Hi All

I recently have been having trouble with Winbond Hardware doctor. I am
running Athlon XP 2800+ Lanparty MB with Windows XP Pro.My Winbond keeps
setting off an alarm saying that the minimum voltage level has been met. The
volts section starts at +12V. The high level indicator is set for 13.00 and
the low kevel indicator is set for 11.00. My system seems to be jumping below
this level constantly and the motherboard alarm briefly sounds. Would anyone
know possible causes of this. Could it be something to do with my PSU. It is
a 12V 360 Watt chieftec. Currently, and since day 1 I have a DVD Writer - CD
Writer, Additional USB front ports, Creative sound system with creative sound
card, Wireless access point, 256mb graphics card, 512mb DDR.

Any help on this is much appreciated.

IF the other voltages like 3.3, 5V, -12V are jumping around the same time,
then your PSU is on the way out.

Check if you get the same voltage errors in your BIOS.

If it's just the +12V supply going down possible to be:

1. HDD on the way out, the motor is stalling, causing a larger demand on the
PSU.
2. Other peripheral, floppy, CD. keyboard, mouse etc is starting to fault.
Unplug each one and see if that cures the problem. Remove the power from the
PC before you do, k? don't just switch the PC off, remove the power cable
right out then remove each device and check the voltages again.
3. Poor connectors - Check that all 4 pins are mated properly. The pins can
sometimes come away even though the rest of the connectors are fine.
4. Just too much load - How many HDD's do you have?
5. Motherboard mounting screws, perhaps one is shorting out to the chassis
and shouldn't. Or one is loose.


"Ted" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:4E325B3B-1249-4A4A-BEAF-(E-Mail Removed)...
> Hi All
>
> I recently have been having trouble with Winbond Hardware doctor. I am
> running Athlon XP 2800+ Lanparty MB with Windows XP Pro.My Winbond keeps
> setting off an alarm saying that the minimum voltage level has been met.
The
> volts section starts at +12V. The high level indicator is set for 13.00
and
> the low kevel indicator is set for 11.00. My system seems to be jumping
below
> this level constantly and the motherboard alarm briefly sounds. Would
anyone
> know possible causes of this. Could it be something to do with my PSU. It
is
> a 12V 360 Watt chieftec. Currently, and since day 1 I have a DVD Writer -
CD
> Writer, Additional USB front ports, Creative sound system with creative
sound
> card, Wireless access point, 256mb graphics card, 512mb DDR.
>
> Any help on this is much appreciated.
>
>

Voltages measured by BIOS are not accurate. Either confirm
those voltage readings with a 3.5 digit multimeter, OR
calibrate the BIOS meter with a 3.5 digit meter.

The power supply should be more than sufficient. But the
devil is in the details. A power supply with more than enough
overall wattage may provide insufficient current on one
voltage output. Again, this is why multimeter is required.

Ted wrote:
> I recently have been having trouble with Winbond Hardware doctor. I am
> running Athlon XP 2800+ Lanparty MB with Windows XP Pro.My Winbond keeps
> setting off an alarm saying that the minimum voltage level has been met.
> The volts section starts at +12V. The high level indicator is set for
> 13.00 and the low kevel indicator is set for 11.00. My system seems to
> be jumping below this level constantly and the motherboard alarm briefly
> sounds. Would anyone know possible causes of this. Could it be something
> to do with my PSU. It is a 12V 360 Watt chieftec. Currently, and since
> day 1 I have a DVD Writer - CD Writer, Additional USB front ports,
> Creative sound system with creative sound card, Wireless access point,
> 256mb graphics card, 512mb DDR.
>
> Any help on this is much appreciated.

How far out is the BIOS reading from the real reading?
50% + ? Please advise.

