I've read hundreds of posts regarding these mysterious black screens
that pop up from time to time on only SOME major OEM computers. I'm in
the PC repair business. After about the tenth case of these errors I've

seen/repaired over the past 4 years, I've come to the following
conclusions:

1) The errors regarding the "hive" could mean any of the following, but

do not necessarily mean any of the following:
- The system has simply "glitched". A reformat/reinstallation of
Windows will fix the problem indefinitely.
- The system has a "bad" or "failing" hard drive. Note, you probably
won't be able to test the HDD as bad. The problem will just
miraculously go away when you replace the cheap azz zero warranty dell
issued drive with a real one.
- The system is "bad" (mainboard?). No matter what you do, the !@@#$$
error will just pop up again.
2) Refer to #1. As none of the issues are necessarily true AND the
issue ONLY seems occur with any prevalence on cheap major OEM machine
OR really poorly built PC's ... I have no choice but to call this a big

covered up manufacturer defect. The question is, who is the real
culprit? Dell/Compaq/Emachine/<insert sh*tty OEM here> or MS or both?!
Any educated opinion or "inside" info would be greatly appreciated.
These errors SURE have caused me some major headaches for which
Excedrin won't solve.

Howdy,
As a PC repair person, I know EXACTLY what you mean! I am not in the
"business" but I have read a LOT of text books. And, I have helped out
a L-O-T of family, friends, family friends, friends familys etc... I am
sure you know how it can escilate when in the begining all you wanted
was to help out the family member...

Anyway, this is how I have delt with the problem and it seems to have
worked for me:
The drive or drives in question I hit with the program called "kill
disk". It wipes it ALL OUT & FIXES ANY SECTORS. You can also run it a
number of cycles.
THEN - I re-install the OEM software, 1 proggie @ a time. And here you
really have to take your time and let the system run day & night for a
couple after the OS to watch for the problem to pop up again before
continuing. If it does, FORGET IT & GO WITH A NEW DRIVE. if not, youre
go to go ahead & put the rest of the software on the system.

Anyway, this has always worked for me.
Cindy



(E-Mail Removed) Wrote:
> I've read hundreds of posts regarding these mysterious black screens
> that pop up from time to time on only SOME major OEM computers. I'm in
> the PC repair business. After about the tenth case of these errors
> I've
>
> seen/repaired over the past 4 years, I've come to the following
> conclusions:
>
> 1) The errors regarding the "hive" could mean any of the following,
> but
>
> do not necessarily mean any of the following:
> - The system has simply "glitched". A reformat/reinstallation of
> Windows will fix the problem indefinitely.
> - The system has a "bad" or "failing" hard drive. Note, you probably
> won't be able to test the HDD as bad. The problem will just
> miraculously go away when you replace the cheap azz zero warranty dell
> issued drive with a real one.
> - The system is "bad" (mainboard?). No matter what you do, the !@@#$$
> error will just pop up again.
> 2) Refer to #1. As none of the issues are necessarily true AND the
> issue ONLY seems occur with any prevalence on cheap major OEM machine
> OR really poorly built PC's ... I have no choice but to call this a
> big
>
> covered up manufacturer defect. The question is, who is the real
> culprit? Dell/Compaq/Emachine/insert sh*tty OEM here or MS or both?!
> Any educated opinion or "inside" info would be greatly appreciated.
> These errors SURE have caused me some major headaches for which
> Excedrin won't solve.


--
cindy.bell

Thanks for the reply, but as stated I proven that it can be "beyond"
the hard drive. As such, it's an impossible problem to diagnose or
"fix". You can replace the HDD, and that MAY fix it for an indefinite
amount of time ... but it could still break again. Just replaced the
HDD on a Dell. Ran fine for two weeks. Then, the customer said it was
booting slowly, followed by no boot and the black screen AGAIN. Sorry,
but I don't think this many 5 year warranty Seagate HDD would happen to
be bad and happen to come up with the same error AND just happen to do
so ONLY on machines that previously had the same problem.

I'm beginning to think ALL cases of this error are mainboard problems.
Why? Simple. The HDD never really tests "bad". In other words, if you
can't somehow determine the HDD is bad and you reformat and the error
pops up again ... it must be a mainboard problem. The black screen
itself doesn't mean the HDD is bad. In fact, it doesn't really
"officially" mean anything at all. That's why I'm still calling this
one a coverup. ONE thing is for sure, I've still not seen this problem
pop up at all with custom built machines with NAME BRAND WARRANTIED
mainboards.

(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
> I've read hundreds of posts regarding these mysterious black screens
> that pop up from time to time on only SOME major OEM computers. I'm in
> the PC repair business. After about the tenth case of these errors I've
>
> seen/repaired over the past 4 years, I've come to the following
> conclusions:
>
> 1) The errors regarding the "hive" could mean any of the following, but
>
> do not necessarily mean any of the following:
> - The system has simply "glitched". A reformat/reinstallation of
> Windows will fix the problem indefinitely.
> - The system has a "bad" or "failing" hard drive. Note, you probably
> won't be able to test the HDD as bad. The problem will just
> miraculously go away when you replace the cheap azz zero warranty dell
> issued drive with a real one.
> - The system is "bad" (mainboard?). No matter what you do, the !@@#$$
> error will just pop up again.
> 2) Refer to #1. As none of the issues are necessarily true AND the
> issue ONLY seems occur with any prevalence on cheap major OEM machine
> OR really poorly built PC's ... I have no choice but to call this a big
>
> covered up manufacturer defect. The question is, who is the real
> culprit? Dell/Compaq/Emachine/<insert sh*tty OEM here> or MS or both?!
> Any educated opinion or "inside" info would be greatly appreciated.
> These errors SURE have caused me some major headaches for which
> Excedrin won't solve.
>

Have you tried installing a name brand power supply in one of these
computers to see if the problem goes away? I know that the power supply
in some of these is the smallest that can work at all and maybe it is
not enough for the computer. In some of these you can not use an after
market power supply because it won't fit, but if you can use a better
supply it may be worth it.

