XP OEM - Interesting conversation with MS employee

Wonder if you mean that activation will be denied under these circumstances?
How do you know this?
"Can vs May," or, "one thing I remember from the first grade."


Carey Frisch [MVP] wrote:
> Q. "I suspect that means that it can be installed on a completely
> new machine and will activate ok. Is that true?"
>
> A. Not if its an OEM version....only a "Retail Version".
>
>
>> Last night I upgraded a customers machine with new motherboard, cpu,
>> memory, video card, netcard and soundcard. The only thing that was
>> the same was the HDD, dvd drive, tape backup and scsi card. I was
>> having trouble with the internet so I phoned MS to activate XP
>> again. After it activated I asked him what the limit is to hardware
>> change before XP won't activate. He said that XP oem has to always
>> remain on the same PC to be activated. In return I asked "what
>> constitutes the same PC?". He kept going around in circles and not
>> answering my question and just stating that it has to always remain
>> on the same PC. He never gave me a definition of what "same PC"
>> means. In the end I asked if it was more of a policy than a
>> technical limitation and he said "thank you for calling microsoft to
>> activate your software" and hung up!
>>
>> I suspect that means that it can be installed on a completely new
>> machine and will activate ok. Is that true?
>
>
>
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In article <uOTW1qbVFHA.2664@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl>, Woody@ByteMe.com
says...
> the latest from mike brannigan is that it's the oem that determines when the
> original computer is no longer the original computer . so who built the
> computer , who bought the oem os and who installed the os on that computer
> determines the rules as far as i read it .

Not that I want to get into this again, but if you go into the OEM site
at MS, read around the documents, it seemed very clear to me that the
OEM software is tied to the first computer it's installed on, and that
the computer, by MS's documents on the OEM site, indicate that the
Motherboard is the "computer".

When I, as a personal choice, choose OEM, I limit the scope of the
license to the motherboard.

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According to what a MS representative told Kerry Brown recently, the
restriction of OEM XP to the first machine it is installed on is for the
purpose of limiting an OEM's responsibility for support to the machine that
the OEM built. The idea was not to create an ephemeral version of Windows.
The idea was not to make more money, even though the results may have
deviated from the concept in some cases.
If an individual is their own OEM, it kind of begs the question of support,
doesn't it?
I am one of those who believe that honoring the spirit of a rule is more
sensible than blindly honoring the word of a rule. I have been known to cut
the label from a pillow!

Leythos wrote:
> In article <uOTW1qbVFHA.2664@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl>, Woody@ByteMe.com
> says...
>> the latest from mike brannigan is that it's the oem that determines
>> when the original computer is no longer the original computer . so
>> who built the computer , who bought the oem os and who installed the
>> os on that computer determines the rules as far as i read it .
>
> Not that I want to get into this again, but if you go into the OEM
> site at MS, read around the documents, it seemed very clear to me
> that the OEM software is tied to the first computer it's installed
> on, and that the computer, by MS's documents on the OEM site,
> indicate that the Motherboard is the "computer".
>
> When I, as a personal choice, choose OEM, I limit the scope of the
> license to the motherboard.
>
> --

"Leythos" <void@nowhere.lan> wrote

Woody@ByteMe.com > says...
>> the latest from mike brannigan is that it's the oem that determines when
>> the
>> original computer is no longer the original computer . so who built the
>> computer , who bought the oem os and who installed the os on that
>> computer
>> determines the rules as far as i read it .
>
> Not that I want to get into this again, but if you go into the OEM site
> at MS, read around the documents, it seemed very clear to me that the
> OEM software is tied to the first computer it's installed on, and that
> the computer, by MS's documents on the OEM site, indicate that the
> Motherboard is the "computer".
>
> When I, as a personal choice, choose OEM, I limit the scope of the
> license to the motherboard.

You are saying one cannot upgrade a computer if you have an OEM licence and
that by upgrading it, you lose the licence to use the software you bought
for this upgraded computer. Scam, no matter how you slice it.

