a
transaction under SQL-Server.

S. L.
 
Greetings. I have many accounting systems developed in Access. I want to
go
to a web based system.

Ms-access is part of the office suite. Word, Excel, or ms-access for that
matter has little to do with web based systems.

I understand about creating Active Server Pages, using
SQL, FrontPage, or PHP, apache and mySQL.

If you understand the above, then how can you be confused about sql?
Ms-access uses sql for reports, for forms, for combo boxes, for listbox...in
virtually just about everything you do in ms-access involves using sql. And,
for web sites that use a lot of data, then they also use sql for just about
everything also. (you seem to be hinting that sql is some magical thing out
there that you don't know about?).
But I am confused about one thing. I created many one-to-many
relationships,
which have forms and subforms. Now I read that to do this, you need to use
something like Oracle or PostgresSQL, because of transactions.

Why do you need oracle? Any good developer will often use transactions (you
can use them in ms-access if you want. Check out BeginTrans, CommitTrans,
Rollback Methods in the ms-acess help). The fact that you been using and
working with relatonships and sql in ms-access all along means you don't
need Oracle to have a one to many relatonship. The above question seems very
confusing?
I am brand new to this conversion, but is this wrong? I have to do the
form/subform to make my things work right.

ms-access is about the only product in the marketplace that supports sub
forms (I don't know of any other product that has this feature). So,
clearly, all of the accounting and other systems out there work just fine
without sub forms. So, I see no reason why you "have to do this frm/subfrom"
thing. What you have to do is use a different development approach. In fact,
you have to use whatever the tools at your disposal give you. There is a ton
of applications written in Visual Basic..but Visual basic does not have
sub-forms. In fact, did you know that Simply Accounting uses a ms-access
database..but was written in Visual Basic? (you can actually open Simply
Accounting files with ms-access!!). The fact that Visual Basic does not have
sub-forms never hurt the VB dev eloeprs.
Could someone help me, and point
me in the direction of some sample web databases to try?

web databases? That is a strange term. You mean you want to try an
application that runs on the web, and it is connected to a database? (that
seems like a more reasonable request here). Heck, just go to www.amazon.com
and order a book...

Heck...go to any site on line that allows you to shop and purchase things.
Any one of those sites that allows you fill up a shopping cart with many
items for you ONE order is thus a classic one to many relationship that is
driven by a database. While www.amazon.com, or most of these systems don't
use a form with a sub-form, they work fine (and, as mentioned, VB developers
also never had sub-forms).

There is no question if I was making a book ordering system in ms-access
then I likely would use a form and sub-form. I would do this because I have
that kind of nice feature. However, on a web based system, you don't really
have the ability to make such nice forms. However, this does not means that
you can't have ONE order on amazon.com and place "many" books into that
single order.

Since the developers and designs of the amazon.com site did not have a form
+ sub-form..then they took a different approach.

So, if you are looking for some ideas of web sites that have one thing, and
then have "many" things (like a form + sub form), then just go to virtually
any web site that allows you to shop.....

Web based applications don't have such an ability to produce nice interfaces
like a rich windows product like ms-access, so, you as a developer have to
change how you design the interface. As mentioned, just go to any shopping
site on the web to get ideas.

However, developing, and building and writing web based systems has little
to do with ms-access and this newgroup.
 
First, I want to thank Sylvain and Albert for your help. The responses have
answered many things for me.

I apologize for my poorly written question. When I read it again, I can see
where it was confusing. I was trying to make the "shoe fit the foot." In the
case of access, we have this neat tool for form/subform, which makes it very
easy to create accounting or transaction-type entries, such as a company
lookup and entering the items you want to buy. Your answer that there is no
comparable form/subform in sql with a web interface is the answer I was
looking for. Of course, you said it was possible using other methods
(BeginTrans.. etc.), so this give me a place to go look to accomplish this.

Again, my thanks for your help.