I have to agree with you on this one...after going through all that yo
have and coming up with the exact same error on the same machines ove
and over... It does smell a bit foul... Have you posted your finding
on Dells boards as well? What was their response? Did you ask the
for a program to test their MOBO's? or after so many documented cases
replace them for the customers?
Cindy

(E-Mail Removed) Wrote:
> Thanks for the reply, but as stated I proven that it can be "beyond"
> the hard drive. As such, it's an impossible problem to diagnose or
> "fix". You can replace the HDD, and that MAY fix it for an indefinite
> amount of time ... but it could still break again. Just replaced the
> HDD on a Dell. Ran fine for two weeks. Then, the customer said it was
> booting slowly, followed by no boot and the black screen AGAIN. Sorry,
> but I don't think this many 5 year warranty Seagate HDD would happe
> to
> be bad and happen to come up with the same error AND just happen to do
> so ONLY on machines that previously had the same problem.
>
> I'm beginning to think ALL cases of this error are mainboard problems.
> Why? Simple. The HDD never really tests "bad". In other words, if you
> can't somehow determine the HDD is bad and you reformat and the error
> pops up again ... it must be a mainboard problem. The black screen
> itself doesn't mean the HDD is bad. In fact, it doesn't really
> "officially" mean anything at all. That's why I'm still calling this
> one a coverup. ONE thing is for sure, I've still not seen this problem
> pop up at all with custom built machines with NAME BRAND WARRANTIED
> mainboards

--
cindy.bell

>>I've read hundreds of posts regarding these mysterious black screens
>>that pop up from time to time on only SOME major OEM computers. I'm in
>>the PC repair business. After about the tenth case of these errors I've
>>seen/repaired over the past 4 years, I've come to the following
>>conclusions:
>>
>>1) The errors regarding the "hive" could mean any of the following, but
>> do not necessarily mean any of the following:
>>- The system has simply "glitched". A reformat/reinstallation of
>>Windows will fix the problem indefinitely.
>>- The system has a "bad" or "failing" hard drive. Note, you probably
>>won't be able to test the HDD as bad. The problem will just
>>miraculously go away when you replace the cheap azz zero warranty dell
>>issued drive with a real one.
>>- The system is "bad" (mainboard?). No matter what you do, the !@@#$$
>>error will just pop up again.
>>2) Refer to #1. As none of the issues are necessarily true AND the
>>issue ONLY seems occur with any prevalence on cheap major OEM machine
>>OR really poorly built PC's ... I have no choice but to call this a big
>>covered up manufacturer defect. The question is, who is the real
>>culprit? Dell/Compaq/Emachine/<insert sh*tty OEM here> or MS or both?!
>>Any educated opinion or "inside" info would be greatly appreciated.
>>These errors SURE have caused me some major headaches for which
>>Excedrin won't solve.

> Have you tried installing a name brand power supply in one of these
> computers to see if the problem goes away? I know that the power supply
> in some of these is the smallest that can work at all and maybe it is
> not enough for the computer. In some of these you can not use an after
> market power supply because it won't fit, but if you can use a better
> supply it may be worth it.

If the original author's reference is essentially referring to the "missing
SYSTEM" error, then perhaps experience here may shed a light...

This is a good quality, custom built unit with no power supply inadequacy.
When XP was first loaded - over well-functioning '98 O/S, and without any
hardware changes - that error was encountered intermittently. After
considerable sleuthing, it was found that replacing the existing 256Mb RAM
chip (which checked good) with a single 512 solved the SYSTEM error, and
other strange behavior - permanently. Since that time, XP has not crashed.

Apparently XP is sensitive to RAM timing (or other unknown factor). This
was loosely confirmed in a discussion with an upper level Microsoft tech,
who had been researching the issue, though no definitive statement was made.
There certainly may be other issues, but as the problem has been reported
on many PCs through the years, one must conclude that they cannot be all
low-end OEM or Dells. Here is some remedial info. Parts of it may be dated.
===========================================================

Try a boot into Safe Mode, by hitting F8 just before the "Starting
Windows" screen would appear (takes a bit of practice).
Choose LAST GOOD.

If that does nothing, use a working PC to read this first...
http://support.microsoft.com/default...;en-us;q823614
http://www.kellys-korner-xp.com/xp_sys32.htm

Related info is here...
http://support.microsoft.com/default...;en-us;q307545
describes a three-step process to extract a copy of the registry
from the System Restore SVI folder.

Info on dealing with corruption issues...
http://support.microsoft.com/default...b;en-us;822705

Reinstall/repair tutorials (if needed) are here...
http://WWW.WEBTREE.CA/windowsxp/
http://michaelstevenstech.com

After your system is restored, the ERUNT utility available here may
make it easier to fix the problem if it recurs...
http://HOME.T-ONLINE.DE/home/lars.hederer/erunt

--
For most XP answers and tweaks...
http://www.kellys-korner-xp.com/xp_abc.htm
http://dougknox.com http://aumha.org
http://support.microsoft.com http://www.winhelponline.com/