I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it will
play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know is
that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the hard
way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any unused
masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.

I had made a file with about 8 multiple masters, and I built several slides
using 2 of the 8 masters.
I went to a meeting with a co-worker and we used her laptop (version 2000)
since the show had no 2002 animations and 2000 will play multiple masters.
Just before the meeting, she deleted a slide and saved. At the last minute
our boss asked us to make a slide using one of the other multiple masters.
Knowing that can't be done on version 2000, I borrowed a laptop with 2002
for a quick edit. To my horror, I saw that all the other masters were wiped
out by version 2000. Great.

Another co-worker sent his file to a user with version 2000 for editing and
when he got it back, he found his multiple masters also were eliminated by
version 2000.

I'm sure there's no workarounds except copy the masters back in from another
file, but when you have reps in the field who are being paid for skills
other than authoring slide show software, it's frustrating to a make them
understand.

So, I'd just like to know if we are seeing this correctly? Has anyone else
ran into it or can someone verify this? I couldn't find anything archived
about it. -TIA

Yes, this quite accurate. I've experienced this.


--
Regards,
Shyam Pillai

Handout Wizard: http://skp.mvps.org/how


"Lil Work" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:iMLye.47605$(E-Mail Removed)...
>I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it will
> play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know is
> that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the hard
> way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any
> unused
> masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.
>
> I had made a file with about 8 multiple masters, and I built several
> slides
> using 2 of the 8 masters.
> I went to a meeting with a co-worker and we used her laptop (version 2000)
> since the show had no 2002 animations and 2000 will play multiple masters.
> Just before the meeting, she deleted a slide and saved. At the last minute
> our boss asked us to make a slide using one of the other multiple masters.
> Knowing that can't be done on version 2000, I borrowed a laptop with 2002
> for a quick edit. To my horror, I saw that all the other masters were
> wiped
> out by version 2000. Great.
>
> Another co-worker sent his file to a user with version 2000 for editing
> and
> when he got it back, he found his multiple masters also were eliminated by
> version 2000.
>
> I'm sure there's no workarounds except copy the masters back in from
> another
> file, but when you have reps in the field who are being paid for skills
> other than authoring slide show software, it's frustrating to a make them
> understand.
>
> So, I'd just like to know if we are seeing this correctly? Has anyone else
> ran into it or can someone verify this? I couldn't find anything archived
> about it. -TIA
>
>
>
>
>

Versions of PowerPoint are not "downward" compatible. PowerPoint 2000 has the
limited multiple master capability that you've noted because Microsoft was
getting ready for multiple masters as far back as PowerPoint 97. While both
version will open and show a presentation that uses them, you cannot use any
editing function and expect the multiple masters to be retained when the file is
re-saved.

If you need to regularly prepare presentations that might be edited and played
in older versions of PowerPoint, it is best to first go to Tools > Options >
Edit and disable the three items listed at the bottom of the dialog window,
including Multiple Masters. This way users with older versions of PowerPoint
are less likely to alter your presentation in a way you don't want.
--

Sonia Coleman
Microsoft PowerPoint MVP Team
Autorun Software, Templates and Tutorials
http://www.soniacoleman.com

"Lil Work" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:iMLye.47605$(E-Mail Removed)...
>I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it will
> play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know is
> that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the hard
> way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any unused
> masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.
>
> I had made a file with about 8 multiple masters, and I built several slides
> using 2 of the 8 masters.
> I went to a meeting with a co-worker and we used her laptop (version 2000)
> since the show had no 2002 animations and 2000 will play multiple masters.
> Just before the meeting, she deleted a slide and saved. At the last minute
> our boss asked us to make a slide using one of the other multiple masters.
> Knowing that can't be done on version 2000, I borrowed a laptop with 2002
> for a quick edit. To my horror, I saw that all the other masters were wiped
> out by version 2000. Great.
>
> Another co-worker sent his file to a user with version 2000 for editing and
> when he got it back, he found his multiple masters also were eliminated by
> version 2000.
>
> I'm sure there's no workarounds except copy the masters back in from another
> file, but when you have reps in the field who are being paid for skills
> other than authoring slide show software, it's frustrating to a make them
> understand.
>
> So, I'd just like to know if we are seeing this correctly? Has anyone else
> ran into it or can someone verify this? I couldn't find anything archived
> about it. -TIA
>
>
>
>
>

In article <iMLye.47605$(E-Mail Removed)>, Lil Work wrote:
> I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it will
> play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know is
> that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the hard
> way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any unused
> masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.