Example. Last year I got a MoBo with an AGP 4x slot and it can only handle
266 RAM. I want an 8x slot and a motherboard that can handle 400 RAM and a
faster 400 processor to go with it. With your theory, I would have to buy
another copy of an OEM Windows XP to upgrade the same computer the first OEM
was installed on and I say that is a scam if true, it is designed to make
people buy software they already have and paid for. Now, I will buy the
motherboard and new RAM and if I have to call MS, I will only give them the
number, as is outlined in their FAQs and not feel like a thief or weasal but
as a person who merely upgraded his computer and didn't want to be forced to
buy something I already have again!

Please explain how all of this relates to piracy, be it for profit or
"casual". I am all ears.

Alias

In article <undRn6bVFHA.3188@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl>,
aka@maskedandanonymous.org says...
>
> "Leythos" <void@nowhere.lan> wrote
>
> Woody@ByteMe.com > says...
> >> the latest from mike brannigan is that it's the oem that determines when
> >> the
> >> original computer is no longer the original computer . so who built the
> >> computer , who bought the oem os and who installed the os on that
> >> computer
> >> determines the rules as far as i read it .
> >
> > Not that I want to get into this again, but if you go into the OEM site
> > at MS, read around the documents, it seemed very clear to me that the
> > OEM software is tied to the first computer it's installed on, and that
> > the computer, by MS's documents on the OEM site, indicate that the
> > Motherboard is the "computer".
> >
> > When I, as a personal choice, choose OEM, I limit the scope of the
> > license to the motherboard.
>
> You are saying one cannot upgrade a computer if you have an OEM licence and
> that by upgrading it, you lose the licence to use the software you bought
> for this upgraded computer. Scam, no matter how you slice it.
>
> Example. Last year I got a MoBo with an AGP 4x slot and it can only handle
> 266 RAM. I want an 8x slot and a motherboard that can handle 400 RAM and a
> faster 400 processor to go with it. With your theory, I would have to buy
> another copy of an OEM Windows XP to upgrade the same computer the first OEM
> was installed on and I say that is a scam if true, it is designed to make
> people buy software they already have and paid for. Now, I will buy the
> motherboard and new RAM and if I have to call MS, I will only give them the
> number, as is outlined in their FAQs and not feel like a thief or weasal but
> as a person who merely upgraded his computer and didn't want to be forced to
> buy something I already have again!
>
> Please explain how all of this relates to piracy, be it for profit or
> "casual". I am all ears.
>
> Alias

Alias, I'm not getting into a word game. I've said how I read the
details on the OEM site, the documents the provided on their site, and
how I choose to interpret what they said in those documents.

I also said that it's up to each person to interpret what MS means until
the actually call MS and ask for clarification - which I don't expect
many to admit to doing.

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Michael C wrote:
> Last night I upgraded a customers machine with new motherboard, cpu,
> memory, video card, netcard and soundcard. The only thing that was
> the same was the HDD, dvd drive, tape backup and scsi card. I was
> having trouble with the internet so I phoned MS to activate XP again.
> After it activated I asked him what the limit is to hardware change
> before XP won't activate. He said that XP oem has to always remain on
> the same PC to be activated. In return I asked "what constitutes the
> same PC?". He kept going around in circles and not answering my
> question and just stating that it has to always remain on the same
> PC. He never gave me a definition of what "same PC" means. In the end
> I asked if it was more of a policy than a technical limitation and he
> said "thank you for calling microsoft to activate your software" and
> hung up!
> I suspect that means that it can be installed on a completely new
> machine and will activate ok. Is that true?

Yes, as long as you don't tell them that it is a totally different
computer, they can figure it out from the encrypted PA data, so they
will activate you.

Some MS employees CLAIM that changes the motherboard makes it a new
computer, so be careful about what you tell PA reps, as you might get
one that is of that opinion.

PA is a total waste of time, and if it weren't for the errors it throws
at people, it would be a complete farce!

http://www.microscum.com/mmpafaq/

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Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Woody wrote:

>
> from what Mike Brannigan , an MS employee and frequent poster , has been
> saying of late is that it's up to the oem to determine when the original
> machine is no longer the original machine . definately a major retreat from
> earlier interpretations of the ms oem eula .
>
>

No, that's no "retreat." That's what the official policy, as stated by
Microsoft employees, has always been.


