How does Radeon 9600 compare to 8500DV ??

On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 05:24:09 GMT
Barry Watzman <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote:

> How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
> performance?

In a sense that's apples to oranges--you're comparing a "regular" ATI
board with an "All-in-wonder". If you're asking how an ordinary 9600
compares in frame rates and whatnot to the 8500, it's a good deal
faster--the 8500 was a little behind the curve even when it was new. If
you're asking about the image quality, it should be a wash--the 8500
doesn't have a lot of room for improvement in that regard. If you're
asking about the TV features of the 9600 AIW vs the 8500DV, it's a mixed
bag--the 9600 would have a better tuner(_anything_ is better than the
tuner on the 8500DV), but it gives up the DVI out in order to get
support for two analog RGB monitors--the 9600 also uses a newer version
of the Rage Theater chip which provides additional hardware assistance
for MPEG encoding, reducing the workload on the CPU a bit.

--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video performance?

On Fri, 28 Nov 2003 03:13:25 GMT
Barry Watzman <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote:

> The question was limited to framerates and performance, but I didn't
> make that clear. I am fully aware of the multimedia differences
> between the AIW and the video cards. The question was asked because
> Best Buy has the 9600 for $79 tomorrow morning.

Geez, grab it.

> Sooo Sad wrote:
> > Yeha
> >
> > but a 9600 deluxe version has fireiwire so you will not need all in
> > wonder cards anymore. You won't need piunnacle cards. You can do it
> > with firewire altough I heard that external firewire cards are more
> > reliable that onboard firewire.
> >
> >
> > "J.Clarke" <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
> > news:20031126130640.6878227f.jclarke@nospam.invalid...
> >
> >>On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 05:24:09 GMT
> >>Barry Watzman <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
> >>>performance?
> >>
> >>In a sense that's apples to oranges--you're comparing a "regular"
> >ATI>board with an "All-in-wonder". If you're asking how an ordinary
> >9600>compares in frame rates and whatnot to the 8500, it's a good
> >deal>faster--the 8500 was a little behind the curve even when it was
> >new. If>you're asking about the image quality, it should be a
> >wash--the 8500>doesn't have a lot of room for improvement in that
> >regard. If you're>asking about the TV features of the 9600 AIW vs
> >the 8500DV, it's a mixed>bag--the 9600 would have a better
> >tuner(_anything_ is better than the>tuner on the 8500DV), but it
> >gives up the DVI out in order to get>support for two analog RGB
> >monitors--the 9600 also uses a newer version>of the Rage Theater chip
> >which provides additional hardware assistance>for MPEG encoding,
> >reducing the workload on the CPU a bit.>
> >>--
> >>--
> >>--John
> >>Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
> >>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
> >
> >
> >
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 18:27:06 GMT
"Sooo Sad" <SooosadHASNOMAIL@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Yeha
>
> but a 9600 deluxe version has fireiwire so you will not need all in
> wonder cards anymore. You won't need piunnacle cards. You can do it
> with firewire altough I heard that external firewire cards are more
> reliable that onboard firewire.

You can do _what_ with firewire? You can get boxes that attach via
firewire that give you a tuner and analog capture capability, but the
decent ones cost about the same as an All-In-Wonder. And you will
probably find that those boxes don't work and play well with a firewire
port on an AGP board.

I'm not sure what you believe you are gaining by using an external box
connected via firewire instead of using a PCI board.

And read up on the 8500DV--the problem with its firewire port apply to
any firewire port connected via the AGP bus as they involve components
external to the video board.


> "J.Clarke" <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
> news:20031126130640.6878227f.jclarke@nospam.invalid...
> > On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 05:24:09 GMT
> > Barry Watzman <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote:
> >
> > > How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
> > > performance?
> >
> > In a sense that's apples to oranges--you're comparing a "regular"
> > ATI board with an "All-in-wonder". If you're asking how an ordinary
> > 9600 compares in frame rates and whatnot to the 8500, it's a good
> > deal faster--the 8500 was a little behind the curve even when it was
> > new. If you're asking about the image quality, it should be a
> > wash--the 8500 doesn't have a lot of room for improvement in that
> > regard. If you're asking about the TV features of the 9600 AIW vs
> > the 8500DV, it's a mixed bag--the 9600 would have a better
> > tuner(_anything_ is better than the tuner on the 8500DV), but it
> > gives up the DVI out in order to get support for two analog RGB
> > monitors--the 9600 also uses a newer version of the Rage Theater
> > chip which provides additional hardware assistance for MPEG
> > encoding, reducing the workload on the CPU a bit.
> >
> > --
> > --
> > --John
> > Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
> > (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
>
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Yeha

but a 9600 deluxe version has fireiwire so you will not need all in wonder
cards anymore. You won't need piunnacle cards. You can do it with firewire
altough I heard that external firewire cards are more reliable that onboard
firewire.


