Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled and
almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.

I built a lightly loaded system with the following:

AMD 4200+ X2
Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed

No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.

At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating wildly
when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading the Yahoo
Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a rapid jump from
45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless the program is
terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just started using the
system, so I have not run that many programs, but several install programs
have hung and at this point I would like to troubleshoot the problem. I
maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the heat sink which is adjustable
and the problem noted above occurs regardless.

Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
thermal grease)?
Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
How should I proceed?

I would appreciate any help you can provide.

One other thing to note is that as soon as the Yahoo program is terminated
the CPU temp goes right back down to 45c

"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:LvmdnZJR8Id-NzjeRVn-(E-Mail Removed)...
> Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
> green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled and
> almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.
>
> I built a lightly loaded system with the following:
>
> AMD 4200+ X2
> Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
> Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
> Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
> 500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
> 400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
> 1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed
>
> No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.
>
> At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating
> wildly when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading
> the Yahoo Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a
> rapid jump from 45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless
> the program is terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just
> started using the system, so I have not run that many programs, but
> several install programs have hung and at this point I would like to
> troubleshoot the problem. I maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the
> heat sink which is adjustable and the problem noted above occurs
> regardless.
>
> Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
> Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
> thermal grease)?
> Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
> Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
> How should I proceed?
>
> I would appreciate any help you can provide.
>
>
>
>

Sounds like the heatsink is not contacting the cpu properly. Did you have
any problems attaching the heatsink/fan ?

"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:LvmdnZJR8Id-NzjeRVn-(E-Mail Removed)...
> Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
> green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled and
> almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.
>
> I built a lightly loaded system with the following:
>
> AMD 4200+ X2
> Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
> Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
> Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
> 500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
> 400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
> 1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed
>
> No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.
>
> At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating
> wildly when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading
> the Yahoo Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a
> rapid jump from 45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless
> the program is terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just
> started using the system, so I have not run that many programs, but
> several install programs have hung and at this point I would like to
> troubleshoot the problem. I maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the
> heat sink which is adjustable and the problem noted above occurs
> regardless.
>
> Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
> Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
> thermal grease)?
> Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
> Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
> How should I proceed?
>
> I would appreciate any help you can provide.
>
>
>
>

A couple of possibilities:

1. First the tech I hired to help me to this did not spread the thermal
grease around enough in my opinion. He simply put 8 or nine small piles on
the CPU and told me that grease would automatically spread around. I thought
it was odd, but perhaps this could be a factor.

2. The workaround was performed correctly, but perhaps this is an issue.
http://www.zalman.co.kr/product/cool...eluxe_eng.html

"There are some capacitors (circled in red) that interfere with Zalman's
AMD64 Backplate on the backside of the A8V Deluxe. Zalman recommends
following procedures for this combination.

1. Remove the retention frame only, and place our CPU cooler at the center
of the CPU.

2. Screw in the original bolts provided with the motherboard, then tighten
each bolt a few turns at a time while alternating between the two until the
clearance between the motherboard and the bottom of the clip (or grip) is
13.5mm.

(TIP) You can easily check the 13.5mm clearance by placing the "AMD64
Nipple" provided with CNPS7000A, CNPS7000B, CNPS7700 and ZM-WB2 Gold between
the motherboard and the bottom of the clip (or grip) as shown below."



"RonK" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Fjipf.168$%(E-Mail Removed)...
> Sounds like the heatsink is not contacting the cpu properly. Did you have
> any problems attaching the heatsink/fan ?
>
> "John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:LvmdnZJR8Id-NzjeRVn-(E-Mail Removed)...
>> Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
>> green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled
>> and almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.
>>
>> I built a lightly loaded system with the following:
>>
>> AMD 4200+ X2
>> Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
>> Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
>> Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
>> 500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
>> 400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
>> 1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed
>>
>> No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.
>>
>> At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating
>> wildly when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading
>> the Yahoo Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a
>> rapid jump from 45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless
>> the program is terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just
>> started using the system, so I have not run that many programs, but
>> several install programs have hung and at this point I would like to
>> troubleshoot the problem. I maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the
>> heat sink which is adjustable and the problem noted above occurs
>> regardless.
>>
>> Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
>> Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
>> thermal grease)?
>> Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
>> Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
>> How should I proceed?
>>
>> I would appreciate any help you can provide.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