Fair warning: PowerPoint 2002/2003 will do the same thing (remove a master
when the last slide using it gets deleted).

The big difference is that in PPT2002/2003 you can rightclick a master and
choose Preserve to prevent its being deleted even if no slides use it.

But even if you do that, the master gets deleted in 2000 when you delete the
last slide that uses it.

Consider adding hidden slides, one that uses each master, perhaps. And put a
great big honking "DO NOT DELETE THIS SLIDE OR YOU'LL DESTROY THE PRESENTATION"
on each hidden slides.

-----------------------------------------
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================

"Steve Rindsberg" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> In article <iMLye.47605$(E-Mail Removed)>, Lil Work wrote:
>> I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it will
>> play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know is
>> that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the
>> hard
>> way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any
>> unused
>> masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.

> Consider adding hidden slides, one that uses each master, perhaps. And
> put a
> great big honking "DO NOT DELETE THIS SLIDE OR YOU'LL DESTROY THE
> PRESENTATION"
> on each hidden slides.

Thanks to everyone for their feedback. I feel better just knowing I'm not
alone on this issue.

Because these multiple masters are important and because these files pass
from 2000 users to 2002+ users, I may have to write a routine that, in
version 2002, inventories the masters and, if any are missing it rebuilds
them. I can't wait to see what challenges I run into creating that puppy.

In article <yEYye.46557$(E-Mail Removed)>, Lil Work wrote:
> "Steve Rindsberg" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > In article <iMLye.47605$(E-Mail Removed)>, Lil Work wrote:
> >> I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it will
> >> play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know is
> >> that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the
> >> hard
> >> way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any
> >> unused
> >> masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.
>
> > Consider adding hidden slides, one that uses each master, perhaps. And
> > put a
> > great big honking "DO NOT DELETE THIS SLIDE OR YOU'LL DESTROY THE
> > PRESENTATION"
> > on each hidden slides.
>
> Thanks to everyone for their feedback. I feel better just knowing I'm not
> alone on this issue.
>
> Because these multiple masters are important and because these files pass
> from 2000 users to 2002+ users, I may have to write a routine that, in
> version 2002, inventories the masters and, if any are missing it rebuilds
> them. I can't wait to see what challenges I run into creating that puppy.
>

What happens if you simply reapply the master in PPT 2002 or higher?
I don't recall whether a master that's "preserved" will be saved in a template
file or not ... it should be I'd think.

-----------------------------------------
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================

"Steve Rindsberg" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> In article <yEYye.46557$(E-Mail Removed)>, Lil Work wrote:
>> "Steve Rindsberg" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> > In article <iMLye.47605$(E-Mail Removed)>, Lil Work
>> > wrote:
>> >> I know version 2000 didn't have multiple masters, and I also know it
>> >> will
>> >> play them if they exist from being created in 2002. What I didn't know
>> >> is
>> >> that it would destroy them given the right condition. I found out the
>> >> hard
>> >> way that multiple masters in a file used on version 2000 removes any
>> >> unused
>> >> masters as soon as the user deletes a slide.
>>
>> > Consider adding hidden slides, one that uses each master, perhaps. And
>> > put a
>> > great big honking "DO NOT DELETE THIS SLIDE OR YOU'LL DESTROY THE
>> > PRESENTATION"
>> > on each hidden slides.
>>
>> Thanks to everyone for their feedback. I feel better just knowing I'm not
>> alone on this issue.
>>
>> Because these multiple masters are important and because these files pass
>> from 2000 users to 2002+ users, I may have to write a routine that, in
>> version 2002, inventories the masters and, if any are missing it rebuilds
>> them. I can't wait to see what challenges I run into creating that puppy.
>>
>
> What happens if you simply reapply the master in PPT 2002 or higher?
> I don't recall whether a master that's "preserved" will be saved in a
> template
> file or not ... it should be I'd think.

I don't think I can do that, because, at that point, the other masters would
not exist in the file anymore. I might get it back and only one master
remains intact, with masters 2-15 gone. At that point, I try to apply
design(5) and get the obvious error.

I can easily copy the original collection of masters back into the file from
a good file. But I can't see my reps in the field doing that. I get a
chuckle just imagining it. <lmao> Oh, I needed that laugh.

