I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and am
trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things particularly
from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my supplier with myself as
the one Admin User .
However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that even as a
stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User Account for everyday
use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I find it
very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends quite a bit of
time using the computer for a variety of things .
As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs that do
not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I switch to the
Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep ask me Register the
Software which I already have when installed , the Quicken finance program
tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I have to switch back to use that . I
now realize too that My CA Antivirus cannot Update from the Limited User
Account .
If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need to set
up OE again for mail and newsgroups .

To stop rambling further my Question is mainly -what is the difference
between me just using the Admin account which allows me to do everything at
the same time and the way I successfully operated as a single user on Win 98
for 7 years appears . Is XP more insecure , I would have thought the reverse
.. I may have been fortunate but during my use of Win 98 I never had any
Virus Infections nor have I encountered Spyware for which I regularly check
using a number of the well know Tools . Not to say that it cannot happen I
realize that but I try to be pretty careful .

I am tempted to go back to using just the Admin account but perhaps there is
something I have missed in all this that could help make the Limited User
Account more usable .
I would appreciate any advice from experienced XP users .

GSD

Apart from the main default admin account, set up one for day to day use
with admin privileges.
If you set a password REMEMBER it/them (It is not neccessary to set a
password on the user day to day account)

"GSD" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and am
> trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things particularly
> from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my supplier with myself
as
> the one Admin User .
> However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that even as
a
> stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User Account for everyday
> use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
> To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I find it
> very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends quite a bit
of
> time using the computer for a variety of things .
> As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs that do
> not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I switch to the
> Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep ask me Register the
> Software which I already have when installed , the Quicken finance program
> tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I have to switch back to use that .
I
> now realize too that My CA Antivirus cannot Update from the Limited User
> Account .
> If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need to set
> up OE again for mail and newsgroups .
>
> To stop rambling further my Question is mainly -what is the difference
> between me just using the Admin account which allows me to do everything
at
> the same time and the way I successfully operated as a single user on Win
98
> for 7 years appears . Is XP more insecure , I would have thought the
reverse
> . I may have been fortunate but during my use of Win 98 I never had any
> Virus Infections nor have I encountered Spyware for which I regularly
check
> using a number of the well know Tools . Not to say that it cannot happen I
> realize that but I try to be pretty careful .
>
> I am tempted to go back to using just the Admin account but perhaps there
is
> something I have missed in all this that could help make the Limited User
> Account more usable .
> I would appreciate any advice from experienced XP users .
>
> GSD
>
>

If you are the only person who has regular access to your computer, running
it using the Admin Account is not going to cause you any problems. In fact,
on many computers I've worked on, running multiple accounts (especially when
you have kids sharing the system) is the cause of a lot of grief.

As long as you have a good firewall, good adware and good antivirus program
you should be well protected. I'd also recommend that you turn off (yes, I
know lots of MVPs will disagree) Windows Update. There are plenty of places
to go and manually download needed updates and patches. Install the latest
Cumulative Security update for Internet Explorer, and stay away (at least
until all the bugs are found) from Internet Explorer 7. Be aware that if you
have Windows Update turned on, you may get IE7 whether you want it or not.

I haven't had a virus or any kind of ad/spyware for years.



"GSD" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and am
> trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things particularly
> from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my supplier with myself
as
> the one Admin User .
> However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that even as
a
> stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User Account for everyday
> use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
> To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I find it
> very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends quite a bit
of
> time using the computer for a variety of things .
> As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs that do
> not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I switch to the
> Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep ask me Register the
> Software which I already have when installed , the Quicken finance program
> tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I have to switch back to use that .
I
> now realize too that My CA Antivirus cannot Update from the Limited User
> Account .
> If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need to set
> up OE again for mail and newsgroups .
>
> To stop rambling further my Question is mainly -what is the difference
> between me just using the Admin account which allows me to do everything
at
> the same time and the way I successfully operated as a single user on Win
98
> for 7 years appears . Is XP more insecure , I would have thought the
reverse
> . I may have been fortunate but during my use of Win 98 I never had any
> Virus Infections nor have I encountered Spyware for which I regularly
check
> using a number of the well know Tools . Not to say that it cannot happen I
> realize that but I try to be pretty careful .
>
> I am tempted to go back to using just the Admin account but perhaps there
is
> something I have missed in all this that could help make the Limited User
> Account more usable .
> I would appreciate any advice from experienced XP users .
>
> GSD
>
>