In article <LvmdnZJR8Id-NzjeRVn-(E-Mail Removed)>, "John Smith"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
> green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled and
> almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.
>
> I built a lightly loaded system with the following:
>
> AMD 4200+ X2
> Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
> Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
> Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
> 500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
> 400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
> 1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed
>
> No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.
>
> At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating wildly
> when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading the Yahoo
> Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a rapid jump from
> 45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless the program is
> terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just started using the
> system, so I have not run that many programs, but several install programs
> have hung and at this point I would like to troubleshoot the problem. I
> maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the heat sink which is adjustable
> and the problem noted above occurs regardless.
>
> Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
> Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
> thermal grease)?
> Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
> Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
> How should I proceed?
>
> I would appreciate any help you can provide.

I cannot find the thread now, but there were some threads concerning
the performance of X2 duals a while back. Basically, what people
discovered, is one core is a much better overclocker than the other,
which didn't make a lot of sense. In one case, the processor was
barely stable at stock speeds.

Then someone decided to remove the IHS from the top of the processor.
I'm including this thread, as it has a picture of the inside of the
processor. I cannot remember which site did the original investigation
of the uneven performance of duals.

http://www.sharkyforums.com/showthre...9&page=1&pp=15

The other picture I saw of a dissected core, showed a thermal interface
material that was a lot more granular. The theory was, that local
overheating (just a portion of the die) could happen. One guy
went from having a crappy dual core (one core pretty bad), to being
able to run both at 2.7GHz stable, when the IHS was removed.

I would suggest contacting AMD and getting an RMA. 80C sounds like
a pretty big jump, so it could be a problem with that grey stuff.

Paul

Hi John,

I'll bet the heatsink is not sitting perfectly flat on the cpu. I looked at
the page you included and it loolks like it would be very easy to cause a
contact problem.

I use the stock cooler on my 4400+ x2 and I have no overheating at all even
running Doom 3 with everything set on the highest settings.

Ron


"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news(E-Mail Removed)...
>A couple of possibilities:
>
> 1. First the tech I hired to help me to this did not spread the thermal
> grease around enough in my opinion. He simply put 8 or nine small piles on
> the CPU and told me that grease would automatically spread around. I
> thought it was odd, but perhaps this could be a factor.
>
> 2. The workaround was performed correctly, but perhaps this is an issue.
> http://www.zalman.co.kr/product/cool...eluxe_eng.html
>
> "There are some capacitors (circled in red) that interfere with Zalman's
> AMD64 Backplate on the backside of the A8V Deluxe. Zalman recommends
> following procedures for this combination.
>
> 1. Remove the retention frame only, and place our CPU cooler at the center
> of the CPU.
>
> 2. Screw in the original bolts provided with the motherboard, then tighten
> each bolt a few turns at a time while alternating between the two until
> the clearance between the motherboard and the bottom of the clip (or grip)
> is 13.5mm.
>
> (TIP) You can easily check the 13.5mm clearance by placing the "AMD64
> Nipple" provided with CNPS7000A, CNPS7000B, CNPS7700 and ZM-WB2 Gold
> between the motherboard and the bottom of the clip (or grip) as shown
> below."
>
>
>
> "RonK" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:Fjipf.168$%(E-Mail Removed)...
>> Sounds like the heatsink is not contacting the cpu properly. Did you
>> have any problems attaching the heatsink/fan ?

On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 11:23:33 -0800, John Smith wrote:

> A couple of possibilities:
>
> 1. First the tech I hired to help me to this did not spread the thermal
> grease around enough in my opinion. He simply put 8 or nine small piles on
> the CPU and told me that grease would automatically spread around. I thought
> it was odd, but perhaps this could be a factor.
>
Fire your tech. He onviously doesn't know that the core is in the center
of the heat spreader. And if you aren't going to spread it you should put
the grease right in the middle of the cpu. Putting drop around it as he
has may be keeping the hottest part of the cpu from even touching the
cooler and may have created an air pocket there.