"w_tom" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Voltages measured by BIOS are not accurate. Either confirm
> those voltage readings with a 3.5 digit multimeter, OR
> calibrate the BIOS meter with a 3.5 digit meter.
>
> The power supply should be more than sufficient. But the
> devil is in the details. A power supply with more than enough
> overall wattage may provide insufficient current on one
> voltage output. Again, this is why multimeter is required.
>

Hi Guys

Thanks for getting back to me. I don't have a metre to measure but I did try
and remove the other devices to see the difference, but there was none. The
HDD and CD + DVD drive have been replaced within the last 2 weeks. This was
happening before then. The readings in the BIOS are simalar to the Hadware
Doctor. I currently only have 1 HDD attached which is a 160gb SATA 8MB cache,
I also would like to attach another in the future but am i right in saying
thats out of the question?? or should I look at a new PSU. They readings are
as follows.

LL = Low Limit - HL= High Limit
+3.3V..... LL3.00 - HL3.50. This reading jumps between 3.34 & 3.36

+5V .....LL4.50 - HL 5.50. Steady @ 5.11

+12V.....LL11.00 - HL 13.00. This jumps between 11.04 & 10.50, quiet a
difference and not meeting the 12V.

-12V.....LL -14.00 - HL -11.0. This jumps between -11.78 & -11.86

again thanks for your help

Ted





"Gary" wrote:

> How far out is the BIOS reading from the real reading?
> 50% + ? Please advise.
>
> "w_tom" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > Voltages measured by BIOS are not accurate. Either confirm
> > those voltage readings with a 3.5 digit multimeter, OR
> > calibrate the BIOS meter with a 3.5 digit meter.
> >
> > The power supply should be more than sufficient. But the
> > devil is in the details. A power supply with more than enough
> > overall wattage may provide insufficient current on one
> > voltage output. Again, this is why multimeter is required.
> >
>
>
>

Obtain that meter even in a screw driver store. Meter is as
essential as a screw driver. So ubiquitous as to be sold even
in Home Depot, Sears, and Lowes. So inexpensive that it is
now a standard tool.

BIOS measurement circuits can vary significantly. How
accurate are they? An honest computer provider or motherboard
manufactuer provides that numerical specification. However a
'motherboard voltmeter' must be accurate enough duplicate the
accuracy of a 3.5 digit multimeter. See spec limits in
previous posts. Voltages must reside in the upper 3/4s of
those limits. Anything else can mean strange and intermittent
failures. If the meter is less accurate, then the voltage
readings must lie even further inside those limits.

Limits provided below are too wide. For example, upper
limit is 12.6. Below, that same limit is 13 volts - too
high. A voltage below 4.85 is too low. And yet limits below
are 4.5 - too low.

Don't screw around. Don't waste good money and time by
shotgunning - scam that an auto mechanic does when he does
not have basic knowledge. Get the meter to confirm an
essential component - the PSU. Then move on to other 'usual'
suspects using standard information sources such as system
(event) log, Device Manager, and comprehensive diagnostics
provided free by any reponsible computer manufacturer.

Ted wrote:
> Hi Guys
> Thanks for getting back to me. I don't have a metre to measure but
> I did try and remove the other devices to see the difference, but
> there was none. The HDD and CD + DVD drive have been replaced within
> the last 2 weeks. This was happening before then. The readings in
> the BIOS are simalar to the Hadware Doctor. I currently only have 1
> HDD attached which is a 160gb SATA 8MB cache, I also would like to
> attach another in the future but am i right in saying thats out of
> the question?? or should I look at a new PSU. They readings are
> as follows.
>
> LL = Low Limit - HL= High Limit
> +3.3V..... LL3.00 - HL3.50. This reading jumps between 3.34 & 3.36
>
> +5V .....LL4.50 - HL 5.50. Steady @ 5.11
>
> +12V.....LL11.00 - HL 13.00. This jumps between 11.04 & 10.50, quiet a
> difference and not meeting the 12V.
>
> -12V.....LL -14.00 - HL -11.0. This jumps between -11.78 & -11.86
>
> again thanks for your help
>
> Ted
>
> "Gary" wrote:
>
>> How far out is the BIOS reading from the real reading?
>> 50% + ? Please advise.

