Hello,

I've seen a few articles that touch on this subject, but I wanted to
get an answer to a bit of a different twist perhaps.

I have the following equipment that I am using - Canon Canoscan 3000F,
Canon i960 printer, WinXP system and both a Canon EOS Elan II film and
a Canon S80 digital camera.

When I print photos from my digital camera the colour reproduction of
what I see on screen (both the LCD of the camera and my computer's CRT
monitor (Viewsonic 17PS)) is excellent. I would not change a thing to
be honest.

The problem is when I scan prints from my film camera. The colour
balance is shifted dramatically to the red/magenta wihch becomes even
more visible when I print it. The issue at hand is that I really do
not want to calibrate my printer or monitor at all because the combo
for digital photography is working great. I therefore want to find a
way to specifically calibrate what my scanner is inputing. I've tried
manipulating the scanned image after the fact using Corel
Photopaint/Adobe Photoshop but it is very difficult to manipulate it to
be just right (although I am going to try this with an actual scanner
target as it may be easier to do the balancing act).

Any input or advice would be extremely welcome.

Thanks in advance...

On 28 Aug 2006 17:05:29 -0700, (E-Mail Removed) wrote:

>Hello,
>
>I've seen a few articles that touch on this subject, but I wanted to
>get an answer to a bit of a different twist perhaps.
>
>I have the following equipment that I am using - Canon Canoscan 3000F,
>Canon i960 printer, WinXP system and both a Canon EOS Elan II film and
>a Canon S80 digital camera.
>
>When I print photos from my digital camera the colour reproduction of
>what I see on screen (both the LCD of the camera and my computer's CRT
>monitor (Viewsonic 17PS)) is excellent. I would not change a thing to
>be honest.
>
>The problem is when I scan prints from my film camera. The colour
>balance is shifted dramatically to the red/magenta wihch becomes even
>more visible when I print it. The issue at hand is that I really do
>not want to calibrate my printer or monitor at all because the combo
>for digital photography is working great. I therefore want to find a
>way to specifically calibrate what my scanner is inputing. I've tried
>manipulating the scanned image after the fact using Corel
>Photopaint/Adobe Photoshop but it is very difficult to manipulate it to
>be just right (although I am going to try this with an actual scanner
>target as it may be easier to do the balancing act).
>
>Any input or advice would be extremely welcome.
>
>Thanks in advance...


Barring any pathological issues with your scanner, you can
generate an ICC profile for it with Profile Prism. Last time I
checked it was selling for around $70.

www.ddisoftware.com

Not saying this is the answer to your situation -- there could
be all kinds of things going on -- but it's one option.

If it's a cheap or old scanner, it's probably not worth the
bother. I've owned many scanners (both film and flatbed)
and never bothered to profile any of them.


rafe b
www.terrapinphoto.com

Thanks for this - I'll check out Profile Prism.

BTW - in case I decide replacing the scanner is my best option - any
recommendations for a device that seems to have good colour fidelity?

Many thanks.


Raphael Bustin wrote:
> On 28 Aug 2006 17:05:29 -0700, (E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>
> >Hello,
> >
> >I've seen a few articles that touch on this subject, but I wanted to
> >get an answer to a bit of a different twist perhaps.
> >
> >I have the following equipment that I am using - Canon Canoscan 3000F,
> >Canon i960 printer, WinXP system and both a Canon EOS Elan II film and
> >a Canon S80 digital camera.
> >
> >When I print photos from my digital camera the colour reproduction of
> >what I see on screen (both the LCD of the camera and my computer's CRT
> >monitor (Viewsonic 17PS)) is excellent. I would not change a thing to
> >be honest.
> >
> >The problem is when I scan prints from my film camera. The colour
> >balance is shifted dramatically to the red/magenta wihch becomes even
> >more visible when I print it. The issue at hand is that I really do
> >not want to calibrate my printer or monitor at all because the combo
> >for digital photography is working great. I therefore want to find a
> >way to specifically calibrate what my scanner is inputing. I've tried
> >manipulating the scanned image after the fact using Corel
> >Photopaint/Adobe Photoshop but it is very difficult to manipulate it to
> >be just right (although I am going to try this with an actual scanner
> >target as it may be easier to do the balancing act).
> >
> >Any input or advice would be extremely welcome.
> >
> >Thanks in advance...
>
>
> Barring any pathological issues with your scanner, you can
> generate an ICC profile for it with Profile Prism. Last time I
> checked it was selling for around $70.
>
> www.ddisoftware.com
>
> Not saying this is the answer to your situation -- there could
> be all kinds of things going on -- but it's one option.
>
> If it's a cheap or old scanner, it's probably not worth the
> bother. I've owned many scanners (both film and flatbed)
> and never bothered to profile any of them.
>
>
> rafe b
> www.terrapinphoto.com