> 2. The workaround was performed correctly, but perhaps this is an issue.
> http://www.zalman.co.kr/product/cool...eluxe_eng.html
>
Should I ask why you didn't use then default cooler? From your link, it's
also obvious that there's a problem mounting the Zalman cooler on this
board. And if not installed properly, the cooler could be cocked, not
making good flush contact wityh the cpu. Just something else to check.

> "There are some capacitors (circled in red) that interfere with Zalman's
> AMD64 Backplate on the backside of the A8V Deluxe. Zalman recommends
> following procedures for this combination.
>
> 1. Remove the retention frame only, and place our CPU cooler at the
> center of the CPU.
>
> 2. Screw in the original bolts provided with the motherboard, then
> tighten each bolt a few turns at a time while alternating between the
> two until the clearance between the motherboard and the bottom of the
> clip (or grip) is 13.5mm.
>
> (TIP) You can easily check the 13.5mm clearance by placing the "AMD64
> Nipple" provided with CNPS7000A, CNPS7000B, CNPS7700 and ZM-WB2 Gold
> between the motherboard and the bottom of the clip (or grip) as shown
> below."
>
Hmmmmm.... I don't like it. I suspect the cooler just isn't mounted
properly.

--
KT133 MB, CPU @2400MHz (24x100): SIS755 MB CPU @2330MHz (10x233)
Need good help? Provide all system info with question.
My server http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
Verizon server http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

"John Smith" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:LvmdnZJR8Id-NzjeRVn-(E-Mail Removed)...
> Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
> green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled and
> almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.
>
> I built a lightly loaded system with the following:
>
> AMD 4200+ X2
> Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
> Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
> Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
> 500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
> 400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
> 1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed
>
> No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.
>
> At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating
> wildly when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading
> the Yahoo Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a
> rapid jump from 45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless
> the program is terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just
> started using the system, so I have not run that many programs, but
> several install programs have hung and at this point I would like to
> troubleshoot the problem. I maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the
> heat sink which is adjustable and the problem noted above occurs
> regardless.
>
> Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
> Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
> thermal grease)?
> Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
> Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
> How should I proceed?
>
> I would appreciate any help you can provide.
>

Did you follow the manufacturer's instruction for applying the thermal
paste? What product did you use. More problems occur when too much thermal
paste is used rather than too little, but obviously we can't tell from here
what happened.

Thanks for your reply Wes.

It doesn't sound like you think the AMD is defective and/or damaged. Right?
Because it runs fine unless you start doing activities which push its
buttons so to speak. If it was you, would you return it to AMD or proceed as
noted below?

Clearly, in retrospect, it would have been better to go w/a different
cooler. So the questionhere is whether to remount the cooler again or to
simply put the stock cooler on there and enable cool and quiet in the bios?
What's your vote? My issue w/the AMD cooler was that it was apt to be noisy
and I am trying to build a quiet machine.

I assume this will require the motherboard to be dismounted. Or not?

Why is it that loading a program like the Yahoo Music Engine or plugging in
an external drive causes the temp to spike when regular web browsing and
word processing don't seem to make any difference. Probably a rhetorical ?,
but curious.



"Wes Newell" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
newsejpf.4983$7f3.1027@trnddc01...
> On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 11:23:33 -0800, John Smith wrote:
>
>> A couple of possibilities:
>>
>> 1. First the tech I hired to help me to this did not spread the thermal
>> grease around enough in my opinion. He simply put 8 or nine small piles
>> on
>> the CPU and told me that grease would automatically spread around. I
>> thought
>> it was odd, but perhaps this could be a factor.
>>
> Fire your tech. He onviously doesn't know that the core is in the center
> of the heat spreader. And if you aren't going to spread it you should put
> the grease right in the middle of the cpu. Putting drop around it as he
> has may be keeping the hottest part of the cpu from even touching the
> cooler and may have created an air pocket there.
>
>> 2. The workaround was performed correctly, but perhaps this is an issue.
>> http://www.zalman.co.kr/product/cool...eluxe_eng.html
>>
> Should I ask why you didn't use then default cooler? From your link, it's
> also obvious that there's a problem mounting the Zalman cooler on this
> board. And if not installed properly, the cooler could be cocked, not
> making good flush contact wityh the cpu. Just something else to check.
>
>> "There are some capacitors (circled in red) that interfere with Zalman's
>> AMD64 Backplate on the backside of the A8V Deluxe. Zalman recommends
>> following procedures for this combination.
>>
>> 1. Remove the retention frame only, and place our CPU cooler at the
>> center of the CPU.
>>
>> 2. Screw in the original bolts provided with the motherboard, then
>> tighten each bolt a few turns at a time while alternating between the
>> two until the clearance between the motherboard and the bottom of the
>> clip (or grip) is 13.5mm.
>>
>> (TIP) You can easily check the 13.5mm clearance by placing the "AMD64
>> Nipple" provided with CNPS7000A, CNPS7000B, CNPS7700 and ZM-WB2 Gold
>> between the motherboard and the bottom of the clip (or grip) as shown
>> below."
>>
> Hmmmmm.... I don't like it. I suspect the cooler just isn't mounted
> properly.
>
> --
> KT133 MB, CPU @2400MHz (24x100): SIS755 MB CPU @2330MHz (10x233)
> Need good help? Provide all system info with question.
> My server http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php
> Verizon server http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm
>