"J.Clarke" <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:20031126130640.6878227f.jclarke@nospam.invalid...
> On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 05:24:09 GMT
> Barry Watzman <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
> > performance?
>
> In a sense that's apples to oranges--you're comparing a "regular" ATI
> board with an "All-in-wonder". If you're asking how an ordinary 9600
> compares in frame rates and whatnot to the 8500, it's a good deal
> faster--the 8500 was a little behind the curve even when it was new. If
> you're asking about the image quality, it should be a wash--the 8500
> doesn't have a lot of room for improvement in that regard. If you're
> asking about the TV features of the 9600 AIW vs the 8500DV, it's a mixed
> bag--the 9600 would have a better tuner(_anything_ is better than the
> tuner on the 8500DV), but it gives up the DVI out in order to get
> support for two analog RGB monitors--the 9600 also uses a newer version
> of the Rage Theater chip which provides additional hardware assistance
> for MPEG encoding, reducing the workload on the CPU a bit.
>
> --
> --
> --John
> Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
> (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

The question was limited to framerates and performance, but I didn't
make that clear. I am fully aware of the multimedia differences between
the AIW and the video cards. The question was asked because Best Buy
has the 9600 for $79 tomorrow morning.


Sooo Sad wrote:
> Yeha
>
> but a 9600 deluxe version has fireiwire so you will not need all in wonder
> cards anymore. You won't need piunnacle cards. You can do it with firewire
> altough I heard that external firewire cards are more reliable that onboard
> firewire.
>
>
> "J.Clarke" <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
> news:20031126130640.6878227f.jclarke@nospam.invalid...
>
>>On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 05:24:09 GMT
>>Barry Watzman <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
>>>performance?
>>
>>In a sense that's apples to oranges--you're comparing a "regular" ATI
>>board with an "All-in-wonder". If you're asking how an ordinary 9600
>>compares in frame rates and whatnot to the 8500, it's a good deal
>>faster--the 8500 was a little behind the curve even when it was new. If
>>you're asking about the image quality, it should be a wash--the 8500
>>doesn't have a lot of room for improvement in that regard. If you're
>>asking about the TV features of the 9600 AIW vs the 8500DV, it's a mixed
>>bag--the 9600 would have a better tuner(_anything_ is better than the
>>tuner on the 8500DV), but it gives up the DVI out in order to get
>>support for two analog RGB monitors--the 9600 also uses a newer version
>>of the Rage Theater chip which provides additional hardware assistance
>>for MPEG encoding, reducing the workload on the CPU a bit.
>>
>>--
>>--
>>--John
>>Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
>>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
>
>
>

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 17:18:27 GMT
"Sooo Sad" <SooosadHASNOMAIL@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Well,
>
> a firewire card cost like 40 dollars. Buy one, connect your digital
> camera to it and that is it. You won't need all in god wonders to do
> the trick. But I think onboard firewire is a bit new and thus
> instable.

I see. So how does one record a television broadcast with one's digital
camera?

> "Barry Watzman" <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:ZTfxb.42592$kL2.5442@fe3.columbus.rr.com...
> > How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
> performance?
> >
>
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On Mon, 01 Dec 2003 00:00:21 GMT
"Larry B" <hatespam@hatespam.gov> wrote:

>
> "Barry Watzman" <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:3FCA3745.8010107@neo.rr.com...
> > It was my fault for not making it more clear, but the inquiry was
> > limited only to straight video dispaly performance.
> >
> > However, a 9600 plus firewire port (wherever) hardly makes the
> > equivalent of an AIW 8500. You still don't have either video
> capture
> > (from analog video sources) or the tuner functionality.
> >
> Hey Barry, I just caught this thread and was wondering about the
> "(from analog sources)" condition regarding the 8500DV. I have seen
> that for the AIW 9000 Pro, too. Does that mean that the 8500DV cannot
> be used for DV video capture or is it unimportant (are the avi and
> mpeg-2 formats analog)?? Seems odd since it is called "8500DV".
> Anyway, thanks,

The "DV" part of the 8500DV consists of a Firewire port that doesn't
work very well because it has to go through a PCI-AGP bridge, and a
digital tuner (digital circuitry, not digital signal) that is grossly
oversensitive and overloads at the slightest pretext.

You _might_ be able to use the firewire port for DV but don't count on
it working. You can't do off-the-air HD capture with it without an
additional board that can tune the digital broadcasts.

AVI and MPEG-2 are necessarily digital is is any other data stored on a
computer, however with the AIWs the signal that was analyzed and encoded
in those formats was analog when it came into the machine.
>
> LarryB
>
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Well,

a firewire card cost like 40 dollars. Buy one, connect your digital camera
to it and that is it. You won't need all in god wonders to do the trick. But
I think onboard firewire is a bit new and thus instable.


"Barry Watzman" <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote in message
news:ZTfxb.42592$kL2.5442@fe3.columbus.rr.com...
> How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
performance?
>

It was my fault for not making it more clear, but the inquiry was
limited only to straight video dispaly performance.

However, a 9600 plus firewire port (wherever) hardly makes the
equivalent of an AIW 8500. You still don't have either video capture
(from analog video sources) or the tuner functionality.


Sooo Sad wrote:

> Well,
>
> a firewire card cost like 40 dollars. Buy one, connect your digital camera
> to it and that is it. You won't need all in god wonders to do the trick. But
> I think onboard firewire is a bit new and thus instable.
>
>
> "Barry Watzman" <WatzmanNOSPAM@neo.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:ZTfxb.42592$kL2.5442@fe3.columbus.rr.com...
>
>>How does the Radeon 9600 compare to an 8500DV in terms of video
>
> performance?
>
>
>