Minolta 5400 resolution question

I found the resolution settings on the Minolta 5400 somewhat confusing.
The dialog box asks for an input resolution, as well as an output size
and resolution. This is fine if an user has a particular output size and
resolution in mind. But I want to get the highest scanning resolution
(5400) scan first, and then downsample in PS for a variety of outputs.
Will the following settings achieve this purpose:

Input = 5400 (max)
Output = 4000 (max)
Unit = inch
The rest = left alone

For a full frame 35mm 16-bit scan, these settings result in the
following data in the PS File Browser:

216mb file size
7400 x 5100 pixels
4000 dpi resolution

The pixel counts say the scan is at 5400dpi. How does the 5400 apply the
4000dpi output number in scanning or generating the scan file? It would
be much clearer if there is an Undefined entry in the Output menu in the
dialog box.

The full resolution, ucnropped file dimensions should be 7800x5232. The
dpi setting (4000, in your case) is just for printing set up.

In my case, I wanted the dpi set to 5400, because I'm outputting 16bit
linear for use as a Vuescan raw file. Minolta only allows me to set up
to 4000, so I left at default 300 and set later, through a Photoshop
batch.

BUT, I just now located the file written when you save settings as a
"job". In my case with window xp system the file was:

C:\Program Files\DiMAGEScan\DS_Elite5400\Job\Custom\Full resolution no
crop.135

I just opened the file with a text editor and change the line:

<outputRes>300</outputRes>

to read:

<outputRes>5400</outputRes>

I saved a copy beforehand (always a good idea), and logged what I did,
in a text file log, of any and all things I've messed around with
(another good idea).

Seems to have worked. When I start the Scan Utility, and re-load that
file, I've now got Resolution Output indicated to be 5400 (and greyed).

Minolta's settings interface always confuses the hell out of me, as
well. For one thing, I'll think I've set it, but only for frame one.
Frame 2 will revert to something else. Here's the whole file, fwiw:

++++

<!-- MFSJOB Win Version 1.0 -->
<JobName>
<English>Full resolution no crop</English>
</JobName>
<ScanSetting>
<inputLock>OFF</inputLock>
<outputLock>OFF</outputLock>
<inputRes>5400</inputRes>
<outputRes>5400</outputRes>
<times>1800</times>
<unit>pixel</unit>
<inputSizeW>7800.00</inputSizeW>
<inputSizeH>5232.00</inputSizeH>
<outputSizeW>7800.00</outputSizeW>
<outputSizeH>5232.00</outputSizeH>
<trimmingSizeW>975</trimmingSizeW>
<trimmingSizeH>654</trimmingSizeH>
<GUIxOffset>0</GUIxOffset>
<GUIyOffset>0</GUIyOffset>
<xLength>5232</xLength>
<yLength>7800</yLength>
</ScanSetting>

++++

JimSoto430@att.net wrote:
>I found the resolution settings on the Minolta 5400 somewhat
>confusing.
>The dialog box asks for an input resolution, as well as an output
>size
>and resolution. This is fine if an user has a particular output size
>and
>resolution in mind. But I want to get the highest scanning resolution
>(5400) scan first, and then downsample in PS for a variety of
>outputs.
>Will the following settings achieve this purpose:
>
>Input = 5400 (max)
>Output = 4000 (max)
>Unit = inch
>The rest = left alone
>
>For a full frame 35mm 16-bit scan, these settings result in the
>following data in the PS File Browser:
>
>216mb file size
>7400 x 5100 pixels
>4000 dpi resolution
>
>The pixel counts say the scan is at 5400dpi. How does the 5400 apply
>the
>4000dpi output number in scanning or generating the scan file? It
>would
>be much clearer if there is an Undefined entry in the Output menu in
>the
>dialog box.

As I see it, it's really simple but I may be wrong of course...

The input dpi tells the scanner at what res to scan.
The output dpi info is stored wtih the image and tells e.g. your
printer at what size to print the image.

If you set input at 5400 and output at e.g. 800, the printer will
print at 800 dpi. This is an effective magnification of 6.75 times.
So your negative being about 1 inch wide will print as an image 6.75
inches wide.
The Minolta sw lets you set this output dpi by choosing the final
magnification or by choosing the final size (w x h) - or, if you
want, by setting the output dpi.

In fact the final image is all the time the same : 7400 x 5100 in
your case. Photoshop can tell what output size has been set for the
image. And you can set it to a different value in Photoshop.

I see no use for editing the job file yourself. It is much easier to
set the printing size using your printer setup. For use with VueScan
I think it isn't necessary to set the output dpi at any particular
value, but I didn't try this myself

Regards, Alex
alexUNDERSCOREstolsATxs4allDOTnl

Alex Stols wrote:

> As I see it, it's really simple but I may be wrong of course...
>
> The input dpi tells the scanner at what res to scan.
> The output dpi info is stored wtih the image and tells e.g. your
> printer at what size to print the image.

I agree with your statement. Having "dpi" associated with
files is a source of massive confusion with digital
images. It only tells the printer how big to print it,
not really anything else. And it's arbitrarily changeable
to anything using a number of programs, including photoshop.

Having an input and output dpi being the same means that
if it were printed, it'd print the same size as the film
(as if a contact print were being made).

There may be a mode in the sw where you can give a print
dpi and size of print and let it choose the input dpi,
but I don't recall if it does (I've a Minolta 5400),
I just set the scan dpi and go from there.

I actually did read the manual front to end once when I first
got it. :-) :-) Not that I remember any of it....

Mike

"Anoni Moose" <gewgle@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>Alex Stols wrote:
>
>> As I see it, it's really simple but I may be wrong of course...
>>
>> The input dpi tells the scanner at what res to scan.
>> The output dpi info is stored wtih the image and tells e.g. your
>> printer at what size to print the image.
>
>I agree with your statement. Having "dpi" associated with
>files is a source of massive confusion with digital
>images. It only tells the printer how big to print it,
>not really anything else. And it's arbitrarily changeable
>to anything using a number of programs, including photoshop.
>
>Having an input and output dpi being the same means that
>if it were printed, it'd print the same size as the film
>(as if a contact print were being made).
>
>There may be a mode in the sw where you can give a print
>dpi and size of print and let it choose the input dpi,
>but I don't recall if it does (I've a Minolta 5400),
>I just set the scan dpi and go from there.
>
>I actually did read the manual front to end once when I first
>got it. :-) :-) Not that I remember any of it....
>
>Mike
>
I agree: the output dpi setting really doesn't matter much. Not all
image formats keep that info in the file.

And I'd like to add that I hate to think what happens if you edit the
job file and set the input dpi to something higher than 5400 ! Or to
somthing different from what is shown as a choice in the input box...

Regards, Alex
alexUNDERSCOREstolsATxs4allDOTnl

Vuescan uses the dpi setting with scan-from-disk for Input
Scan(Preview) Resolution. If you set this to "custom", the number you
enter will be factored against the dpi setting. As an example, if you
have dpi set to 5400, and enter 4000 in this Vuescan field, your output
will be smaller by a factor of 4000/5400. I usually set the dpi of this
output file to the more usual 300, since now it is print parameter I'm
actually setting. And usually this will need to be reset as well.

Editting the Minolta Scan Utility ini file directly is the only way to
get a dpi setting higher than 4000, the native resolution of my
scanner.
The above step seems to be working just fine, no ill effects