"DL" <address@invalid> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Apart from the main default admin account, set up one for day to day use
> with admin privileges.
> If you set a password REMEMBER it/them (It is not neccessary to set a
> password on the user day to day account)
--------------------------->
>> I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and am
>> trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things
>> particularly
>> from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my supplier with myself
> as
>> the one Admin User .
>> However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that even
>> as
> a
>> stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User Account for everyday
>> use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
>> To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I find
>> it
>> very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends quite a bit
> of
>> time using the computer for a variety of things .
>> As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs that do
>> not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I switch to
>> the
>> Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep ask me Register
>> the
>> Software which I already have when installed , the Quicken finance
>> program
>> tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I have to switch back to use that
>> .
> I
>> now realize too that My CA Antivirus cannot Update from the Limited User
>> Account .
>> If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need to
>> set
>> up OE again for mail and newsgroups .
>>
>> To stop rambling further my Question is mainly -what is the difference
>> between me just using the Admin account which allows me to do everything
> at
>> the same time and the way I successfully operated as a single user on Win
> 98
>> for 7 years appears . Is XP more insecure , I would have thought the
> reverse
>> . I may have been fortunate but during my use of Win 98 I never had any
>> Virus Infections nor have I encountered Spyware for which I regularly
> check
>> using a number of the well know Tools . Not to say that it cannot happen
>> I
>> realize that but I try to be pretty careful .
>>
>> I am tempted to go back to using just the Admin account but perhaps there
> is
>> something I have missed in all this that could help make the Limited User
>> Account more usable .
>> I would appreciate any advice from experienced XP users .
>>
Thanks for the comments . I am not sure though what would be the purpose of
making the second account Admin .? I would have thought I may as well stick
to the one I already have set up under my Name .
GSD

Running as a limited user is far more secure than running as an
administrator. Most other modern OS' are normally run as a standard or
limited user. This is the main reason they are more secure than Windows XP.
Unfortunately with XP this is almost impossible for most people. It requires
a high level of skill to set things up so this will work. It's hard to know
where to place the blame for this. I believe it's a combination of things.
Many programmers started programming in DOS based versions of Windows where
all users were equal and could do anything. They never learned how to
program for security because there was no security in the OS. Microsoft
never really encouraged programmers to write programs that would work when
run as a standard user. Indeed as you have noticed many Microsoft programs
don't work unless the user is an administrator. Microsoft has seen the light
with Vista and is starting to enforce better programming.

With XP you are probably stuck running as an administrator. Make sure you
have antivirus, antispyware, and firewall programs running.

If you do want to run as a standard user then you will have to keep
switching the account back and forth between standard and administrator.
Create a second administrator account. Use this account for installing new
programs and maintenance tasks. If you install a program with the
administrator account and then have problems with the standard account you
can temporarily set the standard account as an administrator, then run the
program and let it update whatever settings it needs. Once this is done
switch the account back to a standard account. This will get most programs
running. Those that don't complain to the developer. It's sloppy programming
on their part that is the problem, not XP itself. If programs are written
properly they need administrator status for installation only.

--
Kerry
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
www.vistahelp.ca



GSD wrote:
> I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and
> am trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things
> particularly from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my
> supplier with myself as the one Admin User .
> However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that
> even as a stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User
> Account for everyday use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
> To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I
> find it very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends
> quite a bit of time using the computer for a variety of things .
> As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs
> that do not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I
> switch to the Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep
> ask me Register the Software which I already have when installed ,
> the Quicken finance program tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I
> have to switch back to use that . I now realize too that My CA
> Antivirus cannot Update from the Limited User Account .
> If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need
> to set up OE again for mail and newsgroups .
>
> To stop rambling further my Question is mainly -what is the
> difference between me just using the Admin account which allows me to
> do everything at the same time and the way I successfully operated as
> a single user on Win 98 for 7 years appears . Is XP more insecure , I
> would have thought the reverse . I may have been fortunate but during
> my use of Win 98 I never had any Virus Infections nor have I
> encountered Spyware for which I regularly check using a number of the
> well know Tools . Not to say that it cannot happen I realize that but
> I try to be pretty careful .
> I am tempted to go back to using just the Admin account but perhaps
> there is something I have missed in all this that could help make the
> Limited User Account more usable .
> I would appreciate any advice from experienced XP users .
>
> GSD

GSD

From the sound of things you describe, it would seem that not all the
concepts of Windows multiple users has become clear to you yet.