Early in the year, I tried having "master example" slides in the file with
blurbs on them such as you suggested, "DO NOT DELETE. This slide is hidden
and will not impede your presentation, however do NOT delete this slide." It
produced a lot of calls that started with, "Lil, uh, sorry, but I did
exactly what it said not to do... so, uh, now, uh, ..." <sigh>

What would be awesome is if I could make a slide "VBA hidden" like we make
"VBA hidden" worksheets in Excel. The user cannot see them and they can't
unhide them - short of using VBA. With that, I could "preserve" masters even
in 2000. That'd be great! How sweet! <"Lil, wake up, honey, you're having a
dream again."> Oh, sorry, I'm back now.

> > What happens if you simply reapply the master in PPT 2002 or higher?
> > I don't recall whether a master that's "preserved" will be saved in a
> > template
> > file or not ... it should be I'd think.
>
> I don't think I can do that, because, at that point, the other masters would
> not exist in the file anymore. I might get it back and only one master
> remains intact, with masters 2-15 gone. At that point, I try to apply
> design(5) and get the obvious error.

I'd give it a try just the same AFTER you've re-saved the template with each
Master set to PRESERVE. In theory ... yeah, yeah, I know about theories and
"best laid plans" and assuming and all that stuff <g> ... but in theory, that
should do it.

> Early in the year, I tried having "master example" slides in the file with
> blurbs on them such as you suggested, "DO NOT DELETE. This slide is hidden
> and will not impede your presentation, however do NOT delete this slide." It
> produced a lot of calls that started with, "Lil, uh, sorry, but I did
> exactly what it said not to do... so, uh, now, uh, ..." <sigh>

And the head office hasn't given you Red Queen powers? OFF WITH HIS HEAD!!
How do they expect you to do your job properly w/o that?

> What would be awesome is if I could make a slide "VBA hidden" like we make
> "VBA hidden" worksheets in Excel. The user cannot see them and they can't
> unhide them - short of using VBA. With that, I could "preserve" masters even
> in 2000. That'd be great! How sweet! <"Lil, wake up, honey, you're having a
> dream again."> Oh, sorry, I'm back now.

Nice nap? ;-)

-----------------------------------------
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================

"Steve Rindsberg" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> > What happens if you simply reapply the master in PPT 2002 or higher?
>> > I don't recall whether a master that's "preserved" will be saved in a
>> > template
>> > file or not ... it should be I'd think.

>> I don't think I can do that, because, at that point, the other masters
>> would
>> not exist in the file anymore. I might get it back and only one master
>> remains intact, with masters 2-15 gone. At that point, I try to apply
>> design(5) and get the obvious error.

> I'd give it a try just the same AFTER you've re-saved the template with
> each
> Master set to PRESERVE. In theory ... yeah, yeah, I know about theories
> and
> "best laid plans" and assuming and all that stuff <g> ... but in theory,
> that
> should do it.

It errors out. 5 is not in the range of 1. In other words, once gone, it has
no memory of ever having more than one master.

>> Early in the year, I tried having "master example" slides in the file
>> with
>> blurbs on them such as you suggested, "DO NOT DELETE. This slide is
>> hidden
>> and will not impede your presentation, however do NOT delete this slide."
>> It
>> produced a lot of calls that started with, "Lil, uh, sorry, but I did
>> exactly what it said not to do... so, uh, now, uh, ..." <sigh>

> And the head office hasn't given you Red Queen powers? OFF WITH HIS
> HEAD!!
> How do they expect you to do your job properly w/o that?

And you know, they should because I look a lot like her.

>> What would be awesome is if I could make a slide "VBA hidden" like we
>> make
>> "VBA hidden" worksheets in Excel. The user cannot see them and they can't
>> unhide them - short of using VBA. With that, I could "preserve" masters
>> even
>> in 2000. That'd be great! How sweet! <"Lil, wake up, honey, you're having
>> a
>> dream again."> Oh, sorry, I'm back now.

> Nice nap? ;-)

Oh, yes. Anytime I envision PowerPoint having VBA equal to Excel, it's a
nice nap. ;-)

"Lil Work" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Kulze.59362$(E-Mail Removed)...
> > And the head office hasn't given you Red Queen powers? OFF WITH HIS
> > HEAD!!
> > How do they expect you to do your job properly w/o that?
>
> And you know, they should because I look a lot like her.

LOL!