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both at once. - RAH

I just sent the following to my MS Partner contact at MS:

********
I have read the EULA, the OEM site documents, but as a MS Partner
company I can not get clarification on what constitutes a "Computer" for
the OEM licensing agreement. The agreement states that the OEM license
is tied to the first "Computer" that it is installed on, so what single
or group of components does MS strictly consider as the "Computer". I
have thought it was the motherboard, but the EULA doesn't state that,
others have suggested that it's the power cord.

Please provide a MS answer that clearly defines what constitutes a
"Computer" so that my customers can upgrade their computers without
violating their OEM licensing agreements.
*******

When I get a reply I will post it - they say it could be 24 hours for a
reply.

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Leythos wrote:
> In article <4281450a$0$79452$14726298@news.sunsite.dk>, me@nospam.com
> says...
>> "Leythos" <void@nowhere.lan> wrote in message
>> news:MPG.1ceb0d68324d00a59896dd@news-server.columbus.rr.com...
>>> You've asked/speculated two different things:
>>>
>>> 1) What are the rules
>>> 2) What can you get away with
>>>
>>> One has little to do with the other, the other has a lot to do with
>>> the one, you can read it as you want
>>
>> That's exactly what I asked him. I asked "if it was more of a policy
>> than a technical limitation". I don't want to pirate XP but if a
>> customer has bought XP I'd like to know what I can do to their
>> machine before a new copy is required. If XP hadn't worked after
>> their machine was upgraded it would have been a problem and it would
>> have been good for me to know before hand. I probably should have
>> found out earlier but there are so many things I should have found
>> out earlier and MS don't make it easy sometimes. Anyway, it looks
>> like I can do whatever I want to the machine and it will still work,
>> which is a good thing. :-)
>
> Actually, you can call MS and ask for Licensing information, not the
> activation drones, MS proper and ask for a email/document explaining
> licensing. Now, after I've said this, you are also going to get people
> telling you that you can do what you want as MS has never taken any
> personal user/installer to court over multiple installs against a
> single key/license.
>
> In the grand scheme of software licensing, it's up to you to determine
> what is right/wrong and what you feel you can get away with. Some of
> us are hard-line and purchase a OEM copy considering that additional
> MS documents call the Motherboard the defining component, while
> others look at the EULA and say that the power cord could be the
> single defining component. It's all in what you are comfortable with
> until you ASK MS legal what they mean.

LOL! The End User never agree to that post EULA password-protected
webpage that makes the unsubstantiated claim that the MOBO is the
defining component!

And different MS employees tell a different story about at what point
does upgrading components constitute a new and different computer.

Leythos you really should just give it up! The OP actually talked to a
MS employee and couldn't get a straight answer out of him. And why is
that? Because MS rather keep the FUD surrounding when upgrading a
computer turns it into another computer by defining it in the EULA. MS
KNOWS if pressed their POST EULA FUD is in no way enforceable.

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"

Leythos wrote:
> In article <uOTW1qbVFHA.2664@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl>, Woody@ByteMe.com
> says...
>> the latest from mike brannigan is that it's the oem that determines
>> when the original computer is no longer the original computer . so
>> who built the computer , who bought the oem os and who installed the
>> os on that computer determines the rules as far as i read it .
>
> Not that I want to get into this again, but if you go into the OEM
> site at MS,

You mean the password protected site!

> read around the documents, it seemed very clear to me
> that the OEM software is tied to the first computer it's installed
> on, and that the computer, by MS's documents on the OEM site,
> indicate that the Motherboard is the "computer".

Unfortunately NO END USER EVER AGREED TO THOSE TERMS!

You are totally full of sh*t! You can't get it through your thick skull
that the web page is NEVER agreed to!

>
> When I, as a personal choice, choose OEM, I limit the scope of the
> license to the motherboard.

Good for you, you little MSAss-licking toady!

Those of us that ain't MS partners and have absolutely no conflict of
interest when it comes to having business dealings with MS have never
agree, and most have never even seen the password protected web site of
FUD about the mobo is the computer and bill gates is god!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.com/mscommunity
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei"