On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 19:21:21 +0100
"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with 8MB Cache are
> super fast I also hear they are super noisy and prone to high pitched
> whine.
>
> But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are lacking in
> performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have read - and people
> are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives as being super-quiet.
> Anyone have any first hand info on this?

I've got two Samsungs in my Tivo--they seem to be just a hair louder
than the Seagates in my PC. I have another machine with a WD
drive--that drive was noisy at first, but I moved it to a different bay
to change the resonant frequency of the assembly and it quieted right
down. Still not as quiet as the Seagates. At first I thought they had
failed to start.

> Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but, um,
> after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and the issues
> people had with them I have drawn a mental line through buying them
> ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?

That's a religious matter. You won't find reliable answers.
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> J.
>
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Hi,

Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with 8MB Cache are super
fast I also hear they are super noisy and prone to high pitched whine.

But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are lacking in
performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have read - and people are
beginning to talk about the Samsung drives as being super-quiet. Anyone have
any first hand info on this?

Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but, um, after
hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and the issues people had
with them I have drawn a mental line through buying them ever again. Did
Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?

Thanks,


J.

On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 21:08:45 +0100
"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Thanks - what Seagates do you have?

Barracuda IV, 40 gig--the 80s are noisier in that series.

> J.
>
>
> "J.Clarke" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 19:21:21 +0100
> > "John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with 8MB Cache
> > > are super fast I also hear they are super noisy and prone to high
> > > pitched whine.
> > >
> > > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are
> > > lacking in performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have read
> > > - and people are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives as
> > > being super-quiet. Anyone have any first hand info on this?
> >
> > I've got two Samsungs in my Tivo--they seem to be just a hair louder
> > than the Seagates in my PC. I have another machine with a WD
> > drive--that drive was noisy at first, but I moved it to a different
> > bay to change the resonant frequency of the assembly and it quieted
> > right down. Still not as quiet as the Seagates. At first I thought
> > they had failed to start.
> >
> > > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but,
> > > um, after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and
> > > the issues people had with them I have drawn a mental line through
> > > buying them ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
> >
> > That's a religious matter. You won't find reliable answers.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > >
> > > J.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > --
> > --John
> > Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
> > (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
>
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 21:24:40 +0100
"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Thanks Rod,
>
> I am not up to date on these fluid bearing drives - the WDs aren't but
> the Seagates are? Using fluids is down to, what exactly, elminate the
> whine or to cut down noise generally?

Fluid Dynamic Bearings. Ball and roller bearings have lots of little
bitty pieces that spin around and if any of them is just the slightest
bit out of true or picks up the tiniest bit of crud then they make a
noise. Fluid dynamic bearings have only one moving part, the shaft, or
its attached bushings. They are designed to work with a specific
lubricant that maintains a continuous film in normal operation, hence no
vibration sources and less noise. Further, since there is in normal
operation no metal-to-metal contact they last longer.

Western Digital has a white paper on their site which states that they
are going to go to fluid dynamic bearings on their entire line, but
there's no timetable or list of models so equipped. Nonetheless it does
have a good short description of the technology
<http://www.wdc.com/en/library/eide/2579-001052-000.pdf>.
>
> J.
>
>
> "Rod Speed" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:bdvenk$1181ld$(E-Mail Removed)...
> >
> > John Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> > message news:yoFMa.1194$(E-Mail Removed)...
> >
> > > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with
> > > 8MB Cache are super fast I also hear they are super noisy
> >
> > Nope.
> >
> > > and prone to high pitched whine.
> >
> > Can happen given that they are the last of the non fluid bearing
> > drives.
> >
> > > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are
> > > lacking in performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have
> > > read - and people are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives
> > > as being super-quiet. Anyone have any first hand info on this?
> >
> > The latest range is really too recent to be able
> > to say much on noise developing over time.
> >
> > There isnt even much around review wise yet.
> >
> > > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but,
> > > um, after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and
> > > the issues people had with them I have drawn a mental line through
> > > buying them ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
> >
> > They certainly never fessed up to what the problem was.
> >
> > Its too early to tell what the story with the 180GXPs will be
> > reliability
> wise.
> >
> > And they still have a hopeless RMA system where they wont preship
> > the replacement with a credit card required to protect them against
> > you not returning the one thats died. That alone puts them in the
> > bin as far as I am concerned. I wouldnt buy a drive from an
> > operation like that unless it left the alternatives for dead feature
> > wise, and they dont.
> >
> >
> >
>
>


--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Thanks - what Seagates do you have?