Hi,

I have a friend that has let me borrow a PSU, when I check Winbond hardware
Doctor with the new PSU, instead of the alarm sounding now and then, it's on
constant.

Does that make any more sense? Im so confused???

"w_tom" wrote:

> Obtain that meter even in a screw driver store. Meter is as
> essential as a screw driver. So ubiquitous as to be sold even
> in Home Depot, Sears, and Lowes. So inexpensive that it is
> now a standard tool.
>
> BIOS measurement circuits can vary significantly. How
> accurate are they? An honest computer provider or motherboard
> manufactuer provides that numerical specification. However a
> 'motherboard voltmeter' must be accurate enough duplicate the
> accuracy of a 3.5 digit multimeter. See spec limits in
> previous posts. Voltages must reside in the upper 3/4s of
> those limits. Anything else can mean strange and intermittent
> failures. If the meter is less accurate, then the voltage
> readings must lie even further inside those limits.
>
> Limits provided below are too wide. For example, upper
> limit is 12.6. Below, that same limit is 13 volts - too
> high. A voltage below 4.85 is too low. And yet limits below
> are 4.5 - too low.
>
> Don't screw around. Don't waste good money and time by
> shotgunning - scam that an auto mechanic does when he does
> not have basic knowledge. Get the meter to confirm an
> essential component - the PSU. Then move on to other 'usual'
> suspects using standard information sources such as system
> (event) log, Device Manager, and comprehensive diagnostics
> provided free by any reponsible computer manufacturer.
>
> Ted wrote:
> > Hi Guys
> > Thanks for getting back to me. I don't have a metre to measure but
> > I did try and remove the other devices to see the difference, but
> > there was none. The HDD and CD + DVD drive have been replaced within
> > the last 2 weeks. This was happening before then. The readings in
> > the BIOS are simalar to the Hadware Doctor. I currently only have 1
> > HDD attached which is a 160gb SATA 8MB cache, I also would like to
> > attach another in the future but am i right in saying thats out of
> > the question?? or should I look at a new PSU. They readings are
> > as follows.
> >
> > LL = Low Limit - HL= High Limit
> > +3.3V..... LL3.00 - HL3.50. This reading jumps between 3.34 & 3.36
> >
> > +5V .....LL4.50 - HL 5.50. Steady @ 5.11
> >
> > +12V.....LL11.00 - HL 13.00. This jumps between 11.04 & 10.50, quiet a
> > difference and not meeting the 12V.
> >
> > -12V.....LL -14.00 - HL -11.0. This jumps between -11.78 & -11.86
> >
> > again thanks for your help
> >
> > Ted
> >
> > "Gary" wrote:
> >
> >> How far out is the BIOS reading from the real reading?
> >> 50% + ? Please advise.
>

That 'swap PSU' test only implies that something else is
wrong. However assumed (and not stated): is the new PSU
exactly same? In the meantime, numbers are necessary to
provide useful assistance. Considering all the work and all
the added risk to both your system and his PSU, it makes more
sense (and saves significant time) to first take those voltage
readings.

Those upper and lower limits are significantly outside of
acceptable voltages. If you are getting alarms with limits
that far too wide, then surprising the computer is still
working. Winbond voltage readings are only as accurate as
hardware on motherboard. Use the meter so we know what your
system is really doing. Doing anything else will only make
you and us more confused. Those multimeter numbers are
essential. Without them, your responses will only be wild
speculation.

BTW what did those other information sources (Device
Manager, system log, etc) report? Worry more about getting
every piece of information requested. Being confused should
have come much later.