First, don't give up!!!

Just to be clear, each user has their own desktop. So, any time you have
a multiple user machine, each user would set up their desktops to suit
themselves. You might find it easier to become accustom to XP if you
switch your desktop to "Windows Classic", (right-click the background
portion of your desktop and choose the "Desktop" tab.... you'll see what
I mean there.).

Accounts (that's what users are called) with administrator authority and
those without have equal access to programs and data. However, there
are programs that require administrator authority to be executed. For
example, Windows Installer requires administrator authority. You should
not have any trouble running application programs, such as Word,
Outlook Express or Internet Explorer. If you're having difficulties there,
it's not due to the authority level of the user account.

Your administrator account should have a password, but there's no
reason the general user, being yourself, would require one. You must
remember that any tasks that you run as "Scheduled Tasks" would
necessarily run under the authority of the administrator account, as such
tasks MUST include the authoritative password, for example: Tasks like
automatic LiveUpdate for Norton Antivirus, backup jobs and the like.

I'll stop at this point and await a reply, lest I go on and on when what
I've already offered gave rise to more questions than I already might
have answered.

Bill
California - USA




"GSD" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and am
>trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things particularly
>from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my supplier with myself
>as the one Admin User .
> However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that even as
> a stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User Account for
> everyday use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
> To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I find it
> very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends quite a bit
> of time using the computer for a variety of things .
> As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs that do
> not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I switch to the
> Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep ask me Register the
> Software which I already have when installed , the Quicken finance program
> tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I have to switch back to use that .
> I now realize too that My CA Antivirus cannot Update from the Limited
> User Account .
> If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need to set
> up OE again for mail and newsgroups .
>
> To stop rambling further my Question is mainly -what is the difference
> between me just using the Admin account which allows me to do everything
> at the same time and the way I successfully operated as a single user on
> Win 98 for 7 years appears . Is XP more insecure , I would have thought
> the reverse . I may have been fortunate but during my use of Win 98 I
> never had any Virus Infections nor have I encountered Spyware for which I
> regularly check using a number of the well know Tools . Not to say that it
> cannot happen I realize that but I try to be pretty careful .
>
> I am tempted to go back to using just the Admin account but perhaps there
> is something I have missed in all this that could help make the Limited
> User Account more usable .
> I would appreciate any advice from experienced XP users .
>
> GSD
>

"darkrats" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> If you are the only person who has regular access to your computer,
> running
> it using the Admin Account is not going to cause you any problems. In
> fact,
> on many computers I've worked on, running multiple accounts (especially
> when
> you have kids sharing the system) is the cause of a lot of grief.
>
> As long as you have a good firewall, good adware and good antivirus
> program
> you should be well protected. I'd also recommend that you turn off (yes, I
> know lots of MVPs will disagree) Windows Update. There are plenty of
> places
> to go and manually download needed updates and patches. Install the latest
> Cumulative Security update for Internet Explorer, and stay away (at least
> until all the bugs are found) from Internet Explorer 7. Be aware that if
> you
> have Windows Update turned on, you may get IE7 whether you want it or not.
>
> I haven't had a virus or any kind of ad/spyware for years.
>
>
>
>
Thanks, Yes I always run with Anti Virus , firewall and have a few Anti spy
programs and this why I cannot quite understand why running this way is any
more secure than the way I ran Win 98 . Just as an aside I have actually
downloaded and successfully installed IE7 I rather like it . A lot of the
time though I use Opera or Firefox for general browsing .