J.


"J.Clarke" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 19:21:21 +0100
> "John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with 8MB Cache are
> > super fast I also hear they are super noisy and prone to high pitched
> > whine.
> >
> > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are lacking in
> > performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have read - and people
> > are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives as being super-quiet.
> > Anyone have any first hand info on this?
>
> I've got two Samsungs in my Tivo--they seem to be just a hair louder
> than the Seagates in my PC. I have another machine with a WD
> drive--that drive was noisy at first, but I moved it to a different bay
> to change the resonant frequency of the assembly and it quieted right
> down. Still not as quiet as the Seagates. At first I thought they had
> failed to start.
>
> > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but, um,
> > after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and the issues
> > people had with them I have drawn a mental line through buying them
> > ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
>
> That's a religious matter. You won't find reliable answers.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> > J.
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> --
> --John
> Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
> (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Thanks Rod,

I am not up to date on these fluid bearing drives - the WDs aren't but the
Seagates are? Using fluids is down to, what exactly, elminate the whine or
to cut down noise generally?

J.


"Rod Speed" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:bdvenk$1181ld$(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> John Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> message news:yoFMa.1194$(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with
> > 8MB Cache are super fast I also hear they are super noisy
>
> Nope.
>
> > and prone to high pitched whine.
>
> Can happen given that they are the last of the non fluid bearing drives.
>
> > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are
> > lacking in performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have
> > read - and people are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives
> > as being super-quiet. Anyone have any first hand info on this?
>
> The latest range is really too recent to be able
> to say much on noise developing over time.
>
> There isnt even much around review wise yet.
>
> > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but,
> > um, after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and
> > the issues people had with them I have drawn a mental line through
> > buying them ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
>
> They certainly never fessed up to what the problem was.
>
> Its too early to tell what the story with the 180GXPs will be reliability
wise.
>
> And they still have a hopeless RMA system where they wont preship
> the replacement with a credit card required to protect them against
> you not returning the one thats died. That alone puts them in the bin
> as far as I am concerned. I wouldnt buy a drive from an operation like
> that unless it left the alternatives for dead feature wise, and they dont.
>
>
>

Thanks Rod, the whine is an issue for me on a 120GB 2MB Cache WD that I have
so I think I will opt for a Seagate. They have some made with FD motors but
I can find no mention of fluid.

J.

"Rod Speed" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:bdvj2v$11eueo$(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> John Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> message news:acHMa.1278$(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> > Thanks Rod,
>
> > I am not up to date on these fluid bearing
> > drives - the WDs aren't but the Seagates are?
>
> Basically all except the WDs can be fluid bearing now,
> including the Samsungs. With Maxtor they can be either.
>
> > Using fluids is down to, what exactly, elminate the whine
>
> Yep.
>
> > or to cut down noise generally?
>
> Nope.
>
>
> > "Rod Speed" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> > news:bdvenk$1181ld$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >
> > > John Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> > > message news:yoFMa.1194$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >
> > > > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with
> > > > 8MB Cache are super fast I also hear they are super noisy
> > >
> > > Nope.
> > >
> > > > and prone to high pitched whine.
> > >
> > > Can happen given that they are the last of the non fluid bearing
drives.
> > >
> > > > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are
> > > > lacking in performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have
> > > > read - and people are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives
> > > > as being super-quiet. Anyone have any first hand info on this?
> > >
> > > The latest range is really too recent to be able
> > > to say much on noise developing over time.
> > >
> > > There isnt even much around review wise yet.
> > >
> > > > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but,
> > > > um, after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and
> > > > the issues people had with them I have drawn a mental line through
> > > > buying them ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
> > >
> > > They certainly never fessed up to what the problem was.
> > >
> > > Its too early to tell what the story with the 180GXPs will be
reliability
> > wise.
> > >
> > > And they still have a hopeless RMA system where they wont preship
> > > the replacement with a credit card required to protect them against
> > > you not returning the one thats died. That alone puts them in the bin
> > > as far as I am concerned. I wouldnt buy a drive from an operation like
> > > that unless it left the alternatives for dead feature wise, and they
dont.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:yoFMa.1194$(E-Mail Removed)...
> Hi,
>
> Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with 8MB Cache are super
> fast I also hear they are super noisy and prone to high pitched whine.
>
> But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are lacking in
> performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have read - and people are
> beginning to talk about the Samsung drives as being super-quiet. Anyone
have
> any first hand info on this?
>
> Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but, um, after
> hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and the issues people
had
> with them I have drawn a mental line through buying them ever again. Did
> Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?