Ted wrote:
> I have a friend that has let me borrow a PSU, when I check Winbond
> hardware Doctor with the new PSU, instead of the alarm sounding now
> and then, it's on constant.
>
> Does that make any more sense? Im so confused???
>
> "w_tom" wrote:
>> Obtain that meter even in a screw driver store. Meter is as
>> essential as a screw driver. So ubiquitous as to be sold even
>> in Home Depot, Sears, and Lowes. So inexpensive that it is
>> now a standard tool.
>>
>> BIOS measurement circuits can vary significantly. How
>> accurate are they? An honest computer provider or motherboard
>> manufactuer provides that numerical specification. However a
>> 'motherboard voltmeter' must be accurate enough duplicate the
>> accuracy of a 3.5 digit multimeter. See spec limits in
>> previous posts. Voltages must reside in the upper 3/4s of
>> those limits. Anything else can mean strange and intermittent
>> failures. If the meter is less accurate, then the voltage
>> readings must lie even further inside those limits.
>>
>> Limits provided below are too wide. For example, upper
>> limit is 12.6. Below, that same limit is 13 volts - too
>> high. A voltage below 4.85 is too low. And yet limits below
>> are 4.5 - too low.
>>
>> Don't screw around. Don't waste good money and time by
>> shotgunning - scam that an auto mechanic does when he does
>> not have basic knowledge. Get the meter to confirm an
>> essential component - the PSU. Then move on to other 'usual'
>> suspects using standard information sources such as system
>> (event) log, Device Manager, and comprehensive diagnostics
>> provided free by any reponsible computer manufacturer.

No, the PSU is a 450 Watt, I know what you mean, I should be getting the
correct details instead of wild guessing. I will buy a metre on Saturday as I
work shifts. I am not sure how to use a metre or where I should be putting it
to test, sorry if I sound stupid!! But you've gotta start somewhere. Help
with this is much appreciated.

"w_tom" wrote:

> That 'swap PSU' test only implies that something else is
> wrong. However assumed (and not stated): is the new PSU
> exactly same? In the meantime, numbers are necessary to
> provide useful assistance. Considering all the work and all
> the added risk to both your system and his PSU, it makes more
> sense (and saves significant time) to first take those voltage
> readings.
>
> Those upper and lower limits are significantly outside of
> acceptable voltages. If you are getting alarms with limits
> that far too wide, then surprising the computer is still
> working. Winbond voltage readings are only as accurate as
> hardware on motherboard. Use the meter so we know what your
> system is really doing. Doing anything else will only make
> you and us more confused. Those multimeter numbers are
> essential. Without them, your responses will only be wild
> speculation.
>
> BTW what did those other information sources (Device
> Manager, system log, etc) report? Worry more about getting
> every piece of information requested. Being confused should
> have come much later.
>
> Ted wrote:
> > I have a friend that has let me borrow a PSU, when I check Winbond
> > hardware Doctor with the new PSU, instead of the alarm sounding now
> > and then, it's on constant.
> >
> > Does that make any more sense? Im so confused???
> >
> > "w_tom" wrote:
> >> Obtain that meter even in a screw driver store. Meter is as
> >> essential as a screw driver. So ubiquitous as to be sold even
> >> in Home Depot, Sears, and Lowes. So inexpensive that it is
> >> now a standard tool.
> >>
> >> BIOS measurement circuits can vary significantly. How
> >> accurate are they? An honest computer provider or motherboard
> >> manufactuer provides that numerical specification. However a
> >> 'motherboard voltmeter' must be accurate enough duplicate the
> >> accuracy of a 3.5 digit multimeter. See spec limits in
> >> previous posts. Voltages must reside in the upper 3/4s of
> >> those limits. Anything else can mean strange and intermittent
> >> failures. If the meter is less accurate, then the voltage
> >> readings must lie even further inside those limits.
> >>
> >> Limits provided below are too wide. For example, upper
> >> limit is 12.6. Below, that same limit is 13 volts - too
> >> high. A voltage below 4.85 is too low. And yet limits below
> >> are 4.5 - too low.
> >>
> >> Don't screw around. Don't waste good money and time by
> >> shotgunning - scam that an auto mechanic does when he does
> >> not have basic knowledge. Get the meter to confirm an
> >> essential component - the PSU. Then move on to other 'usual'
> >> suspects using standard information sources such as system
> >> (event) log, Device Manager, and comprehensive diagnostics
> >> provided free by any reponsible computer manufacturer.
>

Meter has two leads. All voltages are 'electrical pressure'
between two points. The previously posted procedures describe
measuring voltage between two colored wires. IOW black lead
touches PSU black wire (inside white nylon connector where it
connects to motherboard). Red wire touches PSU's red, yellow,
orange, green etc wires to measure voltage on that wire. Just
set voltmeter selector to DC volts, touch probes, and read
numbers on meter. Record voltage for each colored wire. Then
compare to voltages on chart. 3.3, 5, and 12 volt wires
should read in upper 3/4s of limits.

Sidebar: Many 450 watt power supplies do not even output
their rated power. Just another problem with so many power
supplies dumped into America that don't even meet Intel
specs. This web site demonstrates a problem too common with
imported power supplies:
http://www6.tomshardware.com/howto/0...021/index.html

http://www6.tomshardware.com/howto/0...pplies-15.html
> Time and time again, our lab measurements were unable to verify
> the output figures represented on the model identification
> sticker.


Ted wrote:
> No, the PSU is a 450 Watt, I know what you mean, I should be getting
> the correct details instead of wild guessing. I will buy a metre on
> Saturday as I work shifts. I am not sure how to use a metre or where
> I should be putting it to test, sorry if I sound stupid!! But you've
> gotta start somewhere. Help with this is much appreciated.
>
> "w_tom" wrote:
>
> > That 'swap PSU' test only implies that something else is
> > wrong. However assumed (and not stated): is the new PSU
> > exactly same? In the meantime, numbers are necessary to
> > provide useful assistance. Considering all the work and all
> > the added risk to both your system and his PSU, it makes more
> > sense (and saves significant time) to first take those voltage
> > readings.
> >
> > Those upper and lower limits are significantly outside of
> > acceptable voltages. If you are getting alarms with limits
> > that far too wide, then surprising the computer is still
> > working. Winbond voltage readings are only as accurate as
> > hardware on motherboard. Use the meter so we know what your
> > system is really doing. Doing anything else will only make
> > you and us more confused. Those multimeter numbers are
> > essential. Without them, your responses will only be wild
> > speculation.
> >
> > BTW what did those other information sources (Device
> > Manager, system log, etc) report? Worry more about getting
> > every piece of information requested. Being confused should
> > have come much later.
> >
> > Ted wrote:
> > > I have a friend that has let me borrow a PSU, when I check Winbond
> > > hardware Doctor with the new PSU, instead of the alarm sounding now
> > > and then, it's on constant.
> > >
> > > Does that make any more sense? Im so confused???
> > >
> > > "w_tom" wrote:
> > >> Obtain that meter even in a screw driver store. Meter is as
> > >> essential as a screw driver. So ubiquitous as to be sold even
> > >> in Home Depot, Sears, and Lowes. So inexpensive that it is
> > >> now a standard tool.
> > >>
> > >> BIOS measurement circuits can vary significantly. How
> > >> accurate are they? An honest computer provider or motherboard
> > >> manufactuer provides that numerical specification. However a
> > >> 'motherboard voltmeter' must be accurate enough duplicate the
> > >> accuracy of a 3.5 digit multimeter. See spec limits in
> > >> previous posts. Voltages must reside in the upper 3/4s of
> > >> those limits. Anything else can mean strange and intermittent
> > >> failures. If the meter is less accurate, then the voltage
> > >> readings must lie even further inside those limits.
> > >>
> > >> Limits provided below are too wide. For example, upper
> > >> limit is 12.6. Below, that same limit is 13 volts - too
> > >> high. A voltage below 4.85 is too low. And yet limits below
> > >> are 4.5 - too low.
> > >>
> > >> Don't screw around. Don't waste good money and time by
> > >> shotgunning - scam that an auto mechanic does when he does
> > >> not have basic knowledge. Get the meter to confirm an
> > >> essential component - the PSU. Then move on to other 'usual'
> > >> suspects using standard information sources such as system
> > >> (event) log, Device Manager, and comprehensive diagnostics
> > >> provided free by any reponsible computer manufacturer.
> >