Michael
 
Transactions (BeginTrans, Commit, Rollback) have nothing to do with
form/subform.

Some kind of form/subform relations - like creating new order with details -
will be better served if enlisted as a transaction but that's not the case
with other kinds of form/subform; for example a client with many past and
present orders.

Also, even if form/subform are not directly available as such in web
interfaces; it's quite easy to have something comparable.

S. L.
 
Oops... I think I am confused. Sorry, but I am going in a totally new
direction (web/database connection/SQL), and I am missing something.

Sylvain, the other person who responded (Albert) said that, in Access, you
can do form/subform, but this method is only available in Access. He said
that for doing the transaction action of a form/subform, you have to do
something else for a web page that takes many rows of data and puts it into a
database, such as a Purchase Order would function. He mentioned the
BeginTrans, Commit, etc. to accomplish this.

Could you please point me to a site, information page, FAQ, etc, that could
show me how something like a Purchase Order could be done in a web front end,
that can have many items, that post to a database such as SQL?

Again, my thanks to all of you.

Mike.
 
Oops... I think I am confused. Sorry, but I am going in a totally new
direction (web/database connection/SQL), and I am missing something.

Sylvain, the other person who responded (Albert) said that, in Access, you
can do form/subform, but this method is only available in Access. He said
that for doing the transaction action

I only stated that a form/sub-form interface is available in ms-access. For
other environments..you simply have to use a different interface. (like a
listbox..or a data grid control). However, I made no mention of using what
is called transactions to ACCOMPLISH this goal. The concept, and use of
transactions HAS NOTHING to do with the idea of a form, and a sub-form in
ms-access (or any other system for that matter). In fact, one of the sad
things, or missing feature in ms-access is that transactions don't work with
form at all! (and thus can't be used with a form + sub-form...and boy, I
sure wish this was the case...but it is not!).

However, the concepts of forms and transactions are not really realated in
any special way. You do not need to use transactions in ms-access to have a
form and a sub-form. And, for other systems, you also do not need to use
transactions either. So, these concepts are just general tools that you as a
developer have available.

The use of things like sql (structured query languages), and things like
transactions are just basic technologies that many products like ms-access,
or Oracle or whatever use. However, some products certainly have a
different way of building the user interface (sql-server for example does
not come with ANY tools to create the user interface). However, ms-access
does have a form designer package built in..but most server based systems do
NOT have the tools to build the UI (user interface). It is also important to
realize that you can use ms-access as a interface tool (build the UI, or so
called front end) to a server based database system. So, you can build
screens in ms-access, but the back end database can be Oracle, or Ms-sql
server, or even MySql. (and, all of those database systems EXCEPT for
ms-access come with the ability to develop forms). On the other hand, since
those other systems don't come with any ability to build the UI..then these
systems are often a good choice for web based development, since for web
based systems...you will not use ms-access, or VB...but use web building
tools.

So, I only mentioned that ms-access uses sql, and also that ms-access has
some features like BeginTrans etc. However, these features in no way have
anything to do with form/sub forms. Nor is the reverse true (ie: do those
other database systems need to use BeingTrans etc to have a form and a
sub-form concept). They are not directly related to each other in any way.

The only possible concept that might apply here is that often a web designer
will wrap their sql statements in a transaction since the user might not
complete the order..or simply close their web browser..and not finish what
they were doing. Because the user is using a web browser..then you don't
have all of the cool events..and have the same kind of control that you have
with a windows based system. This tends to make the UI not very good..but
then again...the ability to use the application anytime and anywhere is a
powerful concept.
 
Thank you, Albert, for taking the time to reply to my question and my
confusion. I truly believe you have explained it to me and answered most of
my questions.

I am going to Amazon and buy a couple of books, and work thru basic
examples, and then move up to more complex issues. I think it is time to not
try and compare the two products, ms-access and SQL/ASP/Apache programs.

Again, thanks for taking the time to help me.

mike d.
 

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