I had one of the dodgy 75GXP drives (a 45 gig) and IBM/Hitachi replaced it
with a brand new 60gig 120GXP, even though mine was already 2 years into
it's warranty and they'd just started one year warranties (R.I.P. 3 year
warranties). So despite what someone else said about IBM warranties,
they're OK by me, especially compared to those cheating scumbags at Maxtor
(but that's another story).

> Thanks,
>
>
> J.
>
>

Thanks - that's explains alot.

J.


"J.Clarke" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 21:24:40 +0100
> "John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> > Thanks Rod,
> >
> > I am not up to date on these fluid bearing drives - the WDs aren't but
> > the Seagates are? Using fluids is down to, what exactly, elminate the
> > whine or to cut down noise generally?
>
> Fluid Dynamic Bearings. Ball and roller bearings have lots of little
> bitty pieces that spin around and if any of them is just the slightest
> bit out of true or picks up the tiniest bit of crud then they make a
> noise. Fluid dynamic bearings have only one moving part, the shaft, or
> its attached bushings. They are designed to work with a specific
> lubricant that maintains a continuous film in normal operation, hence no
> vibration sources and less noise. Further, since there is in normal
> operation no metal-to-metal contact they last longer.
>
> Western Digital has a white paper on their site which states that they
> are going to go to fluid dynamic bearings on their entire line, but
> there's no timetable or list of models so equipped. Nonetheless it does
> have a good short description of the technology
> <http://www.wdc.com/en/library/eide/2579-001052-000.pdf>.
> >
> > J.
> >
> >
> > "Rod Speed" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> > news:bdvenk$1181ld$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >
> > > John Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> > > message news:yoFMa.1194$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >
> > > > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with
> > > > 8MB Cache are super fast I also hear they are super noisy
> > >
> > > Nope.
> > >
> > > > and prone to high pitched whine.
> > >
> > > Can happen given that they are the last of the non fluid bearing
> > > drives.
> > >
> > > > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are
> > > > lacking in performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have
> > > > read - and people are beginning to talk about the Samsung drives
> > > > as being super-quiet. Anyone have any first hand info on this?
> > >
> > > The latest range is really too recent to be able
> > > to say much on noise developing over time.
> > >
> > > There isnt even much around review wise yet.
> > >
> > > > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but,
> > > > um, after hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and
> > > > the issues people had with them I have drawn a mental line through
> > > > buying them ever again. Did Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
> > >
> > > They certainly never fessed up to what the problem was.
> > >
> > > Its too early to tell what the story with the 180GXPs will be
> > > reliability
> > wise.
> > >
> > > And they still have a hopeless RMA system where they wont preship
> > > the replacement with a credit card required to protect them against
> > > you not returning the one thats died. That alone puts them in the
> > > bin as far as I am concerned. I wouldnt buy a drive from an
> > > operation like that unless it left the alternatives for dead feature
> > > wise, and they dont.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> --
> --John
> Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
> (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Thanks for your help all - I ordered a Seagate VII 120GB with 8MB Cache
today. I don't know much about Samsungs of yet, although people say they are
very quiet, and was a bit concerned how reliable they are. A friend has a
Seagate VII and you can barely hear it right next to it.

J.



"Li'l ol' me" <richie42@***SPAMOFF**eidosnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bdvpkr$g07$(E-Mail Removed)...
> "John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:yoFMa.1194$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > Hi,
> >
> > Whilst I hear the WD 120GB Special Edition drives with 8MB Cache are
super
> > fast I also hear they are super noisy and prone to high pitched whine.
> >
> > But, I hear some of the newer Seagates, although quiet, are lacking in
> > performance - 120GB SATA is not that hot so I have read - and people are
> > beginning to talk about the Samsung drives as being super-quiet. Anyone
> have
> > any first hand info on this?
> >
> > Also, I hear that the IBM/Hitachis are considered good now but, um,
after
> > hearing about those faulty IBMs a year or so back and the issues people
> had
> > with them I have drawn a mental line through buying them ever again. Did
> > Hitachi over-come the IBM issues?
>
> I had one of the dodgy 75GXP drives (a 45 gig) and IBM/Hitachi replaced it
> with a brand new 60gig 120GXP, even though mine was already 2 years into
> it's warranty and they'd just started one year warranties (R.I.P. 3 year
> warranties). So despite what someone else said about IBM warranties,
> they're OK by me, especially compared to those cheating scumbags at Maxtor
> (but that's another story).
>
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> > J.
> >
> >
>
>