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Pulse Audio, Yet Another Linux Engineering Failure.

 
 
Doctor Smith
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Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009


http://linsux.org/index.php?topic=948.0

http://www.linsux.org/uploads/linsuxformat-issue1.pdf

Linux has been notorious for supporting more than one sound system. ALSA
(Advanced Linux Sound System) and OSS (Open Sound System) . Other systems
build upon it, such as PortAudio and JACK. In an attempt to unify them,
Linux devs forever ****ed up a setup that only needed a bit of extra
configuration to properly work.


" PulseAudio was the retarded inbred child that came out of the wreckage.
With only support for unifying OSS and ALSA, many multimedia applications
get left out in the cold. Take Audacity, for example. The popular recording
app is usually measured against prosumer applications such as Goldwave.
Audacity itself is based upon the WxWidget toolset, and the multimedia
framework it uses is PortAudio. Currently, no complete backend for
PortAudio exists."


" Users have to disable PulseAudio and experience the joys of choppy audio
playback. Did the recording **** up, or is it the playback?"


" Who knows, the fact remains that editing in that app suddenly becomes a
major pain to use. Are you on the professional grade of recording, and not
give a **** about :average; apps like Audacity? Well, ****, Ardour and JACK
are pretty well-respected, right?"


"Obviously, it isn・t respected enough to get proper bugfixes from the
PulseAudio devs. The JACK framework becomes horribly incompatible with
PulseAudio and, say, an OSS driver for a Logitech microphone."

" It becomes even worse on mics that were deemed by Microsoft and Apple to
:Just Work;. Even if you get Ardour to record, you won・t be able to edit
for very long. "


"Indeed, multimedia apps on Linux seem to collapse under their own weight.
Ardour crashes within the span of five minutes. Renowned video apps such as
KDEnlive, LiVES, or Cinelerra all segfault from PulseAudio-based problems.
"


"What do the devs do about it? NOTHING. Look at their mailing lists and
forum discussions. Between their pompous cries of :READ THE FAQ; and :CHECK
THE WIKI;, newcomers to PulseAudio struggle to understand the overly
complex and bloated sound system."



" What・s worse, some apps choose to ONLY choose one framework or another.
On Gnome, this is less of an issue. On KDE, XFCE, Blackbox, E17, GNUStep,
and other desktop environments, it・s KIND OF A BIG ****ING DEAL. Not being
able to listen to songs =FAIL Not being able to listen to your own
recordings = DOUBLE FAIL. And don・t get me started on games. If OpenArena
plays sound, and Tremulous doesn・t, and PulseAudio is set as your main
audio framework, and you configured everythingKwellK You・re on your own."


And that ladies and gentlemen is a perfect example of why Linux sucks.
And it does.

 
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Bill Yanaire
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Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009
<SNIP ****>

Yes, you must be roy's bitch. You bend over for him constantly. What a
loser.