GSD

"Kerry Brown" <(E-Mail Removed)*a*m> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Running as a limited user is far more secure than running as an
> administrator. Most other modern OS' are normally run as a standard or
> limited user. This is the main reason they are more secure than Windows
> XP. Unfortunately with XP this is almost impossible for most people. It
> requires a high level of skill to set things up so this will work. It's
> hard to know where to place the blame for this. I believe it's a
> combination of things. Many programmers started programming in DOS based
> versions of Windows where all users were equal and could do anything. They
> never learned how to program for security because there was no security in
> the OS. Microsoft never really encouraged programmers to write programs
> that would work when run as a standard user. Indeed as you have noticed
> many Microsoft programs don't work unless the user is an administrator.
> Microsoft has seen the light with Vista and is starting to enforce better
> programming.
>
> With XP you are probably stuck running as an administrator. Make sure you
> have antivirus, antispyware, and firewall programs running.
>
> If you do want to run as a standard user then you will have to keep
> switching the account back and forth between standard and administrator.
> Create a second administrator account. Use this account for installing new
> programs and maintenance tasks. If you install a program with the
> administrator account and then have problems with the standard account you
> can temporarily set the standard account as an administrator, then run the
> program and let it update whatever settings it needs. Once this is done
> switch the account back to a standard account. This will get most programs
> running. Those that don't complain to the developer. It's sloppy
> programming on their part that is the problem, not XP itself. If programs
> are written properly they need administrator status for installation only.
>
> --
> Kerry
> MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
> www.vistahelp.ca
>
>
>
> GSD wrote:
>> I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and
>> am trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things
>> particularly from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my
>> supplier with myself as the one Admin User .



Thanks for that Kerry , I find your comments very interesting .
What you are saying I guess is that Win 98 was not very secure but I managed
to survive it .
You are the second person to suggest creating a second Administrator account
.. Could you clarify the reason for this .

GSD

"Bill" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:LH79h.2224$(E-Mail Removed)...
> GSD
>
> From the sound of things you describe, it would seem that not all the
> concepts of Windows multiple users has become clear to you yet.
>
> First, don't give up!!!
>
> Just to be clear, each user has their own desktop. So, any time you have
> a multiple user machine, each user would set up their desktops to suit
> themselves. You might find it easier to become accustom to XP if you
> switch your desktop to "Windows Classic", (right-click the background
> portion of your desktop and choose the "Desktop" tab.... you'll see what
> I mean there.).
>
> Accounts (that's what users are called) with administrator authority and
> those without have equal access to programs and data. However, there
> are programs that require administrator authority to be executed. For
> example, Windows Installer requires administrator authority. You should
> not have any trouble running application programs, such as Word,
> Outlook Express or Internet Explorer. If you're having difficulties there,
> it's not due to the authority level of the user account.
>
> Your administrator account should have a password, but there's no
> reason the general user, being yourself, would require one. You must
> remember that any tasks that you run as "Scheduled Tasks" would
> necessarily run under the authority of the administrator account, as such
> tasks MUST include the authoritative password, for example: Tasks like
> automatic LiveUpdate for Norton Antivirus, backup jobs and the like.
>
> I'll stop at this point and await a reply, lest I go on and on when what
> I've already offered gave rise to more questions than I already might
> have answered.
>
> Bill
> California - USA
>
>
>
>
> "GSD" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>>I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years and am
>>trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things particularly
>>from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my supplier with myself
>>as the one Admin User .
>> However, as I have read more I have seen advice to the effect that even
>> as a stand alone ,single user I should use a Limited User Account for
>> everyday use , particularly Internet which I do use a lot.
>> To try this out I have now set up a new Limited User Account but I find
>> it very impractical for a retired person like myself who spends quite a
>> bit of time using the computer for a variety of things .
>> As I should have expected I guess ,there are a number of programs that do
>> not seem to work or even do not appear on the Desktop when I switch to
>> the Limited User . The Microsoft Works Suite and Word keep ask me
>> Register the Software which I already have when installed , the Quicken
>> finance program tells me I have a corrupted Licence so I have to switch
>> back to use that . I now realize too that My CA Antivirus cannot Update
>> from the Limited User Account .
>> If I were to operate from this account most of the time I also need to
>> set up OE again for mail and newsgroups .
>>
Thank you Bill I am really getting some useful information resulting from my
query
You are right I am still learning about the different user accounts and
their capabilities .
I think the user accounts would be fine when used for their main purpose
that is to allow different users in the house to have their own set up .
But as a single user I really want the same set up as when I am in the Admin
Account that is already set up, if I am going to make the limited user mode
my main desktop ,otherwise it is not great value to me .
You say that the limited accounts have equal access to data but as I see it
when I am in the limited mode I cannot access the current content of My
Documents . I believe there is a way round this by putting them into shared
but again this seems a lot of messing and cluttering ,when it is just me
wanting to use them.
Outlook Express works of course but has to be set up again for mail and
resubscribe to all the same newsgroups etc. as I have under Admin as I like
to monitor these things as I work on other things . All my email message
archives are in OE on the Admin set up . I get a lot of mail from Genealogy
Lists and from family overseas and I find now if I use the Limited User
account I have to send an email to myself and open it the Admin account to
store in its correct folder . Otherwise I will have messages in 2 different
places. That's as I see it anyway. I know I can just keep swithing back and
forth but not keen on that idea .
The fact that the anti Virus does not update [normally 3 times] per day if I
spend most time in Limited mode is a worry too.