You have some misconceptions about what constitutes calibration.
It is really only accidental that you are achieving prints that match your
monitor unless you calibrate the monitor and use color management properly
in a color managed imaging program like Elements/Photoshop.
It is most likely your workflow and not the scanner that is at fault.
The red shift you are describing is common when, whether you realize it, or
as in this case do not realize it, your scanning and printing programs are
applying some form of color management more than once.
Unless you take control of the situation your problems may worsen.
It is more difficult to learn to do things properly than to walk into Best
Buy and plunk down your credit card, but the world is full of choices.

Thanks (I think) since you do not actually offer any suggestions as to
how to help out.

Actually you are correct that I was simply lucky - because when I
started trying to figure out how to calibrate my scanner I checked the
calibration of the monitor and printer using WiziWYG from Praxisoft and
other than some corrections to the gamma (being an older monitor it was
set at around 2.4) I did not have to change much at all. But that
still does not fix my problem about the redshift I am getting from my
scanner. Clearly images imported from my digital camera (actually
either of my digital cameras - my older Fuji and my newer Canon) look
very good (maybe not perfect but very good) and print out with high
fidelity. Scanned images however are very redshifted.

If it is common as you say then a) what causes it and b) how do I fix
it. Your comment about it being more difficult to learn how to do
things properly vs going to BestBuy is both unnecessary and unhelpful -
I would not be writing to this forum if I were not looking how to do
things properly.


bmoag wrote:
> You have some misconceptions about what constitutes calibration.
> It is really only accidental that you are achieving prints that match your
> monitor unless you calibrate the monitor and use color management properly
> in a color managed imaging program like Elements/Photoshop.
> It is most likely your workflow and not the scanner that is at fault.
> The red shift you are describing is common when, whether you realize it, or
> as in this case do not realize it, your scanning and printing programs are
> applying some form of color management more than once.
> Unless you take control of the situation your problems may worsen.
> It is more difficult to learn to do things properly than to walk into Best
> Buy and plunk down your credit card, but the world is full of choices.

"bmoag" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:uDQIg.4519$(E-Mail Removed)...
> You have some misconceptions about what constitutes calibration.
> It is really only accidental that you are achieving prints that match your
> monitor unless you calibrate the monitor and use color management properly
> in a color managed imaging program like Elements/Photoshop.
> It is most likely your workflow and not the scanner that is at fault.
> The red shift you are describing is common when, whether you realize it,
> or as in this case do not realize it, your scanning and printing programs
> are applying some form of color management more than once.
> Unless you take control of the situation your problems may worsen.
> It is more difficult to learn to do things properly than to walk into Best
> Buy and plunk down your credit card, but the world is full of choices.


Even so -- the fact that the OP's process is working --
for digicam images -- suggests that he may be doing some
things right. Perhaps some careful experimentation is in
order -- but it doesn't sound to me like there's a problem
in the image-editor-to-printer part of the process.

I'm not a big believer in scanner calibration or profiling,
and have never felt a need to do that. OTOH, the rest of
my system is color managed.

OP asked about "scanner color fidelity" and I honestly
don't have much to say about that. It's never been a
real problem for me. But since most of what I scan are
color negatives, it's hard to speak of "color fidelity" at
that stage of the process.


rafe b
www.terrapinphoto.com