Paul,

I am not sure I follow you: "I would suggest contacting AMD and getting an
RMA. 80C sounds like
a pretty big jump, so it could be a problem with that grey stuff."

If the themal grease and cooler mounting is a problem, why get an RMA? This
tech used his own thermal grease, not what came w/the cooler.


"Paul" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:nospam-1812051446060001@192.168.1.178...
> In article <LvmdnZJR8Id-NzjeRVn-(E-Mail Removed)>, "John Smith"
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> Note: The Boxed Retail AMD processor looked OK from the outside, but the
>> green packing material housing the fan and heat sink was badly mangled
>> and
>> almost disintegrated. The CPU itself was secure in it plastic cover.
>>
>> I built a lightly loaded system with the following:
>>
>> AMD 4200+ X2
>> Asus A8V Deluxe Motherboard
>> Antec P180 case w/3 case fans
>> Zalman 7700 Fan/Heatsink
>> 500 Watt Power Supply (Xion)
>> 400 mb WD 7200 rpm drive
>> 1 mb of DDR ram running at standard speed
>>
>> No overclocking at all, Matrox video card.
>>
>> At idle w/nothing going on the CPU is at 45c. The CPU is overheating
>> wildly
>> when certain CPU intensive programs start to run. Simply loading the
>> Yahoo
>> Music engine causes the Asus temperature probe to register a rapid jump
>> from
>> 45c to 80c - it is a hockey stick like curve and unless the program is
>> terminated, it will cause the PC to shut off. I just started using the
>> system, so I have not run that many programs, but several install
>> programs
>> have hung and at this point I would like to troubleshoot the problem. I
>> maxed out the speed on the Zalman fan on the heat sink which is
>> adjustable
>> and the problem noted above occurs regardless.
>>
>> Do I have a bad CPU? Is is possible it was damaged in transit?
>> Is there a possible issue w/the mounting of the heat sink (not enough
>> thermal grease)?
>> Is there an issue w/the motherboard?
>> Is there an issue /w voltage or memory?
>> How should I proceed?
>>
>> I would appreciate any help you can provide.
>
> I cannot find the thread now, but there were some threads concerning
> the performance of X2 duals a while back. Basically, what people
> discovered, is one core is a much better overclocker than the other,
> which didn't make a lot of sense. In one case, the processor was
> barely stable at stock speeds.
>
> Then someone decided to remove the IHS from the top of the processor.
> I'm including this thread, as it has a picture of the inside of the
> processor. I cannot remember which site did the original investigation
> of the uneven performance of duals.
>
> http://www.sharkyforums.com/showthre...9&page=1&pp=15
>
> The other picture I saw of a dissected core, showed a thermal interface
> material that was a lot more granular. The theory was, that local
> overheating (just a portion of the die) could happen. One guy
> went from having a crappy dual core (one core pretty bad), to being
> able to run both at 2.7GHz stable, when the IHS was removed.
>
> I would suggest contacting AMD and getting an RMA. 80C sounds like
> a pretty big jump, so it could be a problem with that grey stuff.
>
> Paul