In regard to the other points you raise I have not put any password on my
Admin Account ,with just myself I could see no reason but maybe there is . I
have thought about running the Classic style but resisted so I could become
familiar with the newer XP version .

I know it seems like a lot of whinging on my part but not really just
pointing out as I see it a lot shortcomings for me to use the Limited User
account in my position . As I see it using just the Admin Account as I have
started off doing places me in the same position as I was using Win 98 all
that time with which I was comfortable . However I am listening to everyone
and learning so as I can make a judgement and maybe be convinced otherwise .

GSD

GSD wrote:
> "Kerry Brown" <(E-Mail Removed)*a*m> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> Running as a limited user is far more secure than running as an
>> administrator. Most other modern OS' are normally run as a standard
>> or limited user. This is the main reason they are more secure than
>> Windows XP. Unfortunately with XP this is almost impossible for most
>> people. It requires a high level of skill to set things up so this
>> will work. It's hard to know where to place the blame for this. I
>> believe it's a combination of things. Many programmers started
>> programming in DOS based versions of Windows where all users were
>> equal and could do anything. They never learned how to program for
>> security because there was no security in the OS. Microsoft never
>> really encouraged programmers to write programs that would work when
>> run as a standard user. Indeed as you have noticed many Microsoft
>> programs don't work unless the user is an administrator. Microsoft
>> has seen the light with Vista and is starting to enforce better
>> programming. With XP you are probably stuck running as an administrator.
>> Make
>> sure you have antivirus, antispyware, and firewall programs running.
>>
>> If you do want to run as a standard user then you will have to keep
>> switching the account back and forth between standard and
>> administrator. Create a second administrator account. Use this
>> account for installing new programs and maintenance tasks. If you
>> install a program with the administrator account and then have
>> problems with the standard account you can temporarily set the
>> standard account as an administrator, then run the program and let
>> it update whatever settings it needs. Once this is done switch the
>> account back to a standard account. This will get most programs
>> running. Those that don't complain to the developer. It's sloppy
>> programming on their part that is the problem, not XP itself. If
>> programs are written properly they need administrator status for
>> installation only. --
>> Kerry
>> MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
>> www.vistahelp.ca
>>
>>
>>
>> GSD wrote:
>>> I am a late convert to XP after using Win 98 for the last 7 years
>>> and am trying to come to terms with the User Account side of things
>>> particularly from the security aspect .My new PC was set up by my
>>> supplier with myself as the one Admin User .
>
>
>
> Thanks for that Kerry , I find your comments very interesting .
> What you are saying I guess is that Win 98 was not very secure but I
> managed to survive it .
> You are the second person to suggest creating a second Administrator
> account . Could you clarify the reason for this .
>
> GSD

In some ways Windows 98 was more secure from Internet worms and hacking but
less secure from viruses and trojans.

I was talking more about security for multiple users. An OS has several
users besides the user running programs. There is a system account and a
network account which OS uses. There may be other accounts for backups and
other things. When you run as a standard user processes you run cannot
affect the other accounts and their processes giving the OS protection from
rogue processes. When you run as an administrator this protection is gone.
Rogue processes can crash, alter, or corrupt any other processes so malware
has an easy time of it. That's a very simple version of why running as a
standard user is more secure.

I was suggesting a second administrator user in the context of two users,
one standard for everyday use, and one administrator for administrator use.
It is best to have two administrator accounts, but you already have this.
The administrator account and your account which is a member of the
administrators group. You don't normally see the administrator account but
by default there is a special account called "administrator". The reason for
two administrator accounts is in case one gets corrupted you can still
logon.

--
Kerry
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User
www.vistahelp.ca