 
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Hadron
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Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009
Doctor Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> http://linsux.org/index.php?topic=948.0
>
> http://www.linsux.org/uploads/linsuxformat-issue1.pdf
>
> Linux has been notorious for supporting more than one sound system. ALSA
> (Advanced Linux Sound System) and OSS (Open Sound System) . Other systems
> build upon it, such as PortAudio and JACK. In an attempt to unify them,
> Linux devs forever ****ed up a setup that only needed a bit of extra
> configuration to properly work.
>
>
> " PulseAudio was the retarded inbred child that came out of the wreckage.
> With only support for unifying OSS and ALSA, many multimedia applications
> get left out in the cold. Take Audacity, for example. The popular recording
> app is usually measured against prosumer applications such as Goldwave.
> Audacity itself is based upon the WxWidget toolset, and the multimedia
> framework it uses is PortAudio. Currently, no complete backend for
> PortAudio exists."
>
>
> " Users have to disable PulseAudio and experience the joys of choppy audio
> playback. Did the recording **** up, or is it the playback?"
>
>
> " Who knows, the fact remains that editing in that app suddenly becomes a
> major pain to use. Are you on the professional grade of recording, and not
> give a **** about average apps like Audacity? Well, ****, Ardour and JACK
> are pretty well-respected, right?"
>
>
> "Obviously, it isnt respected enough to get proper bugfixes from the
> PulseAudio devs. The JACK framework becomes horribly incompatible with
> PulseAudio and, say, an OSS driver for a Logitech microphone."
>
> " It becomes even worse on mics that were deemed by Microsoft and Apple to
> Just Work. Even if you get Ardour to record, you wont be able to edit
> for very long. "
>
>
> "Indeed, multimedia apps on Linux seem to collapse under their own weight.
> Ardour crashes within the span of five minutes. Renowned video apps such as
> KDEnlive, LiVES, or Cinelerra all segfault from PulseAudio-based problems.
> "
>
>
> "What do the devs do about it? NOTHING. Look at their mailing lists and
> forum discussions. Between their pompous cries of READ THE FAQ and CHECK
> THE WIKI, newcomers to PulseAudio struggle to understand the overly
> complex and bloated sound system."
>
>
>
> " Whats worse, some apps choose to ONLY choose one framework or another.
> On Gnome, this is less of an issue. On KDE, XFCE, Blackbox, E17, GNUStep,
> and other desktop environments, its KIND OF A BIG ****ING DEAL. Not being
> able to listen to songs =FAIL Not being able to listen to your own
> recordings = DOUBLE FAIL. And dont get me started on games. If OpenArena
> plays sound, and Tremulous doesnt, and PulseAudio is set as your main
> audio framework, and you configured everythingwell Youre on your own."
>
>
> And that ladies and gentlemen is a perfect example of why Linux sucks.
> And it does.
>


Linux audio is a complete and utter mess. And "choice" has made is
so. How? Rather than concentrate on fixing the tricky bits in existing
mountains of amateur code, newboyz decide to create a new one. And as
soon as they hit the tricky bits .... yes, it starts all over again.

Even TRYING to FIGURE OUT what the different "things" in a Linux audio
setup can do is difficult. never mind fixing them or reconfiguring
them.

--
In view of all the deadly computer viruses that have been spreading
lately, Weekend Update would like to remind you: when you link up to
another computer, youre linking up to every computer that that
computer has ever linked up to. Dennis Miller
 
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Chris Ahlstrom
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Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009
After takin' a swig o' grog, Doctor Smith belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

<Garbage snipped>

Looks like the flatfish is bothering the Linux and Windows groups with his
inane garbage again.

--
If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would
be a merrier world.
-- J.R.R. Tolkien
 
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Bill Yanaire
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Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009

"Chris Ahlstrom" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:8hnHl.31641$(E-Mail Removed)...
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Doctor Smith belched out
> this bit o' wisdom:
>
> <Garbage snipped>
>
> Looks like the flatfish is bothering the Linux and Windows groups with his
> inane garbage again.
>

Maybe old Doctor Smith was rejected by the Sheep again and is ****ed off


 
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Doctor Smith
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009
On Tue, 21 Apr 2009 10:10:20 -0700, Bill Yanaire wrote:

> <SNIP ****>
>
> Yes, you must be roy's bitch. You bend over for him constantly. What a
> loser.


You are mixing me up with Chrish Ahlstrom = Liarmutt = Linosuck = Linonut.
Chris's head is so far up Schestowitz's ass, if you tickle Chris's feet,
Roy Schestowitz laughs.
 
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Ezekiel
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009

"Doctor Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
>
> http://linsux.org/index.php?topic=948.0
>
> http://www.linsux.org/uploads/linsuxformat-issue1.pdf
>
> Linux has been notorious for supporting more than one sound system. ALSA
> (Advanced Linux Sound System) and OSS (Open Sound System) . Other systems
> build upon it, such as PortAudio and JACK. In an attempt to unify them,
> Linux devs forever ****ed up a setup that only needed a bit of extra
> configuration to properly work.
>
>
> " PulseAudio was the retarded inbred child that came out of the wreckage.
> With only support for unifying OSS and ALSA, many multimedia applications
> get left out in the cold. Take Audacity, for example. The popular
> recording
> app is usually measured against prosumer applications such as Goldwave.
> Audacity itself is based upon the WxWidget toolset, and the multimedia
> framework it uses is PortAudio. Currently, no complete backend for
> PortAudio exists."
>
>
> " Users have to disable PulseAudio and experience the joys of choppy audio
> playback. Did the recording **** up, or is it the playback?"
>
>
> " Who knows, the fact remains that editing in that app suddenly becomes a
> major pain to use. Are you on the professional grade of recording, and not
> give a **** about :average; apps like Audacity? Well, ****, Ardour and
> JACK
> are pretty well-respected, right?"
>
>
> "Obviously, it isn・t respected enough to get proper bugfixes from the
> PulseAudio devs. The JACK framework becomes horribly incompatible with
> PulseAudio and, say, an OSS driver for a Logitech microphone."
>
> " It becomes even worse on mics that were deemed by Microsoft and Apple to
> :Just Work;. Even if you get Ardour to record, you won・t be able to
> edit
> for very long. "
>
>
> "Indeed, multimedia apps on Linux seem to collapse under their own weight.
> Ardour crashes within the span of five minutes. Renowned video apps such
> as
> KDEnlive, LiVES, or Cinelerra all segfault from PulseAudio-based problems.
> "
>
>
> "What do the devs do about it? NOTHING. Look at their mailing lists and
> forum discussions. Between their pompous cries of :READ THE FAQ; and
> :CHECK
> THE WIKI;, newcomers to PulseAudio struggle to understand the overly
> complex and bloated sound system."
>
>
>
> " What・s worse, some apps choose to ONLY choose one framework or another.
> On Gnome, this is less of an issue. On KDE, XFCE, Blackbox, E17, GNUStep,
> and other desktop environments, it・s KIND OF A BIG ****ING DEAL. Not
> being
> able to listen to songs =FAIL Not being able to listen to your own
> recordings = DOUBLE FAIL. And don・t get me started on games. If OpenArena
> plays sound, and Tremulous doesn・t, and PulseAudio is set as your main
> audio framework, and you configured everythingKwellK You・re on your
> own."
>
>
> And that ladies and gentlemen is a perfect example of why Linux sucks.
> And it does.
>


This explains why about 60% of the time that I start Linux there's no sound
and I need to manually start and stop alsa in order to get sound working.



 
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dawhead
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Posts: n/a
 
      21st Apr 2009
On Apr 21, 12:57*pm, Doctor Smith <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

[ blah blah blah blah ]

the list of what you don't seem to know or understand seems long. we
could start with:

* the differing goals of systems like ALSA (hardware abstraction)
and PulseAudio
(network audio, device switching, global per-application
control, and more)
* just as you wouldn't run a significant webserver on a generic
install, you don't
do prosumer let along pro music recording/playback on a
generic install
* the presence of several different sound systems on Windows that
are capable
of causing similar issues for users there (MME, WDM, ASIO and
more)
* the fact that no application is expected to ever "support
PulseAudio"

i could go on, but what's the point. its COLA.

 
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dawhead
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Posts: n/a
 
      22nd Apr 2009
On Apr 21, 7:51*pm, Tim Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> Apple doesn't need separate sound systems for consumer, prosumer, and
> pro. *Why does Linux?


Why not ask Microsoft? After all, they do everything so well, I guess
we decided to copy them.

Or did you actually want a serious reply to that? on COLA?
 
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Doctor Smith
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      22nd Apr 2009
On Tue, 21 Apr 2009 16:51:32 -0700, Tim Smith wrote:

> In article
> <(E-Mail Removed)>,
> dawhead <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> * just as you wouldn't run a significant webserver on a generic
>> install, you don't
>> do prosumer let along pro music recording/playback on a
>> generic install

>
> Apple doesn't need separate sound systems for consumer, prosumer, and
> pro. Why does Linux?


Neither does Windows, really.

Click ASIO or WDM in the application.
That's it.
Most people find ASIO allows for lower latencies.

Linux is a total mess when it comes to